Ban male nursery workers?

[BluntPlumHam]

I came across this article which has left me quite sick.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cze665j2y51o.amp

Said 18 year old was newly qualified nursery worker who’d SA’d and raped 3 year olds.

Nurseries are desperate for workers and I have noticed through friends and families that there is now an increasing number of men entering the profession.

Men traditionally haven’t performed this role and I often find it difficult to envisage what attracts a male to this profession to begin with when we have so many instances of men who run away from childcare responsibilities.

Although men entering the profession can be a positive outcome the other very concerning outcome and on the potential rise is this.

Sex offenders will target this profession no doubt as it gives them easy access to children.

men are significantly more likely than women to sexually assault children.
Official statistics consistently show that the vast majority of individuals convicted of, or reported for, child sexual abuse (CSA) are male. For example:

• In the year ending March 2019, the Crime Survey for England and Wales found that 92% of adults who reported experiencing CSA said the perpetrator was male only.
• In 2022/23, almost 99% of individuals convicted of child sexual abuse offences in the UK were men.
• Reports to the Australian Royal Commission by victims and survivors of institutional abuse revealed that 93.9% of the abuse was perpetrated by an adult man.

So just a blanket ban on them all together ?

It isn’t my personal opinion but I do think we ought to have measures in place to make nurseries more secure and safer. This thread is to invite discussion.

Also, kudos to those brave little 3 year olds who had the courage to tell their parents because they’ve saved a lot of potential victims in the future. My thoughts and wishes for a life time of healing for them and theirs.

Some people’s risk perception is really off. Iirc someone upthread actually runs a nursery and doesn’t think it’s risky?

A quick google will show that this isn’t male only problem.

Males are disproportionately involved so you cut the risk by not hiring them. Really is that simple

I've heard of research that has found that men being involved in children's care generally makes them less likely to abuse because it becomes something ordinary. I can't remember the exact wording and I'm not explaining it well, but basically someone who bathes a baby or dresses small children etc every day is not going to find it sexual on any level. Whereas for some it is. Horrible thought I know but that's the reality. Far better for childcare to be better paid and well subsidised so that there is adequate supervision.

We already know men commit sexual abuses at absurdly high rates. So it makes a lot of sense to just … not hire them to look after vulnerable children.

I personally don’t have an issue with primary school teachers, since they won’t be helping with toileting. And there’s legitimate evidence that male influence at that level is positive, particularly for boys.

But definitely not nursery age

Would you ban male nurses or male home carers? What about male paediatricians?

I'd stop women from working in neo natal units because of Lucy Letby. Clearly women shouldn't be allowed near new horns in case they commit mass murder.

Male home carers are a risk to vulnerable women. Personally I wouldn’t risk it, they should only care for other males.

Imagine that this man was only caught because he was being watched by the son. How many other women did he rape?

I recall that another male carer raped a woman with Alzheimer’s in a care home in Ireland—the HSE thinks maybe he raped almost two dozen women there.

https://rmx.news/article/lost-her-will-to-live-son-watches-afghan-caregiver-rape-his-82-year-old-austrian-mother-during-livestream-on-his-cellphone-in-vienna/

How many vulnerable women and children have been harmed by not using basic common sense?

Many elderly men prefer a male carer to a female carer. It’s not just women who need home carers.

You hear more about scout leaders for example or teachers grooming children than you do about male carers

Male paediatricians? Male gynaecologists? Where would you draw the line?

I mentioned that. Male carers should be available for elderly men.

You can have normal safeguarding procedures for pediatricians and doctors. But updates are always written in suffering and abuse, sadly.

I remember a case in Arizona where a woman in a coma for 10 years suddenly gave birth. Turned out that the guy dispensing medication had been abusing her for years and nobody knew. Now the law has been updated but the damage is done. Who can say how many other women he abused there?

Where are all these female workers going to come from?
The GMC register is now 50% male female, there are more female engineers, dentists, train drivers, bus drivers etc plus the traditional nurse, teacher, carer, shop assistant and cleaners. And like it or not it is the woman who has maternity leave and will do more of the childcare and will need/want to work part time.

I would draw the line at male professionals dealing with vulnerable and non verbal people.

I'm not sure why that's a controversial opinion honestly.

How many studies need to be done where men admit that the thought of being caught is the only reason they don't rape, or group chats where they all discuss the best way of getting access to vulnerable women and children does there need to be before we stop putting mens feelings first and protect our vulnerable.

RingoJuice said she was OK with men caring for men. :

'Personally I wouldn’t risk it, they should only care for other males.'

Exactly. What a terrible case.

Should women only care for women?

what about male nurses? Male gynaecologists?

There was a male nurse struck off recently for purposely hurting a man’s penis during personal care. I think it’s the person not the gender who is the issue

Male nurses and gynaecologist generally aren't caring for vulnerable elderly people and/or not caring in wholly isolated home settings.

If men are more likely to commit physical abuse of old men too...yes,,maybe they should also be barred from private home care at least.

"There is absolutely no argument to be made in favour of men being nursery workers"

Well clearly - it would be a clear cut case of sexual discrimination - which is illegal in the UK.

Yes, "end of story" statements like those of feelingsaren'tfacts amount to wishful thinking in this context.

As I pointed out earlier, the powers-that-be are not going to embrace a ban. Left-of-centre politicians tend to take the opposite view, arguing that there should be many more men working in these childcare areas.

And while some of those on the right would be happy to abandon anti-discrimination laws, they would insist this should apply to both sexes and employment in general, meaning a big step backwards for women's equality in the workplace.

"And while some of those on the right would be happy to abandon anti-discrimination laws, they would insist this should apply to both sexes and employment in general, meaning a big step backwards for women's equality in the workplace"

I don't think it would stop there. Many on the right try to imply certain races or immigrants are more likely to commit crimes. If you allow "this type of person is statistically more likely to do this and should be banned" where does it end?

Another one?! Nathan Bennett convicted of horrific abuse.

Allowing tiny, pre-verbal children to be raped to spare men’s feelings is ageist discrimination.

Men commit 98% of sex crimes. Removing men reduces the risk of molestation by 98%.

If they want to be treated equally in the workplace, they need to reduce their paedophilia and rape.

We would need to prevent it being misused in a misogynist way.