To think free birthing should be entirely banned

[StandFirm]

I have come across this article earlier which made me feel so very angry at the cynical extremists who brainwashed a mum into an entirely avoidable tragedy: https://www.theguardian.com/world/ng-interactive/2025/nov/22/free-birth-society-linked-to-babies-deaths-investigation
If I'd listened to similar cretins, I would have died in childbirth aged 19 and none of my three DCs would have been born alive or at the very least without severe disabilities. 'Pearls of wisdom' which gave me the rage include:
-ultrasounds are not safe
-women’s “bodies do not grow babies that we cannot birth”
Such ignorant perfidious lies. I hope the cult leader gets sent down for a very long time. That poor little child was robbed of a healthy body and many more actually died. I really hate the internet's ability to spawn dangerous cults entirely unchecked.

The majority of deaths in childbirth happen during hospital births.

That is a ridiculous comment- we didn’t die out as a species because we manage to produce more babies that lived long enough to have their own babies before they died. I am sure you are well aware that child birth can be fatal for both mother and child. The lucky ones survived long enough to produce their own offspring who survived long enough to produce their own offspring . The rest died.

I think that planned free birth is insane, but then I also believe in vaccinations and the like.
With DD3 I had a terrible time, shoulder dysocia, sudden spike in blood pressure and severe pph. None of that could have been predicted and I would have been approved for a home birth.
Being in a hospital meant we both lived and dd avoided a life long disability.

So what are you supposed to do when you know you birth very quickly, the hospital tells you not to come in when you’re in labour and asking for an examination, and then they themselves actually advise that you should consider a home birth if you get pregnant again?

Should I opt for an accidental free birth instead because someone on the internet who isn’t clued up on everyone’s individual circumstances and risks thinks a planned homebirth is selfish. 🫠

Surely that will be because the vast majority of births are in hospital

Why can’t I get what I want for my deviated septum then? Or a knee injury I’ve got?

Pay for a private midwife?

I agree the discussion around the risks of childbirth should be pragmatic. Babies do die, and so do mothers, even in hospitals. But needlessly to court either of those outcomes is foolish. Childbirth is dangerous, probably the most dangerous thing any woman can ever do. And there are numerous ways in which childbirth can go wrong. Best to be in a place where help is quickly available and with people who know how to help.

Though that is because they are high risk pregnancies and births rather than due to actually being in the hospital
correlation not causation.

This.

Its not just about the mother, and its not about medical intervention. Its about doing it with know professional knowledge.

Women may have been designed to have babies, but plenty die in childbirth where there’s no help.

That little boy could have been fine.

Obviously. But in terms of a law that banned planned birth without medical professionals, the situations that poster described would need investigation to ensure it wasn’t planned.

Not the mothers, but the incompetent idiots who spread lies like the one who's made millions as an online guru.

It reads like you want to ban free birthing being promoted, rather than free birthing itself, largely because the promotion is connected to people who make money off of women who - often for good reasons - become frightened of the medical system.

I can see possibly a way legislation could be used to handle that and similar medical-related scams.

Like others, I think part of the solution is digging more into why pregnancy is linked to a higher risk of being abused by a medical profession that leads women to be more vulnerable to these types of scams and finding better ways to prevent and bring justice when that happens. I also agree that we cannot criminalise the women in these situations.

@Thingsaretight following your logic to pay for a private midwife pay to get your deviated septum sorted or your knee injury.

we could all go for a private medical system but then what happens to those women who can’t afford medical care … oh they might have to free birth … so….. yeah that worked

Funnily enough I’ve already looked at this option and it’s £7,000-£9,000 round here. So unfortunately not an option.

Homebirth actually costs the nhs far less than a hospital birth fyi.

But if people like you who aren’t clued up on it keep pushing the homebirth is unsafe for everyone narrative and the NHS bans them, then there will be far more accidental free births and mothers who don’t feel supported.

No one will have said it was “fine” as in there’ll never be any issues.

What they’ll have correctly said was that in that situation, the data shows the mother and the baby are not at more risk. Your experience doesn’t change that, just like data showing that c sections are safe is not undermined by someone having huge complications or dying following a c section. They are still safe.

Well that’s what I’ve been told I have to do.

why should it be any different for birthing women?

So go to the hospital and accept nhs care.

They still do, just not mainly in the West.

In a lot of areas the NHS has effectively banned them. They keep ‘suspending’ the service. Often with little notice or no idea for how long. Making them less attractive for parents and hopefully allowing them to totally close the service altogether.

It’s also worth remembering that by not having home birth, birth centre births etc we are deskilling our midwives and then further limited choice for women. Already I hear stories of maternity units that can go days without a vaginal birth! This isn’t because suddenly women and birth are getting more complicated. It’s also not because everyone is choosing a planned c birth.

The point is in response to the idea that we should be afraid of dying in the back of a taxi on the way to hospital if a transfer is needed during a homebirth rather than of dying in hospital as a result of inadequate care, which is a far bigger issue at the moment.

The biggest problem right now is not home birthing.

It is inadequate care during hospital births. It is the fact that giving birth in hospital, with access to medical intervention and support, is far riskier than it should be. Women are dying in hospital who should not be. They are in the environment that is supposed to be the sensible, safe option, and they still cannot get the care they need.

🤣 you’re literally not listening to anything are you?

I repeatedly called up with my second saying it’s my second baby and I think he’s coming, can I come and be examined and they said no you don’t sound like you’re in labour, take a paracetamol. I then turned up anyway and they kept me waiting outside and I only just made it and birthed my baby in the triage area!

They then THEMSELVES said I should consider a home birth next time as I birth quickly and had no medical complication.

But I’ll tell them thingsaretight on the internet said I shouldn’t so I’ll just pop the baby out in the car next time 😅🫠

This experience is such a silly one to use as a “thank god I didn’t have a home birth” example.

You had a days long labour with no dilating and issues with the baby’s heart rate. You’d have been sent in by the home birth midwives pretty quickly after they got to you, which would have been whenever you called and said you were in labour and could they send someone.

And if you don't have a few K knocking around I presume you would want people giving birth on a stairwell or in a taxi ?

Interestingly that peak in the 17th century is posited to be due to the move away from midwife-led birth towards professional doctors, but before there was a good understanding of infection control.

You can't ban freebirthing as
a) you risk criminalising precipitous labour
b) it will be a slippery slope towards women losing bodily autonomy and this is NEVER okay

I think it would be reasonable to use internet safety rules (and other media) and guidelines designed for managing 'false news' to shut down anyone pushing the false birth narrative.