Ban male nursery workers?

[BluntPlumHam]

I came across this article which has left me quite sick.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cze665j2y51o.amp

Said 18 year old was newly qualified nursery worker who’d SA’d and raped 3 year olds.

Nurseries are desperate for workers and I have noticed through friends and families that there is now an increasing number of men entering the profession.

Men traditionally haven’t performed this role and I often find it difficult to envisage what attracts a male to this profession to begin with when we have so many instances of men who run away from childcare responsibilities.

Although men entering the profession can be a positive outcome the other very concerning outcome and on the potential rise is this.

Sex offenders will target this profession no doubt as it gives them easy access to children.

men are significantly more likely than women to sexually assault children.
Official statistics consistently show that the vast majority of individuals convicted of, or reported for, child sexual abuse (CSA) are male. For example:

• In the year ending March 2019, the Crime Survey for England and Wales found that 92% of adults who reported experiencing CSA said the perpetrator was male only.
• In 2022/23, almost 99% of individuals convicted of child sexual abuse offences in the UK were men.
• Reports to the Australian Royal Commission by victims and survivors of institutional abuse revealed that 93.9% of the abuse was perpetrated by an adult man.

So just a blanket ban on them all together ?

It isn’t my personal opinion but I do think we ought to have measures in place to make nurseries more secure and safer. This thread is to invite discussion.

Also, kudos to those brave little 3 year olds who had the courage to tell their parents because they’ve saved a lot of potential victims in the future. My thoughts and wishes for a life time of healing for them and theirs.

@BobblyBobbleHat How though? Practically if you have a way to know this then you should share it so other nurseries and parents can do the same.

The parents at the nurseries that employed Vincent Chan, Nathan Bennett, Thomas Waller, Jayden McCarthy, Joshua Brown, Ashley Griffith, David James will have all believed they were no risk too, so it would be good to know how to tell.

I mean, Vincent Chan worked in one nursery for 7 years and another for 10 years I think so the risk wasn't obvious to most people.

I was and am very certain. I'm suggesting nothing about others as I have no idea about their individual situations.

How?
Did he have a certain look, was it something he said or did? Did you spend an extended period with him? Was it something in his training or background? Just a vibe?

Men are significantly more likely to be caught and convicted. Just like poor people are significantly more likely to be caught and convicted. Doesn't actually mean women aren't a threat too - and who then would we have in nurseries? Just have to trust the recruitment and vetting process and if you dont, dont send your kids. They're at risk at home and with their families too, statistically

You're being a bit offensive and ignorant yourself suggesting it is stupidity that causes people to say but women. Having studied criminal justice based stats, it really is basic to know that when youre looking at conviction rates youre looking at who was caught. Stereotypes and profiling feed into that. Yes, men may well still feature more heavily than women I suspect however it would be niave to ignore the prevalence of women involved in this behind closed doors

I understand the logic, but dont agree with the principle of banning all people from a particular category because statistically thry are more likely to commit a crime.

Can you imagine if all black / brown people were banned from certain shops cos correlation between skin colour and crime ( not saying this correlation exists, but as an example). Is that ok? If not, why not?

We have vetting for a reason I'd rather see this tightened up than all men banned from a profession.

You think that the proportion of male and female nursery workers who sexually abuse children is equal? It's just that the women are escaping detection?

Men make up 3% of the early years workforce and yet all the nursery workers convicted of sexual abuse in the last couple of years are men. But the other 97% of workers are a threat too?
Don't you think it's a bit disproportionate that 3% of the workforce seem to be doing all the sexual abuse?

They will inevitably get through any vetting you do, what’s the point? Men are higher risk, and by a LOT

All safeguarding updates are based on prior suffering, we’re always just catching up. Why should our kids be put at risk to spare male feelings?

Because once you do it for one thing it opens up the floodgates and next It'll be no brown people in the shopping mall, no women of childbearing age offered jobs, surely you can see what it is starting

We are capable of drawing lines you know. Preventing the abuse of vulnerable children and adults is one of those instances

There’s a good reason morgues don’t like employing men…

You're capable of drawing your lines... what about other people wanting to draw theirs?

Or are you.in charge of the whole, wide world?

And I work in adult social care, we are happy to accept applications from men.

Hardly.

Brilliant contribution to the conversation. Outstanding. I'll surely change my mind now...

You really think that sex crimes supposedly being 98% male, is because there is actually a hidden underbelly of female sex offenders who are never caught by virtue of being female?

I am right, this attitude is plain stupidity.

Yup. Truly disgusting

There’s a good reason morgues don’t like employing men…

No there isn't. Most corpses are swiftly collected by funeral companies where they spend a lot longer than in a morgue, and most funeral directors are men.

You are thinking of ONE conviction in 2021/2

Yes it really is nuts to suggest the figures of sex crimes would be equal if only females weren't nearly all getting away with it.

What an absolutely ridiculous thing to say.

It’s not ridiculous, it’s logical and true and the main reason this ban will never happen.

This thread is about banning a group of people from a huge field of work based only on a protected characteristic (sex), rather than judging them individually. If you start allowing employers to discriminate on protected characteristics like that, you can’t complain when other employers find a reason to discriminate against women, or old people, or young people or people of a particular race. I’m sure in every case they’ll be able to justify it with stats.

So just let children be abused by adult males who will sneak through whatever vetting process you use?

How many cases like those linked must we see before we stop trying to force equality at the expense of the vulnerable? Men AS A GROUP are just more dangerous and it’s not even close

We will all become elderly women after all, we need to ensure their safety too, so it could personally affect you too

I couldn't agree more