To be surprised Andrew has lost his Prince title

[Viviennemary]

I certainly think this is absolutely the right decision. But this has all been swept under the carpet for a long time with the usual head in the sand approach. If makes me think there might be more to come out. This wasn't just going to go away.

Talking of hypocrisy, I want to know who the other people were, and why the American media are so uncurious about it. We know that Andrew was not Epstein's only client. Why is he the only person named and why, given that ostensibly he has committed no crime, at least in the UK, why has such energy been spent on bringing him (quite rightly) to account whilst others have evidently got away scot-free?

Yes, I'd like to know that too.

Me too

However I suspect there are far too many high profile people implicated and they're joining forces make sure as little as possible comes out.

If Giuffre hadn't had that photo of Andrew, he probably would have been able to slither out of accountability also.

Yes why aren't other names being revealed, why aren't other men rightfully having their lives destroyed?

We know he isn't the only sleazeball so why isn't anyone going after the others involved?!

I wonder if Andrew will write a tawdry book and do an Oprah to generate some income..

Agreed it's ridiculous

Maybe they are just wealthy and not high profile i mean I agree they are all sleazebslls and should rightfully face the consequences of their actions
But the general public won't be as interested that "Joe Bloggs" has done the same as Andrew formally HRH the Duke of York.

The royals aren’t normal citizens. Normal laws don’t apply to them. They don’t pay taxes and can’t vote. The courts are the law courts of the monarch. They can’t bring evidence or bear witness against themselves or each other. It’s pointless thinking Andrew will ever sit in the dock for things he did while Prince Andrew. He can for anything he does from now on, although probably not even (he’s still not an entirely ordinary citizen, he’s still Royal, he just doesn’t have the styles and titles).

The only one exempt from legal prosecution is the Monarch.

And they can vote. They choose not to do so as they're meant to see to be politically neutral.

Nothing has changed for Andrew in legal terms with regard to giving evidence or being a witness etc.

Or maybe one of them is President Trump and this is all about protecting him? It’s impossible to believe that he didn’t know what was going on, at the very least.

I suspect that Epstein was murdered to stop him talking.

I don’t understand the US media’s lack of curiosity re the other people involved in the Epstein controversy either @HelenaWaiting
It’s extraordinary.

Probably because they’re talking about the government shutdown and the loss of benefits to millions of Americans around their country.

Would the average Brit be more worried about Andrew or not being able to eat or get paid?

Epstein and his unsavoury friends have been in the news for more than half a decade. Claiming that the government shutdown is the reason for the US media's lack of curiosity about any other perpetrator is nonsensical.

Where did I say it was a lack of curiosity???

You chose to interpret that is what I said.

I see on social media people saying to release the files but beyond that it is not a priority compared to the sh-t that is going on right now.

You just love all the drama and hatred within the family, don't you? fancy being gleeful over the idea or hope of William dealing with his brother 'ruthlessly'. Perhaps this is a symptom of your own family. And as for, 'sends out a message that our monarchy has morals at its core,' The current debacle reflects more of dysfunction than any morals and blind loyalty towards the monarchy is sycophancy.

I very much hope I’m wrong and the Crown estate will be debated

But I suspect parliament let it be known that a debate was next if something wasn’t done to put the lid on the Andrew issue and the Windsors wet themselves . This is their idea of ‘doing something’
I don’t think it will work when the fuss dies down .

Look up how the wealth of the Windsors has ballooned obscenely in the last century but most particularly since the Tories changed the payment system from the civil list to the sovereign grant . Elizabeth and Charles had been pushing for that change for years !

Half a billion annually these wasters cost us .
They are laughing at us . They are probably all paying peppercorn rent to live in properties owned by us .

He’a a rapist and should be in prison. The whole royal family needs to be downgraded, we’ve pandered to these insufferable, privileged prigs for long enough. They knew about Andrew’s vile connections 15+ years ago and have dragged their heels doing anything g while he sits about in palaces and houses paid for by us.
tensioner they are nothing but figure heads with no power whatsoever the better.

I think it's both a) that there's more to come about Andrew Mountbatten Windsor and b) KCIII knew it needed to be done, and doesn't feel he has much time left but didn't feel it should be left to PW to do (even though I believe PW is totally behind the decision and was probably very involved in it).

About bloody time anyway.

What about the tourists? We’ll still have the palaces, the Tower of London, the changing of the guard, the Crown Jewels etc etc without these inbred toffs -
these are national treasure and belong to the country, not some people who claim to be descended from Henry 8th or whomever.

Have you proof of that? He’s not been convicted of anything

It can't be just about Trump or the Biden administration would have released it a long time ago.

My guess is there are multiple powerful men implicated, it's in all of their interests to keep it quiet and between them they have considerable power to do so.

A hugely depressing reflection of the world we live in.

@Isheagrump

The monarchy here was German dominated for at least tlast 300 years once an obscure German duke was handed the crown in the early 1700s . All those with a closer claim to the throne were catholics you see so were excluded . I think at least 60 individuals with a better claim were excluded

That’s the so called ‘direct line’

The Windsors became ‘Windsor’ rather than their real name - Saxe Coburg gotha - because Gotha munitions were killing British soldiers in WW1
Not a good look .

You’re right, it could be possible that there was a powerful Democrat politician involved as well. We do know that Clinton was a contact of Epstein and there could well have been others. Or powerful business contacts of various politicians.

Either way, quite clearly there are cover-ups involved, with Andrew as a convenient fall-guy. (Not that I’m in the least bit sympathetic towards him, by the way, he deserves every bit of the shame, and much more than that.)

I don´t think the Queen hated him, I just think she thought him a non-entity, which can be worse. The Queen Mother couldn´t stand him as she considered him to be the chief cause of her husband´s untimely death and the stress and pressure he had to go through because of his brother´s abdication.

I said it was lack of curiosity on the part of the US media in my post which started this part of the conversation. You chose to give a sneery response. It is now clear that you had no clue what was actually being discussed. Commiserations.

And one might wonder why you are so scared of other names coming to light that you're trying to convince people that it is not of interest, given "the sh-t that is going on right now".

I was inclined to think the same. Now I am not sure. So far, he was accused by a middle aged woman of having sex with a minor age 17. He denies it, and it has never gone to trial, so has not been proven. The age of consent in America is 18. In UK it is 16.

She went back again - and again. Why, if she knew she was abused the first time - and I do not believe she didn't know exactly what the age of consent was then, all teens do, and she was abused as a child).

It would have made more sense if she had reported it the first time. I have heard exerts from the book saying at one party 8 foreign girls were involved. Apparently, according to the journalist yesterday, she was 'triumphant at being able to bring down a prince'.She let that go on year after year until Epstein's trial and later death. When he was imprisoned and she had the money from Andrew she wrote her book and killed herself.

If she knew she was underage at middle age, why did she let it continue? Why would she not have saved the other minor girls involved by speaking up the first time?

It is all a bit weird. Epstein dead, Guislain in prison. Looking back in the past, why did it take so long? Did Guislain pay the price for her father's crimes?

The same with the Harrod's Al Fayed. Women came forward years after they had been abused, knowing that teenagers leaving school and coming to work with them were being abused. What sort of middle age woman keeps quiet, knowing that the abuse continues with new recruits and doesn't warn them?