Autism and Merlin RAP

[Perzival]

I think it's fair to say that the amount of people diagnosed with autism has increased by a huge amount compared to the amount of people who were diagnosed with the separate conditions prior to the change in the diagnostic manuals and people with a dx can vary between being a doctor and having a family, mortgage, social life etc to requiring 2:1 24 hour support with very limited communication.

This week Merlin that own Alton Towers, Thorpe park, Chessington and Legoland have decided to not give their ride access pass to people who struggle in crowds. This has caused uproar within the Merlin/ theme park groups as the majority of people who have this struggle have autism.

For those who aren't aware, in order to get a Ride Access Pass (RAP) you have to give evidence of your disabilities to a company called Nimbus who then decide what type of issues you have and give you a card with various icons on that you can them submit to venues for reasonable adjustments.

Throw in the commentary around the SEND white paper and the government review into why so many people are being diagnosed and i'm wondering if this is a more general move and one which is becoming more acceptable.

As the diagnosis has gone from previously representing mainly boy/ men with quite complex needs to representing a vast array of differring presentations and with an ever increasing amount of people being diagnosed, aibu to think that this is just the start and more venues/ places will limit or remove reasonable adjustments for this group of people?

AIBU= No, there isn't a push back against the autism diagnosis and adjustments made for the dx

AINBU= yes, more venues will start to remove or reduce adjustments for those with Autism

To avoid drip feeding I have a ds with profound autism and would imagine he will likely always get various reasonable adjustments (still gets RAP) etc.

Yes you can. You can go on a virtual queue for say the most popular ride and if that is 2 hours wait as a example, you can easily go to another ride with a shorter queue, ride it and then go back to the popular ride and do that straight after. And this is the problem with the system and how it’s getting abused. Anyone with a pass can’t do that, they have to stand for 2 hours in the line. They can’t go and eat a leisurely lunch and enjoy others parts of the park which is why so many full price paying guests are complaining. They spend a whole day out and only get to go on 4 rides, whereas someone with a pass could in theory do the whole park. It’s not an equal experience for all guests which it should be.

It's so sad to read some of the comments on here. How people so easily say "don't go". Well that's exactly the life my dc leads, they go nowhere, it's soul destroying to live this life. I wouldn't wish this on anyone. They are very much aware of how society views them and just how excluded they are.

Also there's very few who qualify for more than +1. The +1 isn't really a discount, considering most places do 2for1 ticket offers, Merlin for example do it regularly on cereal boxes.
The carers aren't having a free day out, they are responsible for someone extremely vulnerable.
people get +2 or +3 etc for carers because quite rightly the carers are allowed a lunch break. They also have the right to use the loo, which wouldn't be possible without another carer. I could mention more but I fear it'd fall on deaf ears.
We had +2 for many years and not once did "granny" use the "free ticket". It was used by carers

I am a parent of a older teenager who requires 2:1 and 3:1 with outside respite. I would argue that in my experience of using theme parks and Queue assists his type of needs are in the minority now compared to when he was a child and the children using the pass for adrenaline rides where of his or similar profile. Whilst it is good that more awareness has led to more demand of the passes the system now has too much demand. The two things can both be true that the accommodations are greatly needed and that these needs maybe becoming unsustainable for the business model.

this woke notion that any ASD parent - who has a job, is married, drives a car and has CHILDREN, is comparable to the profound version of the disorder.

Except literally nobody has ever said this. Talk about directing your ire at the wrong people.

I came on here to say exactly the same thing. No mention of autism but anxiety and ADHD and the stopping of "the fast pass"(rap). They've done this on purpose so people side with Merlin 😮

I don’t think Disneyland Paris has changed their system, unless it’s in the last 6 months.

Wanted to add a lot of those Radford kids are obviously on the spectrum so probably have raps for them too.

Because some disabled /autistic children really enjoy the vestibular experience of roller coasters and other exciting rides. And a theme park is usually the only way to access them.

Most playgrounds are off limits once you turn 12. If your autistic child'smain joy in life is riding roller coasters, you currently can just about do it with the access pass.

They had a TV segment on an programme earlier about this. Merlin said they just couldn’t issue passes for anxiety. As anyone could say there anxious and it would be unmanageable. So, they offered quiet rooms etc Other disabilities would be the same criteria.

"people get +2 or +3 etc for carers because quite rightly the carers are allowed a lunch break. "

When an adult is supported by paid carers in the community there will be no extra because someone needs a lunch break.

Don't rollercoasters make most people anxious? There's no thrill without a hint of danger.

Read the thread. A few people have explained why their children can't cope with crowds / queues but manage with rollercoasters

It isn’t just people with autism. My daughter has Down’s syndrome and had the queue symbol but under this new system has been allocated just “difficulty with crowds”. We possibly have a case for her to have the “difficulty standing” icon added, as she has hypermobility, hypotonia and probably tires more easily than her peers, and receives HRM DLA, but the crux of the issue is that she neither really has trouble standing, nor are her problems with queues to do with difficulty with crowds as such, rather that she doesn’t properly understand the concept of queuing (or why she can’t do something immediately) or have the patience to queue for a long amount of time. It feels that the new symbols are missing a category that would cover people with learning disabilities more accurately. Not that Merlin care of course…

Often carers are actually family, so not having a +3 or whatever would make it impossible to visit these attractions as a family day out.

For those with a real need for the passes, you're overlooking that there will be other impacts on the day.

My daughter has an annual pass to a (non merlin) theme park, and their equivalent of a disability pass. She'd still be eligible at Merlin for one after the rules change.

No we don't sit on a bench and look sad till we can use the pass again, we go for lunch, or ice cream, with a playground, and yes, if we walk past a ride that's got no queue we might go on it. But we're not doing that all day. We're doing that for 3 hours max, then going home, because that's what she can manage because of disability. Yes she probably fits more in that 3 hours, but the day tickets aren't cheaper when you only go for half days, neither are the season tickets.

For her it's mobility issues which often fluctuate. She could do a 2 hour queue, but (1) it would be her only ride (2) I'd be carrying her for the vast majority of it and I'd be half dead by the time we got to the front.

I agree that there are too many people who upon recieving any diagnosis (but especially ND perhaps) treat it as entitlement to a pass rather than considering whether it's really necessary for their specific (or child's specific) needs, and this has bloated the number having a pass and made it unwieldy.

I don't personally have a problem with the change, but I think it's been badly handled by both Nimbus and Merlin. People should have been informed of the change in symbols, and what that means for their child, and given the opportunity to submit evidence to support a change in classification. There shouldn't be blanket bans or mass reclassification without the ability to challenge this.

I suspect that most of those that really need the pass will be able to submit evidence to get a tick in the standing box. The most profoundly won't be affected either. For many, who are in mainstream schools, jobs, living independently, then there is benefit in learning how to queue.

ADHD wont be accepted as a reason for going to the front of most queues in life, and the onus is on that person and their family (when young) to find ways of best coping.

If your child doesn't like crowds why on earth would you take them to a theme park, it doesn't make any sense? Unless it's Paulton's, which is lovely.
My husband and children don't like crowds so they don't go to theme parks. They go to the playground instead. (Obviously the husband doesn't go to the pg by himself.)

Sorry can you explain this? Surely the family members that don't need a carer and aren't the carer are just regular paying guests? The idea that the whole family should get a free day out because you have a disabled member is surely not right.

"Often carers are actually family, so not having a +3 or whatever would make it impossible to visit these attractions as a family day out."

I think the problem is when every adult in the party is classed as a carer and doesn't pay. When pre teens are going somewhere you would expect an adult to be with them.

I agree that the card symbols need to be broken down even more than they already are. And I also agree, and have seen, the RAP passes being used by people who arguably could cope without them—mainly by adults privately diagnosed with ADHD later in life who’ve been going to theme parks religiously and queuing for 30+ years with no issues but now brag about how they can ‘queue jump’.

I have a physically disabled child, and RAP became unusable for us. It’s difficult for us to book in advance when we don’t know if she’ll be up to it, but the new system was always booked up months and months in advance—I imagine largely by season ticket holders who book ‘just in case’, some of which will book 2-4 slots for multiple members of the party.

The RAP queue lengths weren’t actually a huge issue for us, that said our daughter is able to understand queuing, and in most cases would opt out of standing in a queue for an hour in favour of something else (and luckily would see this as a personal choice rather than a limitation cause by her disability). We also accept that occasionally we’ll have to leave a queue—I viewed it as 30 minutes lost to abandoning a RAP queue when near to the front is easer to stomach than 2 hours lost to abandoning the standard queue when near the front.

They definitely needed to do something and I’m glad they are trying to get a handle on it. I’m selfishly also glad that they are still recognising physical disabilities, unlike Disney World who just tell you to get a wheelchair and go in the standard queue. I do however hope they try to scale the changes back in for people who have had it removed and genuinely need it; I imagine they’ll leave this in the hands of Nimbus to reaccess symbols.

I also agree with everyone saying the access card is/was open to abuse. When we initially applied for ours all we provided was her discharge letter from hospital, anything about her specific needs was left for us to explain with no impartial backup. The only thing we needed to then provide additional evidence for was the plus one.

So 3 people can be " carers" and get in free? And when it's kids that are too young to go themselves even if they don't have extra needs then surely their parents is a carer. But have to pay?

We've explained this already. It's for the vestibular sensation from the rides, which you mainly find in theme parks. And if your child has no friends, it's a guaranteed hit day out for the rides.

I don't know about Merlin ones but with our theme park that we've got an annual pass for, you can only have 2 live reserved dates. Fair enough, but we're in the same situation where she's not always up to us, so having to pick in June two specific dates in August, and then hoping, doesn't feel like value for money anymore.

It was fine a couple of years ago, when they didn't restrict the number of passes in a day because they didn't need to. But it seems to have exploded, and like with many of these things, when that happens they pull back.

My daughter has a physical disability which impacts her ability to queue for a prolonged amount of time. We received DLA as a result of her physical disability. My understanding is that DLA/PIP is awarded to cover the additional support needed due to these disabilities. We have used her DLA to pay for various things that she needs above and beyond those of a child that doesn't have this disability.

We visit Alton Towers once per year and part of her DLA goes towards paying for a fast track pass to get round the fact that queueing is a problem. We, as a family, consider that a use of the funds to provide additional support

Where I work we offer free carers tickets - we ask for proof of PIP or DLA or a blue badge Would something like this work ? It's such a shame for the people missing out .

I get the rap because of a hidden disability but it’s not SEN. Does that mean all hidden disability’s are now defunct???

I have a physical condition. But hidden. Or is it just autism and adhd?