To think Jeremy Bamber might be innocent

[KimberleyClark]

Or that at the very least his conviction wasn’t safe and there needs to be a retrial? Ihe was convicted in 1985 of murdering his adoptive parents, sister and her twin sons at his parents’ farmhouse. It was at first deemed to be murder-suicide by the sister, Sheila Caffell, who was a diagnosed schizophrenic. Bamber had been on full life tarriff ever since and still protesting his innocence. I always assumed he was guilty until I listened to a podcast called Blood Family. There was a lot of evidence the jury didn’t hear, it seems the police mucked up the crime scene, his cousins had a financial motive for framing him and a police officer in the control room apparently took a 999 nonspeaking call from the farmhouse while Bamber was outside with the police, which would indicate someone was still alive at that point.

Quite. Wrong profile, wrong physique, wrong everything.

Yes the police were crap and the cousins potentially venal, and the girlfriend possibly unreliable, but I think Bamber does fit the profile.

It was a male crime carried out by a physically fit male who knew the house well. Bamber had a motive.

Is Bamber still talking about a hired hitman?

I don't know enough about the case to really have a view, but anybody who has followed the Hillsborough case or any other miscarriages of justice from that era knows that the police had a very relaxed relationship with the truth and evidence protocols in the 80s.

I feel both they he's guilty, but that his actual conviction is unsafe due to the errors made by the police.

There is no possibility if this as Essex Police burned any evidence there was despite being ordered not to. They also have repeatedly refused to release any further information they have that remains undisclosed.

Psychopaths and sociopaths are different and separate diagnosis that have never been found to coexist with each other so I have no concerns about him not being a psychopath.
I.have already covered your other points

Sociopath is not a diagnosis, just another informal word for the same traits as ASPD. In the UK we tend to use psychopath as the informal term but that’s not a diagnosis either. Bamber has never been diagnosed as having ASPD so is neither a psychopath nor a sociopath.

The courts are probably more informed than the podcasters, who will want to get people to debate it

You know we'd been to the moon by then, don't you?

Yes, but most people in the UK didn’t possess one. Wouldn’t they have been bulky and very noticeable?

What has space travel got to do with phone logs?

The best book I have read on this case is "Murders at the White House Farm" by Carol Ann Lee - the ITV series was based on that and I would encourage anyone to read it if you're interested in the case. I think he is guilty but as is very often the case, there were mistakes made during the investigation as well. The one common denominator in virtually all cases where there is 'uncertainty' is usually shoddy police work, removal or destroying of evidence, etc. They simply focused too much and too long on blaming Sheila.

Carol Ann Lee also wrote "The Life and Death of Myra Hindley", which was a brilliant read but now out of print.

Police were dodgy as hell, crime scene comprised and vital evidence lost.
Key evidence against him from people who had financial motive for him to be found guilty.
Lack of solid non circumstantial forensic evidence.
I think if there was a retrial there would be a good chance he would be found not guilty.
However, I also think him being the killer is the most likely explanation and if he is the killer letting him out could be extremely dangerous.
I wouldn’t be surprised if it happened but not as the police say and he knows they are lying but not in a way he can admit without giving himself away.
We will probably never know for certain.

I think that his conviction is unsafe due to police incompetence. And that’s enough to think that it’s only fair he gets a retrial.

I think that's the most likely scenario.

Totally agree with this - Bamber snagged on to elements of the investigation to deflect from those that solidly point to him. Of which there are many.

I have doubts about Luke Mitchell too.

Who is BTK?

The one constant is JB saying he didn’t do it among a zillion wobbly bits of evidence.

The whole family were very odd, and not in a good way. Mummy was an obsessive who was fixated by demons; Sheila not surprisingly was very, very delusional and couldn’t be left alone with her children who were frightened of her. JB GF was a dope dealer. JB was a burglar.

Dennis Rader, serial killer. BTK - Bind, Torture, Kill.

Why exactly are you revisiting this OP?

I remember following the case very closely as it played out in the media in real time and I watched The farmhouse murders when it was aired on TV.

To my mind I don't see any doubt that the correct person is behind bars and I wonder what your motive is for starting this thread.

I lived in the area at the time and don’t remember anyone thinking for a second he wasn’t guilty.

Sheila Caffell couldn’t conceivably have overcome her father, nor could she have shot herself with the shotgun. Who else other than Baumber had any motive to kill the family?

Why would it be perfectly fine to watch a tv show about a murder case but anyone starting a thread to talk about it instead must have a dubious motive?

I agree. He’s a terrible judge of character and easily won over. I love his documentaries but he has no guile at all.

PS - and Michael Jackson

What does trouble me a lot is that it seems that in this country, once convicted of a crime it is nigh on impossible to get that conviction overturned.

Bamber is one of a few who I think could well be innocent.

My recollection of the Theroux programme on Savill is that in fact it was very clever given that at the time Savill was very lawyered up and broadcasters were terrified about provoking him into legal action. So Theroux basically led him into exposing himself. Obviously he wasn’t going to reveal his paedophilia, but he came over as deeply disturbed and weird, and certainly not the benevolent uncle type that he wanted to portray.