To be shocked that not even one y4 child knew the meaning of the word velvet?

[Utterlybananas333]

My sister is a teacher in a South London primary school, she is a year four teacher of around 30 8 to 9-year-olds. She was recently describing her disbelief over the fact that not a single child knew what velvet meant? There were some crazy guesses, and lots of children who thought it was cake (probably relating to red velvet). Is it just the fact that children and adults don't talk anymore? That nobody reads anymore? Or even watches educational TV programs? Would your child know?

If a child has come across the word used in the way I did in my example ie to describe the texture of an animal’s fur, for the sake of argument, and understands it in that context, then I would consider that they have had their vocabulary widened by that reading, and, if I were teaching them, I would judge that they basically ‘know’ the word, even if they can’t give a full dictionary definition of it.

I’m not sure where it gets us to draw a distinction between those, like your daughter, who know it’s describing a soft texture, and those who know it’s a fabric. So what?

I might add that those who come across it through reading other than in the context of the actual fabric, are likely to ask someone what it means/ work out for themselves through context that it comes from an actual fabric.

I’m not talking down children who don’t know it, btw, or saying that it automatically means that they don’t read much. Of course not! I’m just talking about likelihoods, and making the rather obvious point that reading widens the vocabulary.

DH and I have foisted some Blackadder onto our kids, I’m proud to say!

’A turnip of my own’.

’A great big turnip out in the country’.

I think kids prob wear less smart clothes now too. When I was little I had a purple velvet Xmas dress so knew the word when I was 5 or 6. my nieces wouldn't be seen dead in a velvet Xmas dress and want Xmas jumpers or hoodies... so that's another opportunity not to learn a word apart from reading !!

I had a purple velvet long waistcoat with pom pom tues when l was about 7🫣

I'm sure you're very lovely, but this post made me scream silently and want to punch walls! 🤣 I'm 47 and when I was 10 shopping my uniform for high school we went to very posh Lord Street in Southport. My Nan came with us, I think because my Mum didn't have any idea about where to buy good clothes, and Nan spent all day saying (in utter distaine) "But she needs a gabardine" whenever I tried on a coat that was anything like modern. She never explained apart from phrases like "What's a gabardine? Better than that trash you want to wear, that's what!". We spent all day traipsing up and down Lord Street and never found one. I just felt utterly dejected like I was very wrong and ignorant for not knowing, and pathetic for not desiring one. I didn't, and still don't, have a clue what a gabardine is. My Nan and you, are the only times in my life I have EVER heard that word.

For anyone interested, my Mum eventually let me buy a lovely plain black peachskin drawstring waist coat from George at Golborne Asda that was just wonderfully cosy. And I felt like an absolute catwalk model wearing it with my brown school uniform.

This was a gaberdine.

Came in green, navy or brown.

They were horrible. They sometimes had a hood attached.

DD teaches reception, she commented over Christmas that barely a single child in her class knew Jingle bells/ Rudolph etc

I bet you went into Boothroyds, or was it Broadbents by then? 😊

Yes, a gabardine is a particular style of belted mac, so called because it’s made (or was, originally) out of gabardine fabric.

I've come over here from the other thread and haven’t read all of this one yet - I only wanted to say immediately that velvet is not a 'random', 'outdated' fabric, as so many people are scornfully calling it! For goodness sake - it still exists; it can be bought and clothes and sofas are made out of it. When I was a child I read books in which people wore velvet dresses (eg Ballet Shoes - a classic) and I doubt I'd ever seen velvet, but I learned what it meant because that’s how children come to widen their vocabulary and their understanding.

Which ‘other thread’?

Would your children know these words? | Mumsnet
This is the other thread, which I started, because it's fascinating how certain words which were once commonplace are less well-known now.

Ah, thanks.

Words can also change meaning over time. Eg a 'bonet' was a man's hat at one time.

'Wireless' is how.my grandparents listened to news in WW2. Now we tend to use it about our Internet connections.

We also change the way we describe things. My grandparents would catch a train, they would not say 'steam train' because all trains were.

Now if you catch the train you expect diesel or electric, if a steam train turned up you would remark on it.

TV I'm old enough to remember when that meant black and white.

Fancy word for this is schema.

I probably learnt those in school as well - primary school singing taught me all the hymns and carol and christmas songs - C of E primary - they also did a few folk songs and few 60s pop songs though heard a few of those in life. I wasn't really hearing them elsewhere else much.

As an adult has been useful to know a few of the more famous hyms/carol songs as been to often more formal evenst where singing them is expected.

I thought it was surprising my DC who first went to a C of E school did a mix of hyme/carol songs and pop songs - they said pop sonsg were needed to keep kids interest. When we moved it became just one or two carrol songs, welsh songs - useful - and much more modern pop songs.

Eyebrows were raised when they had young kids sing Fairy Tale in New York - a song set at christams rather than a christmas song - keeping the contrversal f word and slut in - I think many in audicence would have preferred anything else.

I have wonderd though if hyms are slowly dying out as they get sung less in modern primary schools.

It’s awful fabric to sew……yes, I know it makes fabulous evening wear and looks beautiful with the nap in reverse but it is a bugger to sew!

Well, I had to look up ‘nap’ used in that context. You never stop learning 😀

I must admit I’m still confused though. Is the nap not the downy side? Why does it look better in reverse?

Sorry, I should have been more explicit……..the nap falls in one direction, with it pointing downwards the velvet is paler, with it pointing upwards the velvet takes on a richer, darker shade.

I see! Thank you very much.

Material of yesteryear? I'm wearing it now. You talk as if it's sackcloth.

“Saginaw” is still one of my favourite words.

@Bingbangboo @Differentforgirls

Only from the reference in Simon and Garfunkel's 'America'. I'm not sure if that is better, or worse?

Oh, it occurs to me that I only know about organdy from a Paul Simon song too.

I’m now on the hunt for other fabrics mentioned later in his career.

This is why I love being retired.

Tipping the Velvet ????