Benefits explosion- where will it end?

[TheBlueKoala]

"PIP benefits explosion: Anxiety and depression handouts have nearly TRIPLED to £4.3bn since Covid - with autism and ADHD bill hitting £2.2bn and 'back pain' £1.6bn"

Something is not right here. When I have written before on here telling about people I know who claim for anxiety although they have rich social lives (funded by 440£ extra per month from PIP) I've had many people telling me that it's not possible etc. It sure is. How many 16 year olds are claiming PIP for anxiety?

Instead of benefits why not pay for therapy- invest massively in the NHS mental health support so that people with anxiety, adhd and autism can see a therapist regularly to help them. This would make a difference for tje individual and the society. Throwing out money won't.

AINBU- I agree with about
AIBU- No, extra money is always useful

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-15510221/PIP-benefits-anxiety-depression-austism-ADHD-pain-Covid-Labour.html

Then shouldn't it go to those who can't rather than those who manages and still gets?

I’ve paid it for 42 years. I’m a ‘hardworking taxpayer’ too.

Im happy to pay as I’m not a grinch.

You lost me by suggesting autism and ADHD can be cured by therapy. Depression and anxiety, maybe but not autism.
My autistic DS is non verbal so not convinced any therapy is going to help him. My DD is verbal but she like many other autistic people is not going to feel comfortable talking to a stranger.

It will end when there is a change of government.

The only way some manage to work is due to PIP.

I think the core issue is that it’s unsustainable as it is, whatever you think of people’s conditions or if they ‘deserve’ more financial support for that condition.

The numbers of claimants keep growing, 85% aren’t in work.

There will need to be a point at which it is reassessed.

I think the ability to claim for issues like anxiety, ADHD etc is a challenge, as more people are diagnosed with these conditions.

The public already seems increasingly negative and unsupportive, as the tax burden grows and most have nothing to show for it.

Quite soon then 👍

The depression and anxiety route? Just wow. I really hope you see how offensive that comment is to people who suffer from depression. I had a relative with clinical depression who ended their own life. I'm sure plenty of others have been through similar

I had to battle to get lwrca - I got it on the third attempt. It's a horrible process. The dwp can overrule your GP and if you are trying to get it for mental health you'll be asked questions that are pretty triggering - and at the end you score zero.

I got it because of a serious accident - not because of my mental health

No, because there are lots of people who are only able to stay in employment as a result of PIP and the options that gives them- that’s really how it should be used and shows the system working well.

PIP is to cover the extra costs of a disability, including the cost of remaining in employment which looks different for everyone but can include things like taxis if public transport is too difficult, meal services/cleaning services if energy is tight to focus on work etc. Overall we’d be better off with people claiming PIP AND working full time than not claiming PIP, being unable to work and then claiming UC instead.

Doubt it, the tories oversaw this mess.

The problem is that currently rather a lot of voters are reliant on the system’s largesse in certain areas, so any party that stops it might find winning votes rather difficult in parts of the UK.

Taking care of the weak and vulnerable does not imply unlimited help.

Economic help can only be given within the bounds of how sustainable it is for the UK economy as a whole.

This is the case anywhere in the developed world.

The UK has a serious problem with PIP MH claims whose growth has not been replicated anywhere else in the developed world.

We are not talking about small numbers here. The explosion in claims is having a negative impact on the UK economy, as well as on the help provided to people with serious physical disabilities.

Its important to have these conversations without people resorting to emotional arguments in order to try to shut down discussion (several posters in this very thread have already done this).

The UK does not have unlimited taxpayer money. The opportunity cost here is very large. Funding MH PIP claims in the way the UK has been doing is a very poor way of using limited taxpayer funds that could be used for far more productive investment (housing and childcare for example).

The whole point of PIP is to pay for costs over and above the things non-disabled people pay for. When it is a completely mental health and not physical health issue - what are these costs? The one thing I've seen people say is to pay for private therapy, but you can guarantee the majority aren't doing that so what is it meant to be used for?

I'm autistic with dysthymia, depression, and anxiety. I work full-time and always have done - my bills are just the same as anyone else's

If that's really the case I do think it's got out of hand.

Maybe my radar is off because I am ND and everyone I know is ND too, but my experience is that everyone has reminders on their phone and/or uses Echo Dot or Google Nest to remind them to do things.

Why does that need money? To pay for a phone and contract which almost every person in the UK pays for regardless of disability? Or is it to cover the £50 bit of technology which lasts for years?

But - 85% of recipients aren’t in work.

Exactly. It’s almost as if that poster didn’t read my post, despite quoting it.

@SnoopyPajamas

We need a reform of society. Reform the inflexibility of the system, and the benefits cliff edge that makes it difficult for so many people to take up part time work. Reform child care. Reform the forty hour work week that is causing so much burnout. Reform housing, so people aren't pouring half their income into rent with no return. Improve social mobility - stop demanding unnecessary credentials for entry level positions. No-one needs a degree to answer the phone and reply to emails.

Nail on the head with all that. I'd go further and say we need to reform the education system, reform the NHS, etc. Everything is outdated and nothing is changing fast enough to cope with the "new normal" of the 21st Century. Public sector/public services are around 50 years out of date, whether it's the failed GP system, schools, etc. And a big yes to a complete reform of the illogical tax/benefit system.

All we've had for decades is a succession of politicians lining their own pockets whilst re-arranging the deckchairs on the Titannic.

Compare that to private business/entreprenneurs who are constantly innovating, changing, etc to stay ahead in an ever changing World.

Look at the language some people are using - benefit cheats, benefit scammers. I'm not a scammer. I had a serous accident 18 months ago that resulted in me having to get my leg pinned back together. I was originally put in the lcw group for 12 weeks. I went to mandatory reconsideration. Lost. I asked to see the assessors report. It was full of lies.

I then went to tribunal and they found for me - and according to the dwp paperwork I was fit to work ten weeks after a triple leg break - I couldn't even walk.

Don't sit and say how easy it is to game the system - because that isn't the experience that many people go through

Sad that many have degrees, but clearly no education. A few measly billions spent on mental health is insignificant when you consider our annual GDP is £2900bn. Now consider that brexit has cost us 4% of annual GPD (£116bn) per year!! That's the reason income tax free thresholds has been frozen, NHS is underfunded, schools are crumbling and potholes galore.

Appreciate this post is above the heads of many, particularly if you're a Reform voter, but maybe Google for a simpler explanation..

I don't know why this is a shock given how disabled you have to be to qualify for pip

My 19 year old daughter was complaining about the amount tax that was taken from her salary. I told her where it was going to. It's not properly means tested and the Torys were slowly stripping it away. Now labour is back in 🤷‍♀️ I don't think we can afford to live like we did prior to leaving the EU. People want it to remain the same and it can't because it affects hard working people who are struggling.

The comparison between non verbal child & Chris Packham reference is specious.

you don’t get PiP based on a diagnosis.

You have to describe what additional support you need to communicate/wash/eat/move/dress.

So unless Packham needs support to communicate/wash/eat/move/dress he’s getting fuck all.

The severely autistic non verbal son on the other hand would need additional support.

I feel there's always the autistic person who wants to do "something with nature" or "be with the animals".

Agreed.

Too many people are claiming now so they wont want the money to stop coming. They will vote for an MP that keeps those taps on.

Thats one of the reasons I am pessimistic about the UK economy as a whole. Nobody seems to want to make the hard decisions (less welfare, more investment) so the managed decline continues as the demographics deteriorate.

No it won't. It's nothing new. Disability benefits claimant counts/costs have been rising since the 80s. Through Tory, Labour, Coalition, Tory and now Labour successive governments. There's been a lot of talk and promises, but nothing has actually reversed the direction of travel over nearly fifty years! Yes, Covid has massively accelerated the issue, but certainly isn't the cause.

And again PIP is not the issue. It’s such a tiny part of the bill I have no idea why people obsess over it. It is hard to get.

It’s UC that’s the big bill with nearly half of people on UC being excused having to look for any work indefinitely (LCWRA). If those are young people with anxiety as depression which are treatable conditions then that’s a scandal to write them off for life. I know this is happening as I see it quite often. Young people ‘failing to launch’ stuck at home NEET and parents enabling it.

We’ve forgotten that a degree of anxiety about a new thing is normal and good. Is anyone NOT anxious about starting a new job or going to an interview. We have to normalise some of this stuff. Also avoidance maintains and increases anxiety whilst graded exposure to the feared thing treats it. Hiding away is the last thing needed. Then they start with cannabis to ‘self medicate’ and you are really lost.