To fuck off out for the day when MIL visits tomorrow

[Myeyeisnotokay]

Instead of playing happy families and pretending everything is ok with me and DH?

Apologies as this is a bit of a vent, and I'm still mad so I may sound unreasonable. We've argued tonight, over a stupid thing but DH is refusing to apologise or even engage in a discussion about it. He feels he is justified.
He ended up effing and blinding at the table because Dd4 and Dd6 only picked the sausages out of their casserole and didn't eat any veg.
It's a battle but they DO eat veg - eg they both love broccoli, cauliflower, peas, etc and will generally eat quite well. Won't say they haven't been particularly picky lately and refusing to even try things, which is irritating. But I'm much of the view that we can't force them to eat stuff and threatening them with no pudding unless they clear their plate is just not a healthy way to encourage them.

I specifically told DH not to make comments when I dished up tea today, because inevitably he picks at them and tells them they need to eat a bit of this with that, and have some veg with that bit etc and it's so draining . We can't just have a nice meal. It's just anxiety inducing for the kids I'm sure. he just couldn't help it and kept on and on at the girls until I snapped at him and he was then swearing (mainly at the situation eg. It's fucking ridiculous).

I've told him he needs to apologise to both me and the kids for the way he spoke. He's given a half arsed "maybe I overreacted a bit" but maintains he was justified because their eating habits need to change and apparently I'm too soft (which fucks me off too, as I am not! They don't get alternatives and I'm happy to let them go hungry if they don't eat, and have made lots of suggestion like meals in the centre of the table etc)

I'm livid with him. I realise this all sounds quite petty but it's just one of a string of stupid arguments lately and most of the time we resolve things, but seemingly he doesn't want to this time. I'm not willing to play happy families until he has a proper conversation with me and actually acknowledges why I'm upset with him.

MIL is visiting tomorrow and not a fucking chance am I going to pretend we're all fine so he comes off like he's the perfect husband and father like usual, so I plan to fuck off out. But I fear I'm also unreasonable, as we don't see her often.

Finally, if anybody has any useful tips on how to get little kids to eat a wider range of veggies, PLEASE throw them at me. I am open to new strategies but I won't force food on them!

Hmmph.

I may be a total prude but I hate folk that swear at or about their kids in front of them. I can’t imagine how a small child would feel having an adult describe them or their behaviour as “fucking ridiculous”. I’d never be with someone like that.

Difficult.

We never really did pudding so there wasn’t the option of missing main and filling up
on sweet stuff. So I get why your DH might find that annoying.

That said, kids go through phases and some are just shit eaters. Our youngest was dreadful, so meals could have been real battles but we just went with the flow.

I don’t think you should go out tomorrow though.

Pudding every night isn’t good however would your dh eat everything on his plate every night, does he eat things he doesn’t like?

pick your battles when it comes to food.

o wouldn’t disappear tomorrow because that would only escalate things however I’d make him look after his mum regarding cups of tea and food to eat. I wouldn’t be running about after her.

What's wrong with making threats? Do you never tell children that there are consequences to their actions? If you don't eat your dinner you won't get dessert is a perfectly valid threat.

This.
I wouldn't be eating with him.
I wouldn't allow such stress at the table.

His swearing anger is emotionally abusive.
I certainly wouldn't be playing happy families because you certainly are not.

Were you planning on taking the children out?
Let him entertain his mother.
I wouldn't be forced out, I would leave him to entertain and explain.

Your poor children.

You undermined him and sided with your kids.. hence the anger.

I'm sure you would be angry if you were dealing with your kids and he came along and said "don't listen to mummy, it's ok, you can do X".

This shouldn't happen though because reasonable parents discuss these things and come to an agreed position. They don't keep disagreeing and undermining each other. All that leads to is naughty kids who play parents off each other.

As for the fussy eating, it sounds like he is to rigid and annoying, but you are too lax. A middle point that you can both agree on should be possible.

E.g. no nagging and pressure at the table, but equally no pudding if they don't eat reasonably .

Regarding the eating the veg, just keep doing what you’re doing - including it in meals and they’ll eat and enjoy what they want. You could also disguise some in blended sauces.

What I would say is that I was often dealt with harshly at mealtimes if I didn’t want to eat everything on my plate and it can result in a difficult relationship with food - which I still have to an extent.

Your husband is making mealtimes an upsetting battleground for your children and they will start to resent him for it and it will make things worse.

If you like your mother in law, stay to spend time with her. No need to pretend all is well though but hopefully you can speak with your husband before she arrives and explain why his behaviour with the children is problematic for him and damaging to them.

I wouldn't go out, DH could tell MIL anything and make it all your fault!

I don't see no pudding as a punishment though, if they aren't hungry enough to eat any veg they can't be hungry enough for pudding, it's a natural consequence. I don't make them clear their plates and I don't make them eat things they genuinely don't like. But no veg/salad when I know they like at least some of it? Clearly they are too full. The same goes for extra helpings of their favourite bits of dinner.

They’re 4 and 6, my DD has always been the same. She loved carrots for years and then suddenly hated them. Loved bananas for years and suddenly hated them. Then loved them again. Then hated them again.
Force feeding them something they hate by shouting at them is fucking weird, my Dad did it to me and I hated it.
Putting pudding on a pedestal or using it as a punishment will create its own problems around sweet foods.
Could you involve the kids in choosing what you all have for dinner? For example, if you decide to make a casserole, they get to choose the veg but they have to pick one and they have to eat it, it might give them a bit more confidence in eating it.

I think your DH is being a twat to be honest @Myeyeisnotokay.

In our house, mealtimes are a no pressure situation. Kids are around the same age as yours too. It’s my job to provide them with food, it’s their job to decide what and how much of it they eat.

How involved are your DC in picking family meals/preparing family meals? Because I do believe that can have a huge impact. Mine each pick one family meal a week, including 2 veg to go with it. This does often result in completely random combinations of meals/veg but we go with it 🤷🏻‍♀️ I think it’s good for them to feel involved in the family meal choices. They also know how to ‘build a meal’ - we need a protein, veggies, carbs etc.

They also help prep the dinner at least a couple of nights a week and get to make choices about the prep.

So if it’s carrots as one of the veg for example - I’ll ask them what shape they’re making. They get to peel and then decide if they’re making batons, disks, or making “crazy carrots” with the crinkle cut knife. They also usually sit and eat half the veg raw while prepping the dinner so even if they don’t eat much veg at dinner, they’ve had a decent amount before 🤷🏻‍♀️

And I think it’s ok for them to show preferences and voice those. Keep it in mind for next time and use it - “I know last week you said you weren’t keen on cooked carrots - would you like yours raw today instead?”
I’d still continue putting things in their plates for exposure even if they’re not sure.
We try and model it ourselves too - eg, I can’t stand green beans but DC will always pick them so I always only put a couple on my plate and take more of other veg and just say “green beans aren’t my favourite so I’ll just have a few, I like broccoli better so I’ll have more of that”.

We don’t do something sweet after dinner every night either. And I don’t believe in food being used as any kind of reward or punishment either.

Such a wholly sensible approach. This is exactly what parents should be aiming for.

And I love how you deal with likes and dislikes. Adults are allowed to have food preferences and avoid eating food they don’t like so children should be allowed the same.

You’re setting your children up for really good relationships with food for their futures and it’s brilliant. 😀

Im sorry but he is a control freak. How childish of him to behave in that way in front of the kids. What message is he giving them. Great if they start using those words at school. It is his behaviour that is unacceptable not your kids. And you sound like your trying to appease him. STOP. It might be veg now but itll move on to something else. Id refuse to cook him another meal or sit at the same table as him unless he agrees to change. As for your MIL' visit. Ring her up and tell her why you and the kids (take them with you) wont be there or suggest you all go out without him.

The bit about "having a bit of this with that" would drive me insane - so annoying and controlling! The swearing in front of a 4 year old and a 6 year old is shocking too. I would be furious with him, and yes I would be tempted to go out for part of MIL's visit and let him get on with it.

I do agree with other posters about the puddings though, unless you just mean fruit and yogurt? I wouldn't let mine have a sweet pudding every night if they weren't eating their main course properly.

Agreed. "Balanced diet" and "no pressure" is not "kids have sausages and pudding for dinner".

We give our kids a vegetable starter - a bowl of raw veg before dinner while they're having some screen time. So then when we get to dinner, they've already had essentially a salad. Takes so much pressure off.

You need to discuss this with your husband when you're both calm and regulated and agree a united front. He can't be acting like this, it's counter productive, but it's coming from a place of wanting his kids to be healthy.

Do you like your mil? If not, fuck it, go out. If you do, then maybe just go out for a couple of hours. Have a good long walk and a coffee or something.

My daughters were fussy when they were younger - the eldest is ND. They're not fussy now and even ND DD of her own volition started to try different food. Coercion didn't work and just made meal times awful. At one point the only veg they ate was carrots and broccoli.

Yanbu. Why should you pretend? He's wrong and shouldn't behave like that.

I have a ds17. He used to be very picky over veg, only eating tomatoes, cucmber and peas.

I cook a lot of different veg and would always put a small helping of every one on his plate. I said nothing unless ds asked what it was. Now 17, 6'2" and a weekend pool lifeguard, he eats everything except cauliflower.

Over the years he has gradually tried things (sometimes by accident) without all the stress and bad feeling. Children's taste buds are still developing and they'll get there eventually. Your dh needs to back off. He's being a knob.

Poor mil caught up in this. I think let her see the reality. But I don’t think you’re entirely in the clear here op.

Your DH is being a dick to get so angry around the dinner table - if there is anything that’s going to make children feel anxious and lose their appetite, it’s that. But maybe he’s entirely frustrated that you let the children get away with it and he feels strongly about healthy eating.

With our children we’d offer a platter and they could help themselves. There were different combos of veg, salad and fruit every single day. They could eat at little or as much as they wanted but unless it was ‘balanced’ - nothing else. Certainly no pud. So it was a take it or leave it situation. No angst. No battles. The decision was theirs.

We rarely had a problem because it was just presented as normal food. Yes texturally challenging for kids sometimes but a non negotiable part of it. I don’t believe in ‘hiding veg’ because at some point they have to learn to like it and enjoy it.

I think there must be a middle ground, DH shouldn’t be turning mealtimes into a battleground and he shouldn’t be swearing at the children. However I do think your approach is too soft, I just remind DC that your body needs nourishing so they need to eat a variety of things. I don’t make DD clear her plate but she can’t have pudding (usually fruit and yoghurt) unless she’s tried everything on the plate. She’s now 7 and eats most things and enjoys trying new things, in fact she’s less fussy than me.

As a fussy eater up until in my 30s who now still isn’t on the same page as foodie friends I wish my parents had done more than ‘she’ll eat when she’s ready’. I lived off beige food and Christmas dinners were waffles and fish fingers. But as I say that I’ve no idea how you task or it and I came here to say the thing is at least my parents didn’t fight in the process. He needs to calm down and I’m hoping you telling him he has to apologise etc etc wasn’t in front of the kids. Talk to each other in private and figure stuff out. And I’d say do go out today for a bit of you time but don’t make it a big battle thing, just take some breathing space

The only thing I would say against your post is the pudding @Myeyeisnotokay my kids might get a snack during the day like a yogurt or a small chocolate bar but it is not linked with dinner. I don’t really understand the concept of dessert every day. I would knock the link between dinner and dessert on the head.

But otherwise I think your DHs behaviour is very controlling and is actively harming his children’s relationship with food.

We have a child who was very fussy due to disability and so we have attended parenting classes on this specific topic and your DHs behaviour was exactly the opposite to what is recommended for fussy children and it is known to be actively harmful for fussy children.

The advice by the way is to keep serving up the food and keep giving children opportunities to try it. Let them do it at their own pace.

@MammaBear1 Thank you ❤️ what a lovely comment!

I grew up in a very strict household where food control was used as a big form of reward and punishment. Both of my parents have disordered eating habits (binge eating mainly) and I struggled with the same for my whole teens and early 20s.

I made such a conscious decision when I was first pregnant that I was going to break that cycle and make sure food was a completely neutral thing in our house.
We don’t have “good/bad/treat” foods either. But as DC get older they understand more about how different things fuel our body differently depending on what’s in them and that our meals should be mainly made of the things that give our bodies the best kind of energy.

@Myeyeisnotokay I should add too that (if budget allows obviously) having DC help with the food shop and have their pick at the veg section has also been great for mine. I try not to say ‘no’ if they ask to try something even if it’s completely inconvenient and goes with none of our meals or if I think it’s something they won’t like 🫠😅 we make an activity out of finding out how to prep it and we try it together.

My DS only eats raw veg. Never could stand the texture of cooked veg. Good news, it is very easy to peel a carrot or snap off a bit of broccoli and throw it on a plate. It's simple and healthy. If your DC will pick out the bits they like then just have a bowl of carrot and cucumber sticks or whatever on the table and then they can pick at that. There's literally zero point in having this battle right now.
Offer up veg you know they will eat alongside some some new food which you can encourage them to try (in a positive way) and if they dont then they eat the veg they will eat and you dont have to worry. DH is being ridiculous this is very normal in kids and so to avoid lifelong food issues, just dial the stress back and continue offering up food they will eat amongst other food.
Don't stress they will be fine