Trail hunting ban - would you hunt the "clean boot"?

[BootHunter]

Horsey people - with the talk of an upcoming ban on trail hunting, would you consider joining a clean boot hunt as an alternative?

YANBU - Yes
YANBU - No

IF YOU DON'T KNOW THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN TRAIL HUNTING AND CLEAN BOOT HUNTING THEN GOOGLE IT!

I'm a horse owner but I do not hunt because all there is locally to me is "trail hunting" packs. However, if there was a legitimate bloodhound pack hunting human quarry then I absolutely would join, and I can think of several friends who would too.

I personally feel that this could be a great opportunity for the local hunts to evolve into something that more people want to take part in, and probably the only thing that will stop the whole industry from closing down altogether.

Very interesting, but of course blood hounds are not foxhounds.

Well you’re going to die of something so shall we just send a pack of hounds to chase you for the morning and then rip you limb from limb? I mean you’re going to die anyway. Maybe from cancer and have a slow death so we’d do you a favour I guess.

It sounds like you’ve been consuming too much propaganda produced by saboteurs, but that aside, the answer is better trail hunting. Better routes, better scent etc. The people involved aren’t blood thirsty fox murderers. They just want the way of life to survive for the foxhounds and riders.

There’s no evidence that trail hunting is being widely abused.

This isn’t true. There was a documentary a few years back where they had a MFH and others openly talking about how they use it as a smokescreen. They still take terrier men with them (for what if they aren’t hunting a fox?). I have personally witnessed a fox being hunted and have spoken with the local police officer assigned to liaise with the hunts, and she also confirmed that they actively seek out foxes.

Duplicate post

not at all, there’s enough non biased evidence on mainstream news or caught on camera that there’s no need to consume any propaganda. This is just a small amount of all the verifiable evidence

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c93q8nzevyvo

https://www.lincolnshirelive.co.uk/news/local-news/dog-dies-after-new-years-3698298

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cxwv7ryxrz2o

https://protectthewild.org.uk/news/breaking-three-arrested-after-fox-killed-in-residential-garden/

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c3vn4ryq27do

So maybe Lincolnshire hunt need to tighten up their protocols. It doesn’t mean you can tar everyone with the same brush. It’s better to find constructive ways forward, not make people feel their way of life is under attack.

this isn’t just the odd rogue person or hunt. It’s systemic. I’d say that all trail hunts are operating illegally. Getting the evidence to prove that is obviously harder. It needs to be caught on camera and by the very nature of the activity that’s hard to do. I hear sabs are starting to use drones so hopefully that will help gather evidence.

https://www.theforester.co.uk/news/leicestershire-man-boasted-of-illegal-fox-hunt-in-hartpury-court-hears-582767

https://www.oxfordmail.co.uk/news/24217244.oxfordshire-company-man-charged-foxhunting/

Have you read the links, that’s five different hunts! So no actually “Lincolnshire hunt” don’t need to tighten their protocols. Hunts need to stop illegally chasing foxes.

“way of life under attack”. Give your head a wobble. 🤣

You’re right about a constructive way forward though.

and banning trail hunting but allowing bloodhounds and a clean boot will achieve that. So sounds like you’ll be happy with that. You could still ride horses around the countryside so what’s the problem?

Glad to see it's dying. The foxes sadly still get caught up in the pretend form of not hunting them, and ripped to bits. It's barbaric. Needs to die out with badger bating, Cock fighting, dog fighting etc. All disgusting.

I think that's general across the board. Pheasant shooting is waning. The younger generation are busier, have less spare money to pay for a gun. DH says that the three shoots he's helped out at the guns were all pensioners.

As I said. I don’t ride any more and never hunted. I’m afraid you are letting this issue take up too much space in your head, when there are far worse examples of animal cruelty occurring every day that deserve far more attention. If you send that many links you can’t expect them all to be read. I got the gist. I also know people involved who prefer trail hunting to the old fox hunting precisely because there is no kill. This idea that they are all secretly trying to murder foxes is utter tosh. Suggesting an aesthetically similar sport involving a different breed of dog shows complete distain for those people and the dogs. But the reality is that the main motivation for saboteurs is not animal welfare. It’s hatred. Hatred of country people.

Well I am a country person. And horsey. And used to work as a groom at a hunt yard.

so please don’t believe the propaganda that anti hunt people are doing it because they hate the countryside.

and people can be against all sorts of animal cruelty. Just because there’s other types going on doesn’t mean we should ignore a smaller one.

yes, I did post a number of links because I knew if I just posted one someone would say (as you did) well it’s one rogue hunt. When it’s widespread

I'm delighted by this proposal and think it's long overdue. It's probably the first thing this government have announced that has pleased me. Hunts have been using the guise of trail hunting to get away with illegally hunting foxes for far too long.

It makes me laugh when pro-hunt people claim it's a viable method of keeping the fox population down. I live in Sussex on the edge of miles of open countryside. I've seen far fewer foxes in the 30-odd years I've lived here than I did in an average year when I lived in Croydon, Streatham or South Norwood.

If hunting was about keeping fox numbers down, hunts would have been hunting in cities.

Getting back on track, I think clean boot is a great compromise and I'm surprised it's not more widespread. Perhaps the hunt meets can team up with the local park run to offer an extreme option for runners interested in a challenge?

I would volunteer.

There are 3 large estates near me that used to have several days shooting a year. They're down to single figures now.

I went beating on one once, and was shocked to find out that the pheasants were mostly slung in a pit and buried. No-one wants them, they're bred purely for the "sport" of shooting.

Hubby would love to be a runner as well. He does ultra marathons so would be good training.

No, because I don’t really like the hunt. They aren’t very respectful of landowners or other horse riders/dogs. Someone local to me nearly had to have their horse put down the other day when it got surrounded by the hounds that the hunt couldn’t control. I’ve had the hounds trample through my garden, chase my livestock, etc. I’m a country person with horses, but I don’t like the entitlement.

What will happen to the fox hounds? The packs are not covertly killing foxes. Plus we are overrun with foxes so most will be shot anyway. Trail hunts exist to allow riders a good day out over countryside they don’t normally have permission to ride over. Could comprise hedges, ditches, banks and rides through woodland. It’s a great day out.

I don't agree with hunting but trying to find a marksman who doesn't cost a small fortune round us, is like trying to find a pot of gold at the end of a rainbow. We haven't had a local hunt for years and the foxes are breeding like billy-o.

So you end up with local farmers taking pot shots at the foxes who are ripping through their poultry, despite all their fortifications. Other put poison down.

Having watched them, the foxes literally wander in and out during the day causing absolute carnage and £1000's of damage.

I don't know what the answer is, but unchecked foxes are a huge problem for farmers - particularly the ones trying to do the right thing by their birds and keeping them free range/organic.

Or in the case of the belvoir hunt, trapping and breeding foxes, something they are still actively doing.

With respect you don't ride or hunt any more so you don't know what goes on....There are unfortunately many traditional hunts which have used trail hunting as a means to continue to hunt foxes and this is wholly wrong.
Perhaps weirdly I have a good friend who is a very active hunt sab. I've met her friends...."Oh what do you do with your horse?" Well I really like hunting! 😱🤣🙈 However I treat them with respect, I don't antagonise. In turn they do fully understand clean boot/drag and they respect that these packs are not the issue. From what I have witnessed where the bloodhound and drag packs engage with monitors with honesty and a bit of kindness (I understand on the rare occasion they appear they get a welcome glass of port, map, briefing on who's going where and a ride on the quad if they want) then it's all very cordial and they go away happy. I have been out over 30 meets with drag/clean boot packs. Never seen sabs. Meeting hated with hated only perpetuates the situation. The hunting community needs to swallow some humble pie and seriously re evaluate how it acts going forward if it is to survive. We need to concede we need to work with monitors, offer the scrutiny, build those relationships and legitimately drag/clean boot hunt. Otherwise riding with hounds will be gone forever.

One sometimes sees Wolfhounds although there are no wolves around .

I think Wolf hounds evolved into being guard dogs a very long time ago. Maybe their temperament made them good for both functions.