Middle earners punished

[Eucalyptus321]

I am feeling so disheartened and frustrated by how middle earners are constantly suffering at the hands of ridiculous government priorities. My husband and I have a greater household income than other families we know but have less cash in hand due to increased taxes coupled with the fact we receive zero benefits like child benefit or tax free childcare etc. ZERO. If they want middle earners to fund the country thought tax then at least support us with childcare costs. It’s a joke that two parents earning £99k each get childcare funding but parents with one £101k salary and one £25k salary receive nothing. I just need to speak to people who understand the burden of raising a family amidst the current financial climate and then the potential of further tax rises!

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OP you seem to be saying…
you are worse off than others because you earn more,
poor people can’t possibly understand your problem,
you’d like new cars and holidays every end of term like your neighbours.

Astonishingly crass. Im in your income bracket and I thank my lucky stars every day.

Local authority spending:

22%child social care
39% adult social care
39% everything else.

Just because there are poorer people out there compared to the OP, doesn’t mean that the OP’s difficulties aren’t valid… Evetyone is struggling in this economy except the ultra rich and large corporations.

It’s why we left the UK OP - Yanbu

Tough love? The government tried to reduce winter fuel payment for pensioners - up to £300 annual reduction - and people were up in arms. They tried to change the criteria for disability payments and people were up in arms. There’s no appetite for “tough love” - everyone wants what they want. The welfare safety net has become a hammock for people to rest in - always a reason why they particularly can’t work or work more.

Reform have no more ideas of how to solve this than anyone else does.

Totally agree!

VAT on school fees is wrong on so many levels. Education is not a luxury and should not be taxed.

I was state educated and genuinely believed that the education part was comparable to the independent sector, the benefit in independent school being the extra curricular. Sadly that's not always the case, not all children have access to a good state school and the state education system simply doesn't work for all.

We moved our eldest to a small independent primary school in KS2 for a number of reasons. She genuinely thrived in the smaller environment and was then offered a place at a state grammar for secondary.

Long story short it transpired she is ASD, only diagnosed as a teenager. She herself acknowledges that she isn't remotely suited to state school, the environment is anxiety inducing and she subsequently hates school having previously loved it and been happy - she isn't alone, there are many children in the same position who don't even make it into school as a result. My daughter acknowledges that a special school wouldn't be good for her academically (not that she stands any chance of being offered a place) and independent school, a smaller environment where she would feel safe, is no longer an affordable option.

So, you have a situation where she has a place in an over subscribed state grammar school being paid for by the state. Whereas we would have moved her back into the independent sector, removing the cost to the state and enabling another child her place, instead that option isn't available. How anyone can think that's a good outcome is beyond me.

The money raised by VAT hasn't even been spent on improving state schools - and the number of pupils moving from independent to state is far higher than expected

The independent school my daughter attended has 8 in reception this year - this is less than half the usual number. The other local independent school has similarly depleted numbers.

Politics based upon envy is 100% about securing votes and stands no chance of achieving growth which is what is actually needed.

The sell off of around 2 million council properties with vast discounts has cost billions. The estimated total value of houses sold off since 1980 is around 450 billion.
then add the selling off of utilities and privatization of services such as children’s care. It’s disastrous. The infrastructure is decimated. And Thatcher helped slash manufacturing in favour of the City and financial sector . We don’t make much here anymore.

Tough love is needed though. I think the electorate are sick of trundling along with piss poor public services because the government are too gutless to point out that certain things are totally and utterly unaffordable.

I think this is the point of all the frustration. I am not a high earner and not affected by this particular taxation, but in general I do feel it's somewhat unfair that I work hard and pay tax, as does DH, and we have one child, when there are families with far more children not working and getting money from the state (which gets it's money from me and others who pay tax). The socialist in me thoroughly approves of the benefits system, but there's also a part of me that wonders how we can expect anyone, especially our young adults, to be aspirational and work hard when they look at the consequences of doing so.

Relevance of this?

And all of these sell offs (and things like the gradual reduction in defence spending over the years) paid for generous benefits and low taxes in the past. We now have nothing left to sell off, we need to increase defence spending and people have got used to being handed out endless benefits. It’s very hard to see how we can row back from this when Labour have no interest whatsoever in tough love.

Who pays the rent is it the government or money given to them?

@Eucalyptus321 - I completely understand what you are saying! We were in the same bracket as you. By the time we decided to have children we were already outside the bracket where you can get child benefit. So you feel like you put a lot in society but don’t get as much in return and each budget you worry how is this going to affect your family. It’s not easy.

Government.

It was the electorate who were screaming about winter fuel and disability benefits. The electorate are sick of paying tax, the electorate also don’t want to be personally affected by any welfare cuts - both things can be true at the same time.

It was the rebel MPs moaning about winter fuel payments. These rebel MPs really don’t seem to have a clue. Most pensioners aren’t selfish idiots and realise if you’re on over £20k pension a year with no housing costs you don’t need an extra £300 to pay for heating. Clearly.

It was the media and the public. Nothing to do with back bench MPs. It was only last year, we all remember it.

See it wasn’t the actual pensioners though. It was the media hubbub. The tories. The Daily Mail. A research body actually queried ‘boomers’ about this and the majority understood that it was unaffordable and paid for by their children and grandchildren who were unable to afford it and it was intergenerationally unfair.

Which shows why this country’s politics are sunk. Sensible ideas cannot pass through parliament without lobby groups overthrowing them.

And those rebel MPs were responding to representation from their constituents. And in here people were going crazy at the thought of loosing winter fuel allowance. As soon as any proposed cut impacts the individual instead of some vague group people kick back.

Winter fuel allowance = pensioners will due
Change in disability criteria = disabled people will die, everyone hates us and no one ever games the system
Earn too much for child benefit = appalling, leaving children in poverty etc etc

Everyone wants something and no one wants to pay for it.

We obviously move in different circles - pensioners I know we’re talking about freezing in their homes, heating or eating, betrayed by Labour.

That’s what I said. Doesn’t change them being avaricious.

I think that's what America has in place. They get food stamps and their rent paid. The budget will be on shortly brace yourselves.

That is not what she’s said at all

I don’t disagree with you btw, I think there’s a need for a reset. When higher numbers of young people are moving from school to long term disability benefits, 45% of which are for mental health, something has gone badly wrong.

I’m not against means testing disability benefits and winter fuel allowance, depending on how it was applied. We can’t afford people to be out of work, and we can’t afford to subsidise employers through benefit top ups.