To not let my 12 year old hand around in the town centre

[Twooclockrock]

12 year old son is in a huge mood as we have said no to letting him go and hang around in the town centre with friends.
A teen family member was stabbed two weeks ago nearby but not in the town centre (non life threatening) , his cousin was mugged in the town centre not long ago, and a friends son age 17 was approached by a group of kids who produced a knife and told him to get out of their area only three weeks ago.
Plus we have had several letters home from school saying to stay out of the highstreets due to the school wars thing going on this past week.
London suburbs, relatively nice area but bordered by some not so nice areas and the town centre is a known hang out for gangs.
It feels so restricting and mean to say no, but I am concerned for his safety and think it's not worth it.
Do you let your tween/tern hang out in the toen centre? Ie walk around the shops, grab some food etc? It used to be the main event of a saturday for me when I was his age.

In the circumstances you really need to offer him absorbing and stimulating alternative ways to spend the time.

Can you afford to do that? Or to spend time finding low cost or free opportunities for him to engage in? Let’s not forget that while some 12 year olds are hanging round unsafe shopping centres, others are travelling hours to a junior conservatoire, or taking part in drama classes, or planting trees, or attending science workshops - not to speak of all the sports / training happening everywhere, every day.

(The solution we found to this prospective issue involved scholarships and bursaries and a transformative widening of the child’s horizons - but I realise not everyone will want to take that route.)

YANBU. I don't let my teenagers hang out in town and I'm very open about why. I used to go shopping with my friends nearly every weekend at that age, but back then no one was getting stabbed outside M&S.

Their friends are always welcome at our house and they have plenty to do at the weekend/other places to meet friends.

Yes, I agree. He does do lots of clubs and sports but his friends seem to go out on saturday afternoons and he has been asking for weeks and seems upset and apparently he is the only one not allowed! (I doubt this). He is youngest in year so in year 8.
I have always said he can go places if he has a destination like the cinema, but no 'hanging around', but wasnt sure if I was being too restrictive.

You sort of lost yourself there.

I was all set to say YANBU to not let him hang around the town centre.

But then you said to go to the shops and to get food etc.

One is completely different to the other.

I think on a Saturday afternoon, for shops and a Maccys or similar, then that is absolutely fine. Make sure he knows not to have his phone out in the open and is sensible about having wallets etc in pockets, leaving bags on backs of chairs etc and he should be fine.
We are also south London where stabbings are common etc, and mine did similar.

I mean food as part of the trip. ie hanging around and also grabbing some chips or a burger in the centre as part of wandering about the high street in and out of shops type thing.. although he is not allowed macdonalds anyway.
But as a teen we would go into the town centre, go to the food court in the shopping centre, wander up and down the high street, go to Benetton and the Factory shop and Body shop etc. Giggle at boys in their groups, maybe meet up with some others. I mean this kind of activity.

Can he invite his friends to hang around at yours? They need something to do and a place to be, but I wouldn’t let my son hang around in town in that situation either.

Of course, but I guess its when the others are going then he wants to go too. I get it and would like him to but I am concerned about safety.

In that case I'd let him go and give him a time to be back so he's not hanging around after the shopping and eating.

Not sure why he wouldn't be allowed a McDonald's if his friends are all having one, but I expect there'll be other fast food places to choose from.

YANBU and I wouldn't let such young kids just hang around either, but I would okay with them getting a milkshake or some food. That's different.

Teen and pre-teen muggings are an absolute epidemic in/around London. My older DS and his friends have all been mugged at least once, one was beaten up (aged 14) and another was slashed with a knife (thank god it only cut his t-shirt). I've never known things to be so bad or so dangerous for children and young people as they are right now. I would offer your pre-teen some other options, including hanging out at your house, if suitable, but I would also explain the risks to him and why your reasoning is as it is. We all have to be the bad guy sometimes to keep our kids safe. We've always told our kids that we don't care what decisions other parents are making and are not swayed by the 'but all my mates are doing it' argument.

If your child is at particular demographic risk, as our YP might have been, I can only sympathise. We moved heaven and earth (and frankly worked miracles) to … lessen the risks they might have been prey to.

I guess you could offer to take him and a few of his friends to a different shopping centre, far away in a different environment - maybe as part of a day out for some other purpose? But that’s obviously not something you can do every weekend.

Have you talked to him about exactly why all your parental instincts are screaming to keep him safe? Have you discussed, calmly, reading the newspaper reports online, the crimes you’ve spoken of here? He’s perfectly old enough to begin to grasp the situation (although 12 is, as I recall, a particularly difficult age, nothing like a biddable 10 year old). Ask him how you think you might find a satisfactory solution between you.

At what age do you think it would be acceptable OP? And why at that age and not now - are the risks any less?

And seriously - he's not allowed a McDonalds with his mates?! He will be a teenager very soon, he needs to learn skills to keep him safe as he gets older. He will be wanting to go further afield soon too.

Thats a great idea about taking them to another shopping centre for a hang about!

I got distracted by the idea that he isn't allowed McDonald's... what's that about? As then I think maybe you're generally quite restrictive.

I think the plan of going shopping and getting some food is a plan really. Though perhaps this specific area is problematic and you could encourage them to explore other neighbourhoods?

My 13 year old is autistic so not particularly sociable but she's gone into the city centre with friends to just wander around and get bubble tea or earrings or whatever.

my 9, nearly 10 year old has just started biking and walking into town but there’s no hanging round there, even though I would say it’s safe. Even when she’s 14-16 if there was ever any stabbing, I would ban her from going there! I agree with you op.

Unless you are leaving out that you live in Ciudad Juarez, it’s ludicrous not to allow a 12 year old to go to a town centre with friends.

In my view a lot of the current issues we’re seeing with mental health and lack of independence are actually caused by overprotective parenting like this, rather than social media.

Incidents like stabbing an are unfortunate but have always occurred. We can’t allow them to stop teens living their lives.

D’you think? I wasn’t sure whether to suggest it - for all sorts of reasons.

But, if you think it would work for you, it could be a whole thing. Maybe once a month (or two) you could drive / take the train and explore other parts of the country. I despise most shopping malls but the Westgate in Oxford is comparatively pretty, feels extremely safe, and has a fabulous top floor with great views and inviting restaurants. Plus the usual coffee shops, etc. Unbeatable combined with a visit to galleries and museums and a walk along the river. Bath is breathtaking; the shops very much secondary but it’s always seemed ‘safe’ to me. Stratford Upon Avon with a play thrown in and a visit to Shakespeare’s house? Liverpool, Chester, Edinburgh - maybe not a day trip if you’re in London but worth considering.

Use the offer of hanging around in new places to broaden his horizons.

You know, @Twooclockrock - I hadn’t realised just how strongly I still feel about this until reading your OP - and our YP is an adult now. But I feel really invested in your finding a way to navigate all this successfully.

Absolutely ludicrous.

What is?

This image of town centres as war zones is simply not accurate in the vast majority of cases.

I don’t see that there’s any more risk of crime on a high street than a large shopping centre.

That you would prevent a 16 year old from visiting a town centre. What exactly do you think is going to happen?

If there were stabbings in our town centre then yes I would say don’t go! And offer alternatives

A flat "no" isn't going to work at this age. You need to work with your DC so he understands your concerns and you can mitigate them.

Basically your DC wants to go on a trip to town with his friend where they will wonder round the shops and go to McDonalds. This is not the same as "hanging round" the streets (and if you close off other options this may be what he resorts to).

If it is genuinely (and not hyperbole) dangerous, then I agree like PP, can you suggest and facilitate travel to a shopping centre where it is not?

And, you need to unclench about McDonalds. He's old enough to make his own decision.

Well I do, but mines a girl and I trust her and her friends. If you don't its a different story.

There was a stabbing in my local town centre recently. Does this mean that no one can ever go there again (entirely impractical)?