If my tenant has negotiated a lower rent because she is a single mum of 2 she should not move in her entire extended family?

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She negotiated her rent down, as she was just her and her two kids. Ideal quiet tenant, long term let.

So, a whole gang of people surprised my dh at the house when he went to London to have a final look prior to tenant moving in.

My other neighbour down the road got talking to them ( same ethnicity) and they said they were ALL moving in. Mum and her two children, her husband, her brother, her mum and her dad.... Only mum is named on the contract and the contract stays that nobody else can live there aside from named tenant.

Where do I stand? Can I demand higher rent bearing in mind wear and tear of appliances etc? With three working grown ups living there, surely they can afford it?

You can sign an agreement prior to the moving in day. For example if it was all done by post.

And also, on our rental agreement, we had to list the names, d.o.b and occupation of every person to be living in the house - including the hamster. This only meant me, DH and 2 kids in our case, so how on earth is she going to get away with this set-up?

We did, too, clam.

This is to prevent rogue landlords from letting a place to too many folks without having the proper license to do so - you know, the whole fire doors and such in place once you go past a certain number of people. It's called an HMO (House in Multiple Occupancy) license here.

Sorry, only read 1/2 way through. Someone made the point - better to get rid now than try to evict - I know this to my cost - It takes months and months to evict, and costs a fortune.

And I have just had a tenant move out today, who had extra adults living in the house - and wear & tear is significant - whole house was decorated 2 yrs ago, and the entire house will need done again. Could you not re-let house to a tenant who will not have entire extended family?

Am just looking at the rental agreement we had, and it says this:

Assignment: "the tenant agrees not to assign underlet (or) part with or share the possession of the premises and not to permit any persons other than the person named as the tenant or any other person approved of in writing by the landlord to occupy or reside in the premises. Not to take in lodgers or paying guest without the landlord's written concent."
How come yours doesn't say that? And if it does, then surely you're covered??

(Sorry was catching up on OJs threads . Puts it in to perspective, I should be glad I have the opportunity to house 7 people for very little rent)

Aubergine, you are very helpful, not a busybody at all.

The other letting agency was pleased with the tenant, said wold not have doubts letting to tenant again, paid the rent on time. Etc.

I dont want to have a void. The rent will cover the higher mortgage when I do decide to complete on that, and give us a nice surplus NOW. The rent is at 1603 per month, so not bad. The increase is built into the contract with a inflation rate increase after a year, between 5-8 %.

Now I understand what you mean about breakclause. There is none. But I can maybe ask to have one in the new contract.

In all honesty, my next door neighbour (not my "mole") is such a headcase, I have been really worried about having a single mum with two young children there. In a sense, it is a relief that she has somebody with her. They seem bolshy enough to not put up with any crap (she dumps her rubbish unbinned on my property, etc, etc. But have nice qualities too, and is only "bad" when her partner has a violent period). I dont feel too bad about it now. I am not exstatic, but it could be far worse.

I know what her kind is like (and I hope that is not patronising), family loving and family oriented, not into drinking and partying, community spirit, etc. I lived in India some time, as the only white in the neighbourhood, in an upstairs flat with two local families beneath me, they were many, but you would search long and hard for a nicer bunch of people. My dh works in India quite a lot. We have lots of Indian friends, in fact we have Indian people in the house at least for two months of the year. My biggest worry was the ramifications of having so many adults living there which was not named on the contract.

And, I was really pissed off at her negotiating the price down on account of being single mum of two, when the situation is differnt. Shrewd woman, for sure!

I have learnt a lot. When letting out property, think with your head not your heart. It is MY HOME (and my furniture, and my bloody tv, and my friggin fridge), but should be viewd from a business point of view only from now on. It will be costly to break out of the contract, and demand TIME I dont have, and for sure my DH dont have.

So I think we will have to put it down to experience and hope for the best.

After all, the property was on the market for over 2 months. It was too far from the tube for most people, wanting to commute to the city. It is a really nice house. Adjacent to a green where kids play out. In a nice and quiet street with no through traffic. She got herself a good deal. I hope it will work out.

I'm not sure they can hold you to full 18 months once the 6 months of the Assured Shorthold Tenancy has passed. That means you can't put up rent etc in the meantime but may yet mean you could issue notice (usually 2 months on landlord's side iirc). How often do EA inspect ?

Leaving things like TV is more trouble than it is worth - have you got time to remove such to storage ?

Well QS, that's looking on the bright side, for sure, but why don't you save that for when you KNOW you can't change things?
Re: TV, don't you have to have all electrical items checked, and if you leave a TV, you're obliged to replace it if it goes wrong, as the tenants would expect to have one.

I'm going to bed and pleased to read it might not be hell on legs. We've done similarly in the past -- lowered the rent for certain reasons, always costing in the void/refurbishment/quality of tenant, and we don't regret it. The shame is that just when you have your tenant, you should have peace of mind for a while, and it hasn't worked out that way.

I would still keep a very close eye out for nortiness on her part. But that seems a pretty good rent. Just don't think about what it would have been!

EA inspects twice a year.
We have not told tenant we are planning on doing it up.
It was not Foxtons who said they were looking after the interest of the tenant.
I have not chased the agent as I wanted to find out from DH exactly what furniture is going, turns out it is ONLY the sofa and the fridge. The fridge will be put in the shed. She will have to put anything she doesnt want into the shed. WIth three men in the house, this shouldnt pose much of a problem I suspect.
Luckily, we never bothered about lots of expensive furniture, no point with young kids in the house. The house was btw refurbished in part 2 years ago(entire downstairs).

ps qs how interesting that you lived in india, i'm off that way. Night

Twice a year isn't enough imho. Will they do an inventory of what you leave including statement of condition and photos of need be. I'd omit anything small electrical , whether she wants to use it or not. Agree with Clam you don't want to be having to replace stuff like tv and hoover you aren't going to need.

'And, I was really pissed off at her negotiating the price down on account of being single mum of two, when the situation is differnt. Shrewd woman, for sure! '

That's not shrewd, that's false.

I'm glad you're seeing the bright side of this, because I'm afraid I'd get lawyered up and get rid of such a tenant.

I suppose it depends on how you view the house. If you're emotionally attached to it as your family home, then you're going to find it harder to deal with imagining what might be going on in it. But, if you've "moved on" and are only keeping the house as an investment, until you sell it without ever wanting/needing to live in it again, then maybe you should take the money and run, and trust that there are legal processes to help if things get sticky. Good luck, anyway.
(And you're right about OJ . Does put everything else into perspective)

Aubergine, good night and thanks, you can tell me where you are going (and why ) in the morning. Lovely place. Next time, I will work out how to cook proper meals with the ingredients found.

Clam, I love the house. I have spent nearly 10 years landscaping the garden, inspired by a garden I saw, maintained by the late Yves Saint Laurent, outside Marackesh. Large exotics, green leaves, hardwood decking, pond with waterfall, bamboo, palms, giant reed, speckled with fiery large lilies and flowers in red and orange.

But no, I dont want to move back. If we ever move back to London, it will be same neighbourhood, but different house. I am trying to not think about London too much, frankly.

You are attached to the house though, even if it is just the garden. Have you spoken to your brief?

Expat, I dont know what the story is.

She lived in her last accommodation with her husband and children. She is adamant he is not moving in with her. She told my dh her mum will come to stay with her.

For all I know she could be in the middle of a really hard breakup, and need somewhere to stay.

If there is one thing mumnset has taught me, it is that many women leave their husbands, for whatever reason, and they should be supported in doing so. She may be a single mum. She may also have family that protects her in this, and wants to stay with her for the time being. When my neighbour moved in, escaping a violent husband, her family stayed a very long time till she was settled. I just dont know.
I guess I am not a hardnosed business woman.

Sounds lovely. Who's contracted to its upkeep though?

If you are amending the contract re the furniture, there is nothing to stop you amending other terms as well. You could amend it to include a definition of immediate family.

Putting in a clause that all adults living in the house are liable for the rent is too vague and potentially ineffective if you don't know the identity of those people. Best to amend the contract so that it is clear that only the woman and her children can live there.

but you said the husband was moving in with her?

But QS, all that is supposition. You don't know WHAT her circumstances are, except that she appears to be lying. It's nice that you're not hard-nosed, but you perhaps ought not to be a mug either. Look, if you're really OK about letting this lie, then fine - your call, but protect your assets as best you can - by getting independent advice.

Clam, it shouldnt need that much upkeep, althought the tenant said she was very interested in gardening, and asked if she could prune seasonally. (I guess they might be familiar with the plants???)

I have weed supressing fabrics under the cocoa shells, weed supressing fabrics under the decks, and under the gravel. Really it is just tidying in the spring, pruning it back a little and mowing the lawn.

My new project is to grow fruit and berries in the arctic!