AIBU to refuse to pay cash in hand?

[Dontasksillyquestions]

This recently came up in conversation with a friend and she disagreed with me.

I generally avoid hiring anyone who asks to be paid cash in hand. I don’t see how cash is more convenient these days unless it’s to avoid tax, benefits rules, etc., and I don’t want to be involved. I also rarely carry cash and getting to a cash machine is inconvenient.

Last year I stopped using a regular gardener when he suddenly asked for cash only, despite there being no payment issues (I always transferred the money on the day he’d done the work). My friend thinks I’m being ridiculous and that it’s none of my concern how people run their business. AIBU?

My guess here is that tax evasion is OK when it is paying for little things that you want, but less OK when it is paying for your salary as a teacher.

Exactly. Like it or not in not declaring your income you’re a scuzzy little criminal.

I avoid cash in hand too as it doesn’t give me a good feeling about the person. The last person who asked for it was a tiler who then told me he sometimes went and nicked materials off the building site near his house!! I couldn’t get rid of him soon enough and we still haven’t had the tiling done either 😢 😢

Edited for clarity- The reason we haven’t had the tiling done is because we can’t find another tiler. Not because we gave him money and he scarpered.

Because the bank aren't swallowing it up the minute it hits the account, making sure they can use the cash to buy food etc

That’s my life too

ex works cash in hand so pays almost no child maintenance despite living in a 5 bedroom house, mortgage free and has 7 cars

im struggling to pay the bills on my earnings but earn “too much” for government help

But it’s actually a little ‘fuck you’ to everyone. Both as taxpayers (others pay more) and as people who rely on public services (others get less).

Chinese takeaways in Scotland (my region) don't allow card payments. It bothers me greatly, as it is so obviously a tax dodge, however paying a gardener cih, wouldn't trouble me much.

AFAIK it is perfectly legal to pay someone in cash.

It's up to them to make sure the appropriate taxes are paid.

However, very often people who demand to be paid in cash, or offer discounts for cash will not give you a receipt. This is because they do not want a paper trail that links them to ever getting the cash payment that can be used against them.

This is fine, until you want to do something like take them to the small claims court for shoddy work, or they decide to piss off halfway through the job with the cash deposit you have paid and not come back. Because you will have no sensible proof they ever been on the job.

So like most things in life, actions have consequences.

But what you are doing is not illegal, tax evasion is. The equivalent would be you asking your employer to pay you cash in hand because you can both save NI and tax.

Self employed people also have the option of paying into a pension to save tax and NI.

I always thought people prefer cash because it avoids charges and its easier etc. A bank transfer is free, but cash avoids having to chase people that promise to pay and don't.
Maybe I'm naïve, but I wouldn't automatically assume that its to dodge taxes. I know a few people who work independently in trades that pay their taxes.

But salary sacrifice IS tax evasion. that's my point, it's just a legal government backed tax evasion. My salary sacrifice not only enables me to pay less tax but also keeps me in the lower tax bracket.

Salary sacrifice means you aren't being taxed on your true salary. In my case I'm only being taxed on two thirds of my salary, which surely is ethically wrong even if it is perfectly legal?

You can sugar coat it as legal, or a smart financial decision, but let's not be naiive it's legal tax avoidance.

But salary sacrifice IS tax evasion. that's my point, it's just a legal government backed tax evasion. My salary sacrifice not only enables me to pay less tax but also keeps me in the lower tax bracket.

No it isn’t tax evasion, and It’s not tax avoidance either. It’s a tax planning scheme that works exactly as Parliament intends it to work.

@Kubricklayer exactly this.

Plus you will end up paying NI on most of that money when you take it out as pension. And it will likely mean that you are not reliant on the government in old age.

Undeclared cash is just black money. And by artificially lowering their earnings, people who do that might also be eligible for other means tested benefits either now or in old age. I’m not saying everyone does it, but it happens, it affects everyone who contributes and it’s definitely not the same as salary sacrifice either legally or morally.

Well the fact of the matter is you're making an assumption. You're assuming people that request cash in hand are not declairing it. You have not based this on any facts, just assumptions, and as PP have pointed out there's valid reasons people request cash (or example the charge incurred for every card transaction).

The other fact is your using this assumption as a primary criteria for using a business/tradesperson. Well that's foolish. Surely the primary criteria should be selecting someone who will deliver a quality product/service? Based on reviews and a proven track record.

More fool you if you want to deny yourself the possibly the best service based an assumption routed in belief and not fact.

I can’t reply to every post on the thread, but I never said anything about card payments. Transfers do not usually incur costs and it’s much more convenient for me to pay that way for ease and also to keep a record.

I also don’t have any problem if there’s an invoice and I have the option to pay cash, but that’s not what cash in hand means. In my example, there was no invoice, just a sudden and inconvenient request for cash moving forward.

I didn’t say that is the primary criterion when I select a tradesperson, that is your assumption based on…nothing. So your reading comprehension is as bad as your understanding of tax evasion.

I think the problem here is hiring someone who doesn’t want to give you an invoice, not someone who wants to be paid in cash. These are separate things and you are not better than anyone else by not understanding this/assuming things about people based on your prejudices.

If you don't approve then don't use that service. But I think there should be a choice.

I didn't say that everyone paying less tax was doing it illegally! I was pointing out that people who want cash in hand are often doing so because the payment won't show up in their books and therefore they won't get taxed on it. I pay into a pension and I have ISAs - two ways to legally lower my tax bill. If doing something entirely legal means you're taking the moral high ground, then you're on the same ground as me.

HMRC are ambivalent about people stuffing money into pensions to pay less income tax in the current tax year because that money in their pensions will be subject to income tax when that person retires and draws down that pension income. Pension stuffing isn’t avoiding the payment of income tax it’s delaying it.

"your using this assumption as a primary criteria for using a business/tradesperson"

I said 'a' primary criteria which suggests a group of factors. So the irony is it's YOUR reading comprehension that's failed.

Clearly you're using cash payments as a primary factor you've created a thread about avoiding people for this very reason. So it's clearly not an assumption base on nothing but based on your own words/actions.

Or based on the fact that £26bn of income tax was evaded by small businesses last year and the easiest way for a small business to evade tax is to take payment in cash and not declare it?

People are 100% right to be very wary of being asked to pay in cash.

I pay my hairdresser by card because the salon owner puts very little cash through the books, is massively on the fiddle and actually boasts about it. (Her SIL is a good friend of mine.) I give her a cash tip though.

Tax law is a tool which the government can use to change / encourage / discourage behaviours. Tax evasion is illegal. Tax avoidance may not be illegal yet but isn’t within the spirit of the law & is likely to become illegal once the government change the law.
Tax planning is using tax reliefs in line with the government’s intentions. So no, salary sacrifice is not tax evasion.

I agree with you OP.
I always think they’re into something. Surely cash is inconvenient for most people these days! I hate have cash lolling about

What if the gardener were chinese ?

🤔