In wanting Mumsnet to help Judi Dench and Joanna Lumley

[GiantBranch]

Last week, Israel banned 37 international aid organisations from operating in the strip, including Oxfam, Save the Children and Medicine Sans Frontieres (MSF). MSF delivers one in three of Gaza’s babies, and experts warn that immediate action must be taken to prevent a catastrophe.

It has prompted more than 100 leading members of the arts, including Dames Judi Dench, Imelda Staunton, Joanna Lumley, Sienna Miller, Suranne Jones and singer Paloma Faith, to sign a letter urging popular online platform Mumsnet to join them in demanding urgent government action ensuring maternity care is accessible in Gaza.

www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/gaza-israel-baby-birth-judi-dench-letter-b2896981.html

Just wondering why you've liked my post, op? Do you now agree that women and babies are put at risk through the terrorist activities enabled through charity Trojan horses and that this complicates the simplistic narrative that Justine should just comply with this letters demands?

Or was that an accident?

It's really bad forn to say who liked your post

Meh.

Sorry misunderstood your post thought when you referred to gun runners and missile specialists in connection with maternity units you were actually joking

From what I have read Israel have sophisticated truck scanners to avoid Trojan horses

It is akin to saying because criminal surgeons exist the NHS should carry out qualification and disclosure checks on everyone applying to work in the NHS….

Yeah, I figured that you misunderstood. I'm going to leave you to it, op. I'm out of patience for the merrigoround now. Your assessment of what people should tolerate to deliver maternity care in Palestine isn't mine and I don't think that it's acceptable for celebrities to badger other women to take up the role of lobbying on their behalf. There clearly isn't a consensus on MN about what should be done. So, I'm not sure what the point of all this is now.

Exactly ... the range of comments on this thread has proved the point that there isn't a consensus in the MN community about what should be done.

The poll results show it too (542 votes so far)

46% YABU @GiantBranch
54% YANBU

Two possibilities, as far as I can see.

Either they think its beneath them, or the whole farce is being done as a political tool.

I agree. This thread demonstrates how divisive this issue is. The voting so far also shows it. I think the letter writers need to lobby the government themselves, inviting individual mumsnetters to join them if they wish.

Mumsnetters are not a blob or a hive mind of people who all think the same (unlike many people in the arts).

Yes and Oxfam being in Haiti at that time allegedly resulted in harms to underage girls which were not outweighed, in my opinion and definitely for the girls who were allegedly raped, by whatever they were doing there. The men allegedly paying underage girls for sex were propping up a system of child abuse and exploitation - they were doing the opposite of helping those children.

The Charity Commision "raised concerns that Oxfam’s handling of these matters was influenced by a “desire to protection the charity’s reputation and to protect donor and stakeholder relationships”" (quote from Oxfam failed to act on reports its workers were raping girls as young as 12, damning report concludes | The Independent | The Independent )

Giving money to a charity or supporting them with your voice doesn't necessarily mean they do good as a result especially if there's a certain trend around what they're supposed to say which might affect donations or PR. That's why I try and do due diligence for all charities I support. Everyone needs to do that as an individual, as everyone will have different boundaries and concerns. Justine can't speak for all of us.

The basic principle of safeguarding is that bad people will seek positions of trust in order to abuse. That's why EVERYONE needs to be checked. That's why you can't just accept someone or an organisation saying 'hey I'm the good guy here!' about themselves - statements from MSF saying they have no terrorists in their ranks means sweet f a especially when they're churning out self evidently one-sided PR . It needs to be verified (ideally independently, although it seems hard to find anyone with any true independence in this war)

Although remember the votes will be confused because some people may be voting on the Gaza issue and others on the outrageous way in which the request was made

Such hyperbole. FWR are familiar with people suggesting people or at least those with big platforms to also focus on other feminist issues and rightly remind people that caring about X doesn't mean you don't care about anything else. Yet you're slinging a completely baseless insult and accusations that people "don't give a shit" about Afghanistan because they're talking about Palestine on a topic relevant to Palestine. And you yourself apparently care so much about Afghan women when you're using them as a stick to beat people talking about Palestine but can't actually be bothered to start a thread or an open letter or anything or the other things you claim the celebs or OP should be doing. On two separate threads as well - you care so much that people shouldn't support this cause yet notice no one's actually said you don't "give a shit about Palestinian women" here. The hypocrisy is hilarious.

I agree @Genericfestiveusername Telling someone that they don’t care about this that or the other has become so popular on Mumsnet, particularly when that person has shown that they do care about something. It’s truly bizarre.

PP was being ironic.

FWR is familiar with people calling us bigots, fascists, vipers, hyenas, and various other names, posting in bad faith, making lists of regular posters, and even obsessive spreadsheets, attacking and smearing us at every turn.

We're also familiar with manipulation, coercion, politicisation, and forced teaming.

If there's one thing that doesn't crop up much if ever on FWR, it's celebrities virtue signalling, because feminism on FWR and Mumsnet in general is down to earth, grassroots, and very individual.

There is a lot of disagreement on this thread.

I only wish there was this much diversity of opinion in the arts. But the hive mind is such that people in the arts are compelled to all think alike for fear of being shunned (ie losing work).

PP was being ironic @ArabellaScott

Didn't read as ironic to me either.

And you know the intention of PP how? The irony isn't obvious...

because feminism on FWR and Mumsnet ..is very individual

Of course, that's why you all repeat the same right wing talking points on every issue. Or so individual you can mind read PPs intended irony that's not evident in her posts.

The same right wing talking points? There's nowhere on the Internet that's less of an echo chamber than mumsnet.

Women’s rights and safeguarding are right wing talking points?

So why are posters so insistent on derailing a thread by insisting posters talking about something else? If this isn't an echo chamber why can't a discussion about Palestinian women's needs go on without personal attacks to shut people up? Coincidentally many of the FWR posters who not only are derailing this thread with their faux concern for Afghan women but not enough concern to take an action on except to admonish OP and others for not caring simply because they're staying on topic. I'm sure they all individually formed their own opinions on many topics that just happen to align with the right wing rags on Israel, Reform, Islam etc it's all just a big coincidence

Nope, just funny that a subset of people with a particular opinion of women's rights and safeguarding also always end up parroting the same lines that are all over right wing twitter on every other issue as well including shutting down any other concern about women's rights and safeguarding.

Would it help you support Palestinians women's healthcare if we told you they might be treated in mixed sex tents or that Palestinian children are being given puberty blockers?apparently those are the instances when everyone has a duty to speak up.

We have been "parroting" dozens of remarks, considerations and thoughts relevant to this thread.

You are parroting one same line.

Who is the parrot?

I'm reading the thread and I see people here expressing different points of view. There's no shutting down going on.

A reminder of the title of this thread:

”In wanting Mumsnet to help Judi Dench and Joanna Lumley”

Judi Dench and Joanna Lumley are not Palestinian.