Man left his girlfriend to freeze to death

[Trevordidit]

Man left his girlfriend to freeze when she was struggling on a mountain hike.

He's been found guilty of manslaughter.

So many aspects of his account don't make sense - AIBU to wonder if he did it on purpose?

News article

I've read the article. She was also an experienced climber and was keen to go. He did make mistakes but as an adult, she also had responsibility. I think the outcome is fair - and remember, we don't have all the information just from reading an article.

Does it state anywhere what the mother’s stance toward the boyfriend is?

exactly what you suggest - that he did what he could. She also says her daughter was experienced at climbing and isn’t the naive follower prosecution has depicted. Seems to contrast though with things like description of the inadequate gear she was wearing.

Reminds me of that guy who kept insisting his girlfriend go scuba diving.

This is a bit of a tangent, but I work next to a popular big "challenge" walk in the Pennines and it's quite common we come across women who've got lost, because they couldn't keep up with the person in their group who knows the way and has the map - it's always a man.

I voted YABU as we only have snippets from the case - not the whole story.

The late start - they wanted to do a night climb, that was the point.
Going over the summit was the only way down.
When the helicopter went overhead she might not have needed help - exhaustion can come on bizarrely quickly.

What is very odd was the not using the blankets / emergency tent and then the timing of the distress calls.

But you only have to read on here (one yesterday) about the husband striding off and complaining of the woman not keeping up and refusing to wait. It is very, very common.

No one (apart from him) will know what happened, he was either an arrogant wanker or it was deliberate, but no way to tell. Certainly, not from short news reports.

I’ve just read he was an experienced hobby climber (not a qualified guide as I said above) so just correcting that. I misunderstood earlier reports that he was acting as her guide (on an informal basis).
I see he’s been convicted now.

06:45: Both set out
17:00: Gurtner tries to call mountain rescue.
18:07: Gurtner sends weird text to parents saying climb is over and they have descended safely.
20:15: Gurtner slipped
20:50: this is when prosecutors say they got stuck.
22:30: Helicopter passes and no distress call is made. Plamberger says she said she was fine to push on.
23:00 (maybe): Plamberger says Gurtner collapses shortly after the helicopter passes.
00:35: Plamberger says he rang emergency services - unclear whether he says all fine or that there was an issue. Puts phone on silent.
02:00: Plamberger left Gurtner.
03:30: Plamberger notifies emergency services.

The inadequate gear and the earlier attempt at a call all scream an abusive relationship to me.

(just to add, I don’t think my timeline is the part that will blow the whole thing wide open and something the prosecution didn’t think to do. I just couldn’t make sense of it in my head so wrote it out and figured I may as well post it.)

It’s hard to prove intent so no one can ever know if he set out to intentionally harm her, they argued and he was punishing her, he wanted to finish the climb and didn’t care about the consequences or he wasn’t thinking straight so made poor decisions. The ex girlfriend’s account certainly lean towards it not being ‘nice guy just making poor decisions in the moment’. He’s clearly got form for selfish, heartless and reckless behaviour.

I guess there is ‘reasonable doubt’ in terms of murder so hence the manslaughter charge. The fine and the minimal and suspended sentence seem way too lenient though.

But regardless, if I had a daughter I would not want her anywhere near this man.

Plus, she was hanging vertically when services found her. Yet he says he left her on the ground.

Not leaving blankets or an emergency tent makes more sense if someone is dangling off a rope.

Has a motive been put forward in any article anywhere ? Did he have an affair partner? Was he named in her will?

Without a motive it seems to me that the scumbag lost patience when the virus hit her, and stormed off.

I think the parents’ stance may have come from wanting to protect her reputation as an intelligent, confident woman who was an experienced climber, rather than a victim who foolishly ascended a mountain.

The two things that make this his fault, imo, are not leaving her in a sheltered spot given that he had to leave her, and not making the 3am call before she was dead.

And given the guilty verdict, I’m shocked at the low sanction. I hope he’s single forever because he’s dangerous.

I think Strava has a lot to answer for!

Murderous coward

Some desperate mug will no doubt take him in one day

I have so many experiences in climbing, mountaineering and other sports where men have insisted they had enough knowledge and experience and lead women into dangerous situations.

The working assumption for so many people in outdoor sports is that women are incompetent and need to be led. I remember having to follow a man off the path in the Alps because he was so insistent he knew the route. I had climbed the route myself before and I knew the way, but he just would not listen. If we'd got into difficulty I have no doubt he would have buggered off and left me. The worst part is that I doubted myself because he's a man and maybe he knew a better route round?

I can absolutely believe this guy thought he knew best and the woman assumed he knew enough to plan a safe outing and retreat if needed.

It's interesting that as the more experienced he was deemed responsible.

My young adult DS (and to a lesser extent I) is experienced in the mountains.

Last summer a group of my friends went on a trip to climb Scafell Pike. DS organised us all and sent loads of info ahead of time about the route, how challenging it would be, the terrain, equipment needed, suitable shoes etc. Most didn't read it on the basis that it wasnt Everest how hard could it be. It was one of the more challenging routes and hed told them that.

In the event, half the group had the sense to turn back, realising they weren't going to make it before dark, but would a 19yo really have been responsible for all these adults if things had gone wrong because of their decisions?

I also wonder if she'd been the more experienced, whether it would have been felt she'd been responsible for a man in the same way.

Whatever happened, it's all very sad.

It’s such an odd and unpleasant story. But what I don’t understand is why she didn’t do more. It says that she was an experienced climber so wouldn’t she have seen this was going wrong?

I don’t want to victim blame but she was an adult. Was this coercive control? Or did it not pan out the way he claims.

I also don't believe she was an experienced mountaineer. Maybe hiking or crag climbing but she was wearing snowboarding boots.

That might be what happens sometimes, but I don't think for a minute it's always the case. I run and cycle in mixed sex and mixed ability groups.

The faster people will go out front to get their workout without putting pressure on the slower ones to keep up. If I'm out with DP, he'll be in front of me and I'll be puffing behind, but it's nothing to do with him showing off, and all to do with us each working at our own pace. We regroup at regular interals and if I didn't appear as expected, he'd come back for me.

A hill is an opportunity for us both to test ourselves. I'm not miserable because I'm working hard. That's why I went.

I was reading the article - it didn't seem right to me to put the blame on the boyfriend. This was two adults, not an adult and a child. Kerstin chose to go, she had the same equipment and was in the same conditions as Thomas; she doesn't seem to have summoned help. Thomas might be a selfish, heartless, uncaring person but I don't think he is guilty of manslaughter. The court disagrees with me though.

I've just read (BBC) that he has form for this with a previous gf who gave evidence at the trial.

This is very true

Her parents said she had conquered much more difficult peaks than the Grossglockner and that she was a mountain runner.

I don't doubt her experience - I strongly doubt Plamberger's actions and statements.

He isn't even going to prison - suspended sentence and small fine. Womens' lives are worth so little. I suspect he's a murderer, he has form

"experienced hiker" doesn't mean experienced in high-altitude alpinism. From what I can read, he was the one with the mountain climbing experience.