Am I being selfish?

[Sophie26940]

Is it selfish to fly long haul with 2 year old? I’m so embarrassed I got shouted at on the plane by two men for my son shouting during dinner and banging forks. They said they want their money back, they tried to move seats, what was I thinking bringing child on the plane, I’m selfish, why is it crying etc. I understand why they’re annoyed but my child wasn’t crying much, just upset in his sleep. The staff were horrible to me so I had no support. Is it deemed selfish to bring a child on a 12 hour night flight? Dreading the flight back now.

I would never have dreamed of taking my young baby on a plane or train
Nor would I want to be afflicted with someone else's screaming kid
Was a on a train a few weeks ago with a child running about screaming crying
Changed carriages

redskyAtNigh
If they shouted at you (was it really "shouting"?)

It's a change from the universal MN "screaming".
Ime, very few people will raise their voices to the point of shouting in public.
And if these men were actually shouting (more than just an initial "For God's sake!" or something) it's even more strange that all the staff were "horrible" to the OP and weren't trying to calm down two persistently shouting men.

Eta Maybe it's a dialect/family thing. People in DH's family call "being told off" being "shouted at" even if no voices were raised.

They called your child “it”? Horrible creatures.
Honestly, the idea of grown men (who know better) shouting or making a fuss in an enclosed space like an aeroplane, is infinitely more annoying and is much more selfish than an infant making any sort of noise.
Babies and children are a part of this world and our community, so they can expect to come across them in all aspects of daily life. It’s not selfish of you to simply participate in normal human activities with your children. They are the selfish ones to expect the world to revolve around their desire to experience child-free travel.

As long as you’re considerate of those around you, and do your best to respect their need for comfort on a long journey, there’s not much more that can be expected of you.

Also, complain about the staff if they were horrible. What did they do?

That's right stick the crying unruly children in with the plebs. Better still why not shove them in the hold so no one will be inconvenienced. Heard it all now.

We were in first I think that was the issue. They were horrible men and used the

What airline was it?

Thank you for your comments everyone. I don’t want to go into details as I know I wasn’t in the wrong so I don’t need clarity there, they were horrible men who were drinking and even used the c word. I was posting to see if it’s socially acceptable to take a child long haul as I can see both sides of the argument. I think the issue was we were in first (got it for free on air miles) so the men were annoyed they spent thousands on a ticket; and I can see their annoyance. But at the same time I wouldn’t take my son in economy as that wouldn’t be fair to him. He had a whole bed to sleep on in first. I wish the airlines had child friendly flights! I’m just so nervous for the flight back now, what if he gets ill and cries all night?

Wouldn’t be fair for your son to fly in economy?
nah you’ve lost me 😂

So you did everything in your power to keep him quiet? Absolutely everything?

Children are people with as much right to be in public spaces as anyone else.

The men were dicks and you shouldn't waste any more headspace on them.

It can be irritating when babies/young children are being noisy or causing a nuisance on a flight, but just one of those things you have to accept. These men were being very unreasonable and if I were you I would have complained to a flight attendant.

my son shouting during dinner and banging forks.

I understand why they’re annoyed but my child wasn’t crying much, just upset in his sleep.

Which was it OP?

I was on a plane in the 'quiet area' in business and a baby cried solidly all the way through the overnight flight. And I had to work the following day.

Tough shit. No one complained, and the father got nothing but sympathy (mother was cabin crew, so father had to deal with both the crying baby and another child by himself).

Those guys were wankers.

I have just read your update that you were in first class, tbf I think if I forked out for first class I would be annoyed about too. I wouldn't behave as these men had but I don't think they were wrong to be irritated. Really airplane companies shouldn't allow babies into business/first class.

This is what makes me dread flying- crying children. Unfortunately it's part of it. I would be really annoyed if it'd paid first class and had to endure the noise!

Much as you have as much right to be there as anyone else, after flying business with my 10 year old I thought she'd have probably not only been happy, but actually preferred economy as she could have cuddled up to me (don't know if all airlines are the same, but business seemed to be set up to separate people as much as possible, and she could see me and just about hold hands through the middle bit but that was it) and children are surprisingly good at sleeping curled up in weird positions.

I think first class should be adult only

YABU taking a young kid into first class! People pay thousands to sit there, they're not going to want to be disturbed by shouting and banging.

Agreed.

But at the same time I wouldn’t take my son in economy as that wouldn’t be fair to him

Why wouldn't it be fair to him?

I really wish child free flights existed, I'd pay extra!

I think the responsible and considerate thing is to weigh up how your child is likely to cope against the necessity/benefit of the journey, in the interests of all concerned. You, them and the general public. And also go prepared to work very hard on minimising any problems. We took two of ours long haul from very small. They were content, slept anywhere and could be amused with books and toys. So with enough (constant) input they were fine. And if they hadnt been, id not have felt 'selfish' because it was unforeseen.
DC3 was a different matter entirely. Struggled to settle, more active and vocal, so we put unnecessary long haul on hold for a few years. For everyone's sake.

An airplane isn't a public space, it's a private mode of travel that people pay to use.

There is no excuse for the men’s language, but I have to say that if I’d spent thousands on a first class flight, I would be mightily pissed off if there was a crying child in there.

The fact that you say the flight attendants didn’t help you tells me that either your child’s behaviour was beyond the realms of what would be considered reasonable, or that your behaviour or lack of effort to stop your child disturbing other passengers was unreasonable.

I’ve flown long haul with my dc multiple times and would never consider flying long haul, and certainly not first class or business class until they were old enough to behave reliably.

What sane person takes a baby in to the quiet space!

Someone who hopes their other child will get some sleep I guess? Or given the mother was cabin crew they may have had standby tickets and gone wherever there was space available?

In the end, it's only one night and things happen. You suck it up. If you can't, then you need to either not travel or fork out for a private jet...