A 9yr Old Shouldn’t have Toilet Accidents

[BeBlueCat]

Dh’s sister and her family drove down and stayed with us last weekend. On the first evening, SIL discreetly asked me for a plastic bag and wipes for DN. It was obvious what had but I didn't say anything, thought it was a one off.
Next day we're at the park, kids run off to play. They come back and she pulls me aside saying he's had another accident and they need to pop to the loo to clean up. She looked embarrassed but seemed like was it was a routinely. I assumed he must have a medical condition.

I managed to ask her about it later and she was very blase. Said it happens when he's overexcited or if he "puts off going". I asked if they'd seen a GP or anyone about it and she just said "Oh no, he'll grow out of it” And that it had gotten better recently.

I was shocked. Surely a child having accidents at aged 9 is a huge red flag for medical attention? And If it happens at school? I can’t began to think how embarrassed he feel about the whole thing. I did want to say something more but didn’t in the end, not wanting to over step.

I think this is a really serious issue that needs proper attention, not a wait and see approach?

They’ll know whether there are triggers, or it’s all the time, and whether it’s improving.

There’s good info available online, so may not need specialist input if that’s making slow but steady progress.

Well, it's her business, nobody else's.

I'd personally be considering getting him checked over if he was mine, but it isn't uncommon for many primary school children to have toilet accidents. Less common from 9 onwards, but not unknown.

Not necessarily. My youngest was always leaving skid marks in his pants because he just wouldn’t bloody well come in from playing with his mates when he needed to go, in case he was missing out on something.

Poo accidents? Or wee accidents? For boys it’s very normal to keep having accidents until 10-12.

It could be a sign of constipation and can be resolved easily with laxatives. With seeing the gp to save the child from embarrassment at school.

unfortunately it is not easy to say this to a parent if she doesn’t want to know.

Your s-i-l probably doesn't want to go into it because of a second-hand embarrassment for her child, and is underplaying it for you. Doesn't mean she's not taking it seriously behind closed doors. Unless you have other reasons to be concerned about neglect.

They were poo accidents, but DIL mentioned he does wet himself infrequently.
I know it’s common for boys to have skid marks even they are older, but properly soiling himself and needing changing seems like a completely different issue.

You may find it runs in the family. Apparently in dp’s family, they all were v late to toilet train and lo and behold, his kids were incredibly late too (didn’t night time train till almost secondary school and still had day accidents quite late too). Apparently there is a strong genetic link so maybe this is why she isn’t overly concerned about it.

This was my thinking. What if He does have something like constipation and it’s going untreated?

Is it???!! I don't think it's common at all. I've heard of kids wetting the bed at night at this age but not accidents in the daytime. I would have taken my son to the Dr years ago if he was still having accidents like this. Ultimately it is not ops child so nothing she can do about it.

The medics won’t even consider investigating until the child is 7 (unless there are other major medical issues linked to it).

I’m an ex teacher and it’s actually fairly common, less so in the daytime but lots of kids wet the bed until really really late. There’s always at least one or two on any primary overnight trip and often into secondary as well.

even when the medics do get involved there isn’t always a lot that can be done - it’s a case of laxatives/disimpaction protocol or they advise to try to work out triggers in case of coeliac or food intolerances.

You don't know if they are getting professional advice or support, maybe she just didn't want to discuss it with you.

Point them at www.eric.org.uk

I would expect a 9 year old to be toilet trained.
If this is happening I suspect it's due to a medical reason or SN.

It's none of your business. At 9 years old, the child deserves privacy. The parents may be well aware of any potential causes and may have seen a doctor but are brushing off your comments out of respect for their child's privacy.

Wetting the bed at night is completely different because it depends on a hormone. 9 year olds pooing themselves in the day doesn't sound normal at all to me and I'm amazed people are saying it is.

I'd be worried that he's severely compacted and leaking around the edges which is why he doesn't know when he needs to go. If pooing himself twice in two days is considered an improvement then that's really concerning IMO. Not sure what you can do if SIL wants to brush it under the carpet though.

My 9yo dose sometimes. If anything he's changing more now then when he was younger. Not because it's happing more, but because he's got to the age where he notices and doesn't want to walk round with skids, so will ask for a change of pants. A year ago I'd have been non the wiser until I did the laundry.

I would assume they have been to the GP about it, had any checks and have been told not to worry. They could refer to the school nurse for further advice, especially if it's something that happens at school too, but there may already be strategies in place that they didn't want to share with you (e.g. in school some children are reminded to go to the toilet every hour or so even if they say they don't need to).

Thank you!! I agree there’s nothing more I can really say, but I do worry for him!

He has no SN - I did ask SIL. My other concern is that if she is right and there no medical issue that seems even worse! A 9 year old pooing himself because he doesn’t want to stop his activity, then continuing to play like nothing is up does not seem normal and something you would expect of a Toddler.

Its likely there is something else going on and SIL isn't giving the full story- constipation/ impactation/ allergy related, IBS or perhaps another medical condition.

Constipation (especially if it's chronic or has led to impactation) can take months to treat. The fact SIL is asking discretely means it is possibly embarrassing for DN.

Same with allergy related bowel issues, it often entails keeping a food and stool diary.

Bladder and bowel service provision varies all over the country. Many GPs won't refer on to bladder and bowel service until a child turns 7. Even then, advice usually entails ruling out constipation, allergies and genetic factors (late toilet training history in the family) before any other investigations begin.

In terms of withholding or leaving it too late/ not going to strange toilets it's not that unusual. You only have to look at mumsnet to see just how many posters will not use public toilets or use toilets in other people's houses or go to the toilet whilst guests are visiting or not use their downstairs toilet because people are over. There are swathes of posters who will only go to their own toilets. Then there are the people who are completely unable to understand how to use public toilets and instead shit/ piss all over the place, perform incredible gymnastic feats, flush with their feet, smear their waste all over the walls and make elaborate nests out of toilet roll.

My 8 year old boy still has poo accidents occasionally. He has never liked pooping and puts it off until he literally starts shitting himself. It was much worse a few years ago (he used to almost completely refuse to go) but accidents are much rarer now. He's neurotypical.

So it doesn't sound beyond the realm of normalcy to me, though obviously 9 is quite late. Either way, I don't think you need to be worried about it.

My daughter is nearly 6 and withholds her stools causing her to soil herself regularly. She is under the bladder and bowel clinic for this. However if someone asked me about her I wouldn't want to disclose her medical history to them and she's 5 and finds it embarrassing. It must be even more embarrassing for a 9yr old. I don't really think it's any of your business.

Exactly. By 9 you know you need the toilet and how to ask to go.
Unless he is unwell and he has no bowel control. Which is very sad and embarrassing for him.

Exactly. By 9 you know you need the toilet and how to ask to go.

Good grief.
You have no idea.
You can't seriously think he is happy for this to happen to him, if he could prevent it ?

As others have said, his Mum is most likely respecting his privacy and not discussing it with people. That doesn't mean they haven't seen the Dr.

But, of course 'seeing the Dr' isn't a magic wand - any help can help some children, but it will usually take years.