Is this a (financially) middle class household these days or not?

[Yealp]

I don’t think so, my best friend thinks it’s completely middle class.

Income after tax per month 5,200
Household one adult and one dc
Mortgage payment 1k a month, equity 350k (4 bed detached)

I don't know why so many people get hung up on 'Class' most of us go out to work to pay for our houses, cars, lifestyle etc.

My elder sister announce that my brother and I were working class and she was middle class as she had managed to retire at 55, her husband still had to go to work though to pay a mortgage.

Meanwhile I'm 'working class' single no mortgage, £400k flat, 2 cars and my own business with about £60k savings. I could stop work but, I enjoy what I do and it gives me something to do

YAWN.

Class is not about how much you earn or lifestyle, its about how you were raised.

We live a very middle class lifestyle - decent size house and mortgage, one of us in top 5% earners, the other top 20%. Kids do plenty of activities, disposable income etc.

Both DH and I come from totally working class backgrounds and were raised in low income, working class households. I was the first in my family to go to university. We will always be working class.

Our children however, are decidedly middle class and will always be so, even if they end up being lower earners.

The salary @Yealp quotes is around £90k gross which is top 10% of earners, nearing top 5%. With £350k equity plus mortgage, the total house value is above the average, even for the south east. They are therefore middle earners - but whether they are middle class or not depends on how they were raised.

Their child is almost certainly middle class though, and I fully suspect that like us they live a middle class lifestyle.

Money has nothing to do with class, so you’ve gone wrong from the off. It’s a middle income household but impossible to tell if it is a middle class household.

with the interest rates and house prices where they are I don’t think it is huge at all. Fairly average I would think. The income of £5200 is high in my opinion, my mortgage is £800 a month and my income is £2200 (single parent household) I guess people will have different opinions depending on their own incomes.

I'm surprised at comments that say that middle class is completely divorced from income. I always assumed they were quite closely related, with a couple of exceptions.

Upper class is clearly limited to those who are aristocratic or related to peers by birth or marriage. Totally separate to income, I agree.

However, the distinction between middle class and working class I always took as being related to education or earnings and not at all related to birth. This is what encourages aspiration in the UK, that everyone is able to achieve more than they are born to.

In which case, a single parent earning almost 100k would in my mind be middle class no matter what their family or job.

I was solidly working class when I was born but I worked damn hard to where I am which I think most would consider middle class and I am not ashamed of that.

The couple of exceptions I mentioned would be those working in creative industries such as artists and actors, where income is inherently unpredictable, and in those cases I would probably emphasise the relevance of education in determining whether an impoverised artist was working or middle class, but I do see that as a flaw in my logic.

Anyhow, OP is middle class in my view, however she earns her income.

I'd say i'm firmly middle class, based on my education (2 degrees), dad's occupation and maternal grandfathers occupation, inheritance that i will get eventually.

I am immeniently going to be a single mum, mortgage of £420 per month based on £23k gross + another £10-15k that wasn't able to be included in the calculation (not onlyfans!!).

No, doesn't need to ask. Smacks of bragging to me, so seems more like little class.

It sounds comfortable enough to me for a family with only one adult & child. They have a spacious house which more than meets their needs. 350k of equity with a mortgage payment of only 1k a month implies a relatively low loan to value mortgage, a sign of financial stability. Its an affordable mortgage payment on that income and leaves enough disposable income for a decent lifestyle with hobbies, owning and running a modest car and an annual holiday. No they are not rich but how on earth is it not "financially middle class"?

Not when you have so much leftover every month . I have about £500 after bills mortgage etx

I'll bite. Only as a pensioner have I ever bust the the £1k pm &: I had a mortgage too! You're in a very nice position - be grateful.

Depends what they do to earn that much,ie their jobs, also level of education.
Some people fit in between.n. Plenty of 'middle class' are strapped for cash and live in small houses.

Does it matter?

On a facebook group for older people (who do a lot of moaning and talking about the 'good old days' with weekly tin baths and outside loos :)), a fellow poster told me I couldn't have been 'working class' because I grew up in a decent house. That's absolute nonsense. My dad was a printer all his working life. Yes our little house was decent, modest, two up two down with bathroom and toilet upstairs, kitchen down and we had gardens back and front but it was ordinary. There were many others who were 'working class' who lived the same. Not everyone 'working class' was on the breadline. I dread to think what she would have said had I mentioned we had a car!

One would hope those class distinctions were left behind by now but they are not.

I remember doing a bit of sociology at school and learning that there were lower, middle and upper working class, same with middle class. :-)

Who gives a ff?

I think the link between income and class is a circular correlation rather than causation per se - higher levels of education tend to mean the opportunity to earn more. If your parents earn more, you are more likely to be afforded extra curricular opportunities which add to education opportunities.

For example, my DD does various types of dance and the exams count towards her UCAS points - she wants to go into a very competitive field, so those extra points may give her an advantage over someone who has the same academic potential but who did not have access to the extra curricular activities.

It's also about expectations - I have no idea why my parents really encouraged me towards uni - none of my aunts and uncles on either side gave my cousins that sort of encouragement, but I don't remember a time when that wasn't their expectation for me.

It's way to complex to simply say X salary or x size house = middle class.

I couldn’t agree more with this. If you need to work to continue to maintain your life then you are working class. If you can stop working and continue on as you were then no.

£1k is not a big mortgage payment. Ours is £2.1k and I thought that was pretty low these days. I think we're only paying off £275k at that level, and that no longer buys anything round here. Our house cost a lot more than that, w@e brought equity from a previous house on which we had paid off half the mortgage.

That presumably means £1k only gets you about a £130k house?

Almost in the top 10% of household incomes in the UK.
Taking into account household size and composition (click here to see how), we have calculated your position in the income distribution.
With a household after tax income of £1162 per week, you have a higher income than around 89% of the population - equivalent to about 60.1 million individuals.

Salary of around £100k. What else is it?

Same. This countries obsession with class is so boring it’s embarrassing.

I feel this is just a showing off post

However, the distinction between middle class and working class I always took as being related to education or earnings and not at all related to birth.

I would say a degree is also in lifestyle choices and values.

If you are earning a pile as a self made scaffolder but think the pinnacle of the social season is Aintree with a hell of a lot of fake tan, filled lips, a boob job & bling, you are probably not middle class.

If you are earning a relatively modest salary as a degree educated social worker, and you value education, music & the arts, you are probably stereotypically middle class.

There are trickier borderline cases. The pupil with relatively low a-level grades who squeezes onto a degree course in golf management at a low ranking university, does not really tick the "education" box in the same way as a stem degree at manchester or bristol.

I'm confused about what you're saying it is if not middle class? Do you think owning a 4 bed home with £3k disposable income a month is working class?

Class isn’t about earnings. You can’t jump up I’m afraid. Tell us more about yourself and we’ll tell
you what class you are 😂

@Yealp
£1k mortgage for a post tax household income of over £5k is completely reasonable.
It doesn't matter that 1 person is earning it.

We have a mortgage of £2.4k - 2 people earning - are we crazy?

Does your income determine your class? I’m a higher rate tax payer but i’d never consider myself middle class now as I earn more. Like a pp said re Wayne Rooney as an example, I think your class comes more from your roots and values. I haven’t started calling tea supper just because I earn more.

Agree. I pay £1400 in rent and soon to be similar in mortgage and I earn 1k less than this example. I still save around £500 plus per month after paying bills etc. I’d like it to be less, but I live in an expensive area.