To report the cleaner

[EmotionalLimbo]

I'm a PhD student and work in a doctoral school office with several other researchers, all doing our own thing. It's a wonderful quiet space and we're very lucky.

Well quiet that is until the bins are emptied every afternoon. I'm not sure if the person who comes in is a cleaner because I've never seen her do any cleaning in this office but she might do in other parts of the building.

She's just so loud. She's talking on the phone using Bluetooth earpieces so it looks like she's talking to herself. It's so distracting and it's not a work conversation because it's a foreign language.

I've contacted the estates people to ask them to tell her to stop as it's annoying everyone but nobody dare say anything. It's not my job to tackle her.

AIBU?

You sound as though you like things the way you like things. From what you say there are people who are neurodiverse in your department too which may be impacting the tolerance level for this person who is trying to do her job.

I can see what the previous poster said about punching down and it does seem a little bit like that but I honestly don't think it's your groups intention.

Talk about it among yourselves and perhaps prepare a few sentences asking the person to be a little quieter. There's no need to mention research or PhDs or anything like that, it's not important in what you are describing.

Possibly something along the lines of

Hello we are a group of students who study in this space. We really appreciate the work that you do and it is good to be able to work in clean conditions so thank you so much.

We have to concentrate quite hard on the work that we do and it can be very easy to become distracted when someone comes into the space or there are loud noises and people speaking.

We wondered if it would be possible for you not to take phone calls when you are in this space and try to be as quiet as possible? We are sorry to ask but we would be very grateful.

Perhaps give her the note with a box of chocolates or something and a big smile. Also make sure you acknowledge her with a smile when she does come in to do her work. Every single person has an equal role to play whether it's the Dean, the cleaner, professors or security guards.

It will be better coming from you than her boss.

I am going to say you are being VFuckingU

My mum has a cleaning company. Recently, she was asked to consider sacking one of her staff because he was talking to himself whilst he worked. It was dressed up as some "welfare concern", but the reality as that they just didn't want him there. He is actually a good cleaner. The person complaining just didn't want to hear him.

Being a cleaner is shit. I have cleaned offices, and it is usually after all the actual office staff have gone home. I have had complaints for hoovering by the staff that have stayed behind. Complaints that I did not clean their desk, but I could not because they were still there and would not let me clean.
Got a bollocking for being there in the morning, when the lady complaining was turning up super early. I mean, who turns up for their 9-5 at 6am?

"Hello we are a group of students who study in this space. We really appreciate the work that you do and it is good to be able to work in clean conditions so thank you so much.
We have to concentrate quite hard on the work that we do and it can be very easy to become distracted when someone comes into the space or there are loud noises and people speaking.
We wondered if it would be possible for you not to take phone calls when you are in this space and try to be as quiet as possible? We are sorry to ask but we would be very grateful.
Perhaps give her the note with a box of chocolates or something and a big smile. Also make sure you acknowledge her with a smile when she does come in to do her work."

That's a bit too much like walking on eggshells that it birders on patronizing...
FGS, no one is suggesting: "Oi! Shut it!"
(Although, a strong New York accented, Hey, I'm workin' over here!" is appealing."

Seriously, OP doesn't need to beg. It is her space. The cleaner is thoughtless and/or lacking awareness and respect.

Nobody is asking for anyone to be sacked. Nobody is asking for anyone to get a bollocking.

Wow these replies. So much anger!!

I think I can understand the issue - you’re probably concentrating and she’s being unnecessarily loud which is actually rude. You wouldn’t walk into a meeting talking loudly on a personal call everyday. So why is it ok in this space.

she can still do her job - just take her calls in another space.

is it the same time each day?

EmotionalLimbo, I dunno what you’ve done to deserve such a tidal wave of peculiarly odd replies. Some folks only seem to come here to argue 🤷‍♀️
I hope you achieve a pleasant atmosphere in your workspace 💐

Why can't you just ask her to be quieter or not make personal telephone calls in a quiet office space? That would be a much better and simpler approach.

Nobody is stepping up as an actual adult and asking if she can keep the noise down 🙄

omg, this is exactly like the cleaner in my office. She always talks loud on the phone. Every day! Who could she be talking to every single day?? I find it disrespectful because when she comes to the office at 5pm there are still people in the office who are working, tired after a day of work, trying to focus and finish work

I'm entirely on your side OP.

Is it ideal? No. But I wouldn't report her. In most shared offices you'd expect a bit of talking (though as PP have mentioned, I haven't seen a bin emptied in an office for years), including academic ones, so I suspect she's thinking of the space as an office rather than a silent study space. You could try talking to her if it bothers you that much.

you could have just taken a minute to speak to her.
to the people saying she will not be dismissed, that is not true.
she could technically have her employment terminated under SOSR (some other substantial reason).some people are just more loud its the way they communicate and things could have been better resolved by going up to the person and having a quit word, as opposed to reporting.
some some employers especially cleaning companies love to have complaints for clients( the service users) and use it to get rid of employees or move them to a different workplace ( longer commute, harder tasks)

you have already reported so no point in coming on here to ask for opinions.

The point many people seem to be missing is not that some people are naturally loud. It's having personal conversations every single day in a loud and animated fashion in the workplace.

Does everyone do that? It seems to be normalised here. If I was to go to the IT department for something and phone a friend and start chatting loudly, would that be fine? By this reckoning it seems like it would.

No that is not fine.

It is so obvious from the tone of voice if someone is on the phone on a personal call, particularly in a quiet office. I share an office and my office mate would not dream of carrying on a personal call for more than a few minutes (to deal with whatever personal issue it is that needs her to be on the phone to deal with).

If someone needed to be on a longer personal call, they would leave the office to find a quiet room and shut the door.

The cleaner should respect the norms in the same way in a shared workspace. If she does not 'get it', then the appropriate person to speak to her is her manager.

Town and Gown.

We need Morse for this.

He would get to the bottom of it all.

I suspect the plot for this episode involves a love triangle, a handsome young athletic undergrad with a billionaire father, and the bodies are in the bins.

And Morse falls for the sophisticated PhD supervisor.

If the university have arranged cleaners to be in attendance during the working day, there isn't much you can do about it. Just put your headphones in with white noise on them.

If you push it, you could well end up with no cleaner and be asked to keep your own work area clean instead.

You sound massively over entitled. Just be thankful she's emptying your bin.

As I work in a school I guess I have loud teenagers around me from 8am until 4pm. The only peace I get is a 30 minute break. So a talking cleaner would go right over my head….

“A grown adult needing countless other adults, to tell them how to deal with a very ordinary problem.”

And a PhD candidate to boot! Op, at your level academic institutions usually describe people undertaking research as candidates rather than students. But the fact that you see yourself this way is perhaps quite revealing.

You still haven't answered my question about whether you work in a designated and signposted 'quiet area' with clear notices about respecting the quiet space or whether you and your colleagues have just mutually agreed that your working space will be quiet.

If it is the former, you are reasonable to be annoyed. I would still have raised the issue with the cleaner directly which would be easy as you could point to the signs that she is clearly ignoring.

If it is the latter, you are definitely being unreasonable to go straight to her manager with your complaint. If your University uses an outsourced rather than an in-house cleaning company, they are more likely to just end her contract.

I saw Tom Chambers as Morse recently, he'd sort it.

@thepariscrimefiles Sorry miss. I'll try to do better.

Actually I don't know if there are signs I've never thought about it. We were all told this at induction though, as I expect those in years 2 and 3 were too. I do know that the university employs its own estates and cleaning staff and they're not outsourced. I also know that they're likely to have a quiet word or incorporate into a training session or similar. If this is the first time anything has been said especially so.

Totally different work space though isn’t it!!! You chose a busy loud environment.

And what does that reveal about me then?! Other than I prefer not to use the term candidate? And what's that got to do with the noise issues? (My ID card says student btw)

There's a mix of students candidates some of whom are 21/22, graduated in summer with an integrated masters and aren't confident to go and speak to the cleaner.

Some also don't want to be accused of anything. One nasty poster here which I can see has been removed called me a racist snob.

I don't understand what's embarrassing (for either the cleaner or yourself) about politely asking her to be quieter? I'm a non confrontational introvert, but will think nothing of politely asking the kids at work to turn down their music when they're standing by my desk as I find it annoying.

I think e-mailing her boss should be a last resort once someone in the office has explained the issue to her. If noone wants to speak to her, perhaps put up some 'quiet workspace' posters with a no mobile phones image and see if that helps.

Cool. Do you like my plot ?

I thought about padding it out a bit. The cleaner is a stunning eastern European, links to the Russian mafia. The PhD student, mousey, naive , both battling for the affections of previously mentioned billionaires son.

I thought if we bring the Russian mafia in, it could lead to Morse becoming frustrated as MI5 get in his way.

The episode could be called" "SILENCE in the halls".

:-)

It's a different relationship you have with your students though isn't it? We're talking about a 50-ish woman.