To think free birthing should be entirely banned

[StandFirm]

I have come across this article earlier which made me feel so very angry at the cynical extremists who brainwashed a mum into an entirely avoidable tragedy: https://www.theguardian.com/world/ng-interactive/2025/nov/22/free-birth-society-linked-to-babies-deaths-investigation
If I'd listened to similar cretins, I would have died in childbirth aged 19 and none of my three DCs would have been born alive or at the very least without severe disabilities. 'Pearls of wisdom' which gave me the rage include:
-ultrasounds are not safe
-women’s “bodies do not grow babies that we cannot birth”
Such ignorant perfidious lies. I hope the cult leader gets sent down for a very long time. That poor little child was robbed of a healthy body and many more actually died. I really hate the internet's ability to spawn dangerous cults entirely unchecked.

I think the problem is that information about this gets tied up in all sorts of ‘natural’ type movements that get a bit cult like. A poster earlier on referred to the dolphin birth documentary and thinking it sounded quite nice. I remember watching that years ago and thinking they were completely insane so perception and wider includes will also affect how you view the same piece of information.

It’s a bit like anti vax community. A random thread popped up on Facebook and it made me so sad to read. There is some whole community called arnica natural parenting who sound completely insane but they’re all congratulating each other for standing up to big pharma and the oppressive state.

How would a ban work?
Would they face criminal prosecution?
Who would investigate it?

I free birthed my last child, accidentally. How would you separate women who did this on purpose with those who have no intention of having this type of birth?

True No way of proving whether it was deliberate or bot

I agree with that and that was the choice I made. However I don't think freebirthing (or home births as another poster has suggested) should be made illegal for a number of reasons - informed consent, bodily autonomy, regulated births not having uniformly better outcomes for mothers and babies (ie racial inequalities) and the potential for prosecutions of innocent women (I am thinking of the current situation in some US states where women are being prosecuted for miscarriages due to anti abortion legislation).

The baby can"t consent though. Once born the baby's rights are equal to and separate from the mother's.

No, how could you police that anyway? Women who wanted to free birth could just say it happened quickly and they couldn’t make hospital.

It’s also a slippery slope to completely controlling women in birth, the next thing will be HAVING to be induced, literally not being ‘allowed’ to go over a certain point in pregnancy, not being ‘allowed’ to have a vaginal birth, having to just obey whatever the dr decides.

You don’t actually have to have more than one child, you know that right?

I don’t think home births should be supported on the NHS. Thus, I believe that if you’ve had one child and been told you birth fast, you either pay for a private birth, make sure you can get there in time, or don’t have more children.

I'd never be brave enough to free birth, I want medical people to help me if need be 😅

However, we are designed to free birth. It's a natural thing we can do, just like most other animals 🤷‍♀️

It should never be made a criminal act and I doubt it ever will, because it's what we are naturally designed to do. In fact, lots of animals go off by themselves to give birth.

This is why a ban wouldn't work. I know a few women this has happened to but it wasn't their intention.

So are you saying that women who need interventions have failed at what they’re naturally designed to do?

Because the majority of births happen in hospital. The majority of adult deaths are probably in hospital. They are there because the are already ill, the hospital isn't causing it.

Dangerous nonsense. Throughout history women have, at least, been attended by other women.

Well you can read..... did I say that? Or are you just looking for an argument? Who said anything about failing or succeeding? Not me..... if you have any sort of inner feelings of people being inadequate about having interventions that's on you isn't it. I didn't say a single thing about it nor did I hint at it ... nor do I feel that way. I could of had several interventions for all you know?

Yes….tho maybe not quite extinct @LauraNorda? just fewer women around…. labouring women died at very high levels. Centuries after caesareans were discovered could save mother and baby even so late as C18th:. Maternal mortality was high in 18th-century England, with estimates of the rate ranging from 5 to 29 per 1,000 live births, and a lifetime risk of death for married women around 1 in 18. Causes included infections like puerperal fever, complications from obstructed or difficult births, and hemorrhage. Factors like multiple pregnancies, which were more common without contraception, and a lack of understanding of hygiene contributed to the risk. To take your logic further, why medically intervene on anything then, for anyone? Operations to set broken bones? They can eventually heal over; Antibiotics? Some infections will just self-limit; Removal of tumours? Some just go away on their own.

But statistically if it’s a subsequent baby and low risk factors then there is no additional risk with a home birth. You will always have people saying ‘well I was in that category and still needed xyz’ but it isn’t reflected in the statistics that show equal outcomes in hospital vs home for that group.

I agree that a lot of women (first time mothers or those with additional risk factors) need to carefully consider the fact there are better outcomes at hospital, but I still accept the facts/statistics for certain groups show that home birth is not at all risky for them.

Funnily enough I know of three NHS midwives locally who all opted for home births for their own babies.

Also just because you’re told “consider it”, doesn’t mean it’ll happen. My sister was told to consider it after a 45 minute labour from start to finish.

Had she listened, both her and her baby would be dead.

And countless women and their babies died in the meantime, or suffered birth trauma that effected them for the rest of their lives.

I don't think either me or DS would have survived without medical intervention. I was told his head was too big to fit through the birth canal while I was in the recovery room after having an elective c section. (Elective because I had pre eclampsia and the only other option I had was induction and I didn't want that.) If I'd have waited to go into labour naturally I would have been risking my life, and DS was 11lbs already, so I dread to think how big he'd have been had he been in there any longer.

@Thingsaretight The research here is interesting. Look at the birthplace study from 2011. Home births are much cheaper than even a SVB in hospital. Planned home births save the NHS money even when an NHS midwife attends. If a woman wants a home birth and she is low risk she should be able to have one.

if she has the means to pay for it.

it’s not solely about the cost of that one birth. It’s about everything else - midwives there instead of at hospital. The ambulances if needed (which has to be one for mum, one for baby), the impact if it goes wrong.

Adults must be free to choose even if those choices harm them. Women's bodies must never be controlled or policed.

Obviously!! 😂

The law should be clamping down on harmful medical misinformation. There are already precedents for this with the Cancer act, which tackles people / companies peddling quack cancer cures.

more info here
https://news.cancerresearchuk.org/2016/02/19/the-1939-cancer-act/

The principles of informed consent should be upheld. Women should continue to have agency over what happens to their own bodies.

Have you looked at the Birthplace Study research? Or are you just sounding off with your viewpoint again?

Not what was said.

Completely this. I wonder how many people know that during the birthing process, the baby is able to withstand 10 minutes of oxygen deprivation. After that, irreversible white matter damage occurs in a predictable pattern

At 20 minutes the baby dies.