Thread 19: To feel disappointed after reading this in The Observer about the author and her husband from The Salt Path book and film?

[DisappointedReader]

The Observer's original exposé: The real Salt Path: how a blockbuster book and film were ...

First thread: To feel disappointed after reading this in The Observer about the author and her husband from The Salt Path book and film? | Mumsnet

Links to threads 2-16, the other 20 Observer articles and videos to date, Raynor Winn/Sally Walker's statement, our timeline and sources can all be accessed in the OP and first few posts of Thread 17: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/5403285-thread-17-to-feel-disappointed-after-reading-this-in-the-observer-about-the-author-and-her-husband-from-the-salt-path-book-and-film?

Thread 18: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/5422393-thread-18-to-feel-disappointed-after-reading-this-in-the-observer-about-the-author-and-her-husband-from-the-salt-path-book-and-film?

New posters joining us in the genuine spirit of our civil discourse are welcome. It would be helpful to get the background from at least some of the Observer exposé items before posting.
To all - Please be extremely cautious when it comes to naming or implicating people and addresses not in the public eye or with no direct connection to the story, and around the understandable health speculations, especially where details are unclear or still emerging. Remember, even Hollywood rabbits attract the odd flea. Please do not engage with drive-by scolders who seem to have their own agenda and seek to derail. Avoid @'ing and quoting them as - from experience - this will only encourage them back to the threads. Over four months we have done amazingly well together for 18 very interesting, very serious and very silly threads so far. I can't be here as much as I'd like so all help with keeping our discussion walking along in our usual reasonable and respectful fashion is very welcome.

Keep to the path. No saltiness. May the fudge and cider be with you.

"I'll fight anyone who says I'll make it to Christmas 2021!"

What is the timeline for that kind of expiration?

Six years.

I have googled this, this morning, because I wondered if a) it takes into account that the WinnWalkers did their disappearing act and b) if the debt does disappear or the ability to pursue the debt through the courts disappears. (Sorry, lot of disappearing seems to be going on).
One thing I did notice is that unsecured debt is 6 years and secured debt is 12, but there was also something about, if it has gone through the court (which their's did) then it does not go away.
More research is needed and not enough time to do it today but the things we are learning on these threads is ever growing.

Is it six years that the debt can be enforced by court action, after that doesn't the debt still exist, but the person cannot be taken to court to enforce payment?

Then surely it would be best if the Winn/Walkers settled any money that they owe now, while they still have the maximum income from the books and the film? I mean, why wouldn't they (apart from the fact that they seem to seriously believe that they owe nobody anything)? They've got plenty, if they're living in a six bedroomed place, whether it's rented or not. Just pay up what's owing, clear the debt that remains, buy themselves somewhere small with some land - it's not rocket science is it?

So why ARE they keeping their heads down quite so firmly?

If the debt still exists but can no longer be persued through the courts, it seems that the debtor can avoid paying. I just had a look at a legal site that answers people's questions. The advice was being given to a person who had a mortgage shortfall debt older than six years, they were being told not to respond to a letter sent about the debt, that doing so would be acknowledging the debt and the six years timeframe for court action would be reactivated?There seems to be something called the limitations act 1980, that sets out the rules.

There also seems to be a difference in time scale for repayment depending on whether the monies owed arose from capital or interest, if it is capital then it seems there is a twelve year timeframe before the debt can no longer be persued through the courts. Whether that means the Walkers still owe the debt, but as long as they don't acknowledge it, they cannot be persued through the courts, I'm not sure.

I am sure that, from their point of view, not acknowledging the debt so they don't have to pay it back makes sense. But when the entire world (well, a charabanc full of irate Mumsnetters) is watching you with a censorious frown... wouldn't you gasp in faux innocence, say 'oh, we didn't realise we still owed money - we thought our debts were clear! But here is any money we might owe - put any change in a homelessness charity tin!'

It would go a long way to rehabilitate them, because otherwise they are looking at a very long time having to hide.

I think you are right @Vroomfondleswaistcoat, the Walkers seem to be all take and no give, even the money raised for charity was not huge, wasn't it something like £40k altogether? a huge sum if a regular individual raised it through donations, but not a massive amount when you consider their following and their own personal wealth.

That’s not going to wipe out the embezzlement or the faked/rejigged/ exaggerated illness, though, or whether they walked the SWCP roughly when and as they claim, though — I mean, do you think that repaying an outstanding debt to a former creditor of the original lending Walker uncle would do much to rehabilitate them in the public eye?

From what I remember it featured in the press only because they tracked down one of the men who bought the debt just to support the allegation that the cooper story was a fiction covering up a much grubbier reality.

I bought a copy for a friend; not sure I'd want to stockpile books but there could be a business opportunity there.

The WWs might be looking for a house to buy now that there isn't any big money to be milked from their grift. Possibly, before exposure, they'd been thinking they had a lifelong stream of income from writing, talks etc as others have said.

I'm glad you got a copy for your friend @AzureStaffy, I have found a few copies in the charity shop, I don't think I will stockpile them incase of renewed interest, I just think of the horror of being left in possession of multiple copies of TSP :)
I agree @WellSurely I don't know if the Walkers can now redeem themselves, unless they go all out sorry and make that their thing. But would Salray's ego allow her to do that, become the repentant sinners rather than the admired, switched on, eco warriors, spokespersons for the homeless and promoters of natural healing?

No I don't think it wipes out the fraud or the embezzlement at all. But they have to start somewhere!

@Vroomfondleswaistcoat, I'm now having a vision of you as a hard-ass PR consultant having a session with the Walkers about how to do reputational damage control and saying 'OK, public apology with tears, tick. Tim, you're going on a strict diet and we're going to try to age you up a bit for the media -- think SICK AND FEEBLE. Actually, you too, Sally. Low-cal diet. You need to look like you haven't had a moment without torment since last summer. Tick. Now, let's talk about how much money you're donating to homelessness charities, and how much debt you're publicly paying back.'

Add in walking up and down tapping a stick on my hand, and occasionally pointing at a white board covered in incomprehensible writing and coloured arrows and you've got me!

I feel you also need an American accent and a very sharp suit. Plus you charge a truly gigantic hourly rate.

And SW really, really doesn't like you, because you wear a lot of make-up, are poised and elegant, you've snubbed TW in mid-story by holding up a hand and saying 'Save the charisma, Mr Walker, I'm not one of your fans', have told her that your idea of a holiday is a yacht in the Caribbean, and that you'd rather cut your own head off than go on a holiday involving walking boots.

And you see right through her 'But I am a shy creature of the woodlands!' shtick, and say things like 'Lady, as far as I'm concerned you're just a confidence trickster who writes books.'

Dammit, now I want someone to film this. You are played by Angela Bassett.

Having a quick flick of TWS made me realise one of the reasons I dislike Salray's writing - and that is her obsessive, cloying nature of her relationship with her husband. Many people have partners who they love or even adore and would be distraught if they had an incurable disease but the way she describes her marriage feels suffocating and claustrophobic. We've discussed before how SalRay seems afraid MothTim would leave her and that she's not good enough for him and I think that's true. She hero worships him to the extent that she comes across as embarrassingly needy.

Referring to Staffy dogs, my namesake, they're notoriously clingy with their humans, following them everywhere even to the toilet and behave as if they can't exist without them. The experts call it 'separation anxiety'. SalRay could be the human version of the Staffy, with her prose so full of her desperate need for MothTim and her terror of desertion.

Following this and @AzureStaffy 's following comment - I feel that Tim should become devoted to me and the 'tough treatment' and follow me besottedly while Sal get more and more angry and tries more and more outlandish ways to attract his attention.

This stuff writes itself, doesn't it?

Yes -- there's that weird episode (well, one of many) in TSP where, when he goes back to the tent in St Ives without explaining he's picking up Beowulf for a spot of busking, and she immediately panics and thinks he's packing up and secretly leaving her, until she is relieved to remember that she is carrying all their money on her, so he can't go anywhere!

TW serenading you under your hotel window with poetry, in his dapperest outfits, preferably involving the tweed shorts and cravat, while you call security from your four-poster and SW crashes out of the shrubbery shouting 'Seriously? I turn you into a brave, compellingly attractive, achingly vulnerable blond former eco-warrior in my books, and this is what I get, you fall for a woman who lives in Jimmy Choos and has a daily blow-dry???'

👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻😂😂😂

Oh don't they just! Our old Staffy boy (RIP) had been abandoned in a locked house for days with no food and minimal water and the rescue said he (understandably) had separation anxiety. Lots of work and he could be left for a few hours happily and was fine, but he inherently had the heart and soul of a lapdog and DH was HIS human. They are quite something, as you know!

What is acceptable behaviour in Staffy dogs does not translate well to human relationships between adults though and "obsessive, cloying" is a good description. Salray very much centres herself in it too, her reaction to the 'diagnosis' being one example.

I am planning a summary of the next bit. I may wait for the beta blockers first though.

I'm truly loving the scenario @HumoursofBandon has concocted, starring @Vroomfondleswaistcoat .

It's like a classy version of Jackie Collins.

SW crashes out of the shrubbery shouting 'Seriously? I turn you into a brave, compellingly attractive, achingly vulnerable blond former eco-warrior in my books, and this is what I get, you fall for a woman who lives in Jimmy Choos and has a daily blow-dry???'

Just brilliant

I agree @Uricon2 its absolute comedy gold.
@Vroomfondleswaistcoat the stuff certainly is writing itself! I hope you’re getting it all down. This is a blockbuster!

Agree with all the unhealthy sounding “cloying” passages in the books, supposedly Ray’s emotions. Do we really believe these or are they for entertainments sake? Is she writing what she thinks a romantic heroine should sound like? Note, the Mars bar story being retold quite often and lots of reiteration in case the reader should forget that Ray lives her life for this man.

I'm still imagining you as a double for Tilda Swinton @Vroomfondleswaistcoat, Tim would be floored and Salray would be seething. I wonder if she really is as devoted or is it just for the books ?