If you don't consider life admin to be a thing...

[ruethewhirl]

...then how do you mentally 'label' (so to speak) things like banking and official correspondence?

Not being goady here, genuinely curious. Not a TAAT as such, I see it stated so often on MN that there's 'no such thing' as life admin or the mental load (although I tend to assume the latter refers to slightly different things eg each partner doing their share of things like remembering birthdays, making sure the kids have clean clothes etc). Life admin-wise, part of why I'm bemused by this is that I have a lot of things to take care of in my life that I think definitely count as life admin - not only my own banking, but managing correspondence with my GP's surgery (I have multiple conditions) and also handling my mum's finances at her request (she has Alzheimer's) plus handling her general correspondence and sorting things out on the many occasions her care company drops the ball. 🙄 Oh, and chasing the vet/pet insurance company about insurance claims for our cats that seem to drag on for ever!

And then there are things like handling the correspondence if you switch banks or energy providers, complaining about poor service, managing quotes if you're getting home improvements done... what are these things if not life admin? What do you call them instead?

Is it really so insane to suggest that these types of activities warrant an umbrella term with which to refer to them? Presumably the vast majority of people have at least some of this kind of stuff to do in their day-to-day lives, so it puzzles me when people claim there's no such thing. (And if you're one of them, how do you refer to these tasks?)

YABU: There's no such thing as life admin
YANBU: Yes there is!

"Going for the messages" was a thing growing up in 70s Scotland. There was always the message bag hanging on the back of the kitchen door.

Everything can't be done simply with a click on a computer. There are times when the chatbots or FAQs can't answer my query.
Trying to get to speak to a human is a nightmare.

I don't think that is true. It is often the busiest people who get stuff done. Work/life admin expands to fill the time available. Some people are efficient and just crack on. Others overthink and procrastinate while complaining about how busy they are.

I think the term is fine, some people have a lot and crack on, some have a normal amount and make a huge deal. I find the physical stuff is better for me (paperwork, errands) and the quick stuff (checking the bank stuff. Some of the online and phone stuff is messier for me because it guarantees the kids will go feral at the same time. The online stuff is easier for dh because he’s at a computer all day and can flip between tabs. If I have a lot of computer tasks like taxes or the bs start of school forms I tend to need him to take the kids out. If he has a lot of in person errands he needs me either along with the kids or to have the kids elsewhere.

Mental load is kind of a to-do list. Some care a lot about a perfect split and some don’t. I think if it’s a perpetual list it’s easier to split than if you keep it in your head.

These days companies push most of the admin on to the customer. Before the internet came along, they had to employ staff to do it. Those of us who are old enough to remember paying bills etc before the internet are aware of how much more time we now have to spend on Stuff. Life admin, errands, messages, it’s all Stuff.

You keep using the term ‘researching’, @BoringBarbie — which makes it sound like some kind of major project involving encyclopaedias, assistants and weeks of searching. Mostly in the contexts in which you’ve used it means ‘a quick Google’ or ‘Ask on the parents/area WhatsApp for teacher recommendations’.

Also ‘organising’ as in ‘organising a costume for a school disco’. (How much organising can possibly be involved?’)

Or ‘researching, planning and organising’ clothes for a trip to a cold country. Really? Cold weather clothing requires researching, planning AND organising?

Or ‘trying to work out the best dates’ for three events in December — unless about thirty people all need to make the same date, surely that just involves glancing at your diary and booking?

If you live in a deeply sexist household where you do all this admin because you have a vagina, that’s obviously a problem. But that’s a choice you’re making.

I’m actually quite happy with what I got done today

• Rang the bank and clarified my questions about mortgage
• Booked a dentist appointment for next week
• Rang my doctors and ask them for some results that I should have received-they will call me back tomorrow
• Messaged carpet guy
• logged on to pension App- got info
• rang my mum really quickly to ask her about a date for something

Alas, My luck ran out because I just tried to ring my daughters school to get some information on a callback on something that I would like to speak to a teacher about… and the office is now closed. I will try again in the morning.

and that was all done whilst working from home 🙌

Yes, context really is everything. I have significant sight loss and can no longer read numbers so banking for me is a trip to town to queue and do it the old fashioned way. Same with most other things too. I also don't believe, none of the family do, in having everything on the phone as it's to easy now for systems to go down, phones running out or stolen etc. Yes it takes longer but it keeps me independent. And yes, I'm computer literate, have been for many years and I've helped many others in using pc's for decades but now I can only see on the big pc and I can't really take that shopping with me. Apps are useless to me as I cannot see which one it is let alone use the blooming thing. I'm not the only one like this, but we tend to be forgotten about

I think people have different levels of how much it stresses them out or how long it takes them to decide about stuff. Some people will sort stuff out easily while others wont.

I do all the life admin and DH does more of the practical stuff, as I explain further up. I'm project management and purchasing, he's implementation. 😂

It works out fine for us but it's not "nothing". It takes me as long to do all the organising as it takes him to do the practical side of things.

Oh, and I also nipped out at lunchtime to collect my DS’s Halloween costume 🙌

I think at different times there is more and less to do. At the moment I sometimes find it a lot to figure out our schedule. My eldest has a fortnightly school timetable including for after school clubs, my kids do 13 out of school and 5 in school activities between them (some of which sometimes shift time/location), they also both do some shows/exams connected with their activities. I’m a cubs leader, OH does volunteering, both of us have quite flexible working but both of us also have times we have to join meetings in the evening. It’s a lot of moving parts to factor in & keep track of day to day. I find not having a fixed schedule that stays consistent is what makes it hard as you have to look at it every week and figure out how you manage all drop offs/pick ups, when is available to get shopping delivered etc. We also constantly seem to have a to do list for the house as it’s big and old and as soon as you repair or organise one thing something else crops up. I also swear I’m constantly getting rid of “stuff” by giving to charity shops or passing on through Olio but grandparents & other relatives are also buying more so we always seem to have too much and things get in a mess. A lot of it is a choice and I don’t object to doing it but for us it feels like quite a lot of work

I think much depends on your amount of contact with the state, and the part of it you need to engage with tbh.

I spent 2 years securing an EHCP for my daughter. That was a two day a week job.

I had coffee with a disabled friend recently and she instantly understood. She'd spent months getting a blue badge renewal (not a new one - a renewal - and she's no less disabled than she was the first time).

I remember my dad having a complete nightmare doing probate for my gran. And that was following years of stress for my mum dealing with social services on both sides of a county boundary.

And secondary school admissions are no picnic in some areas.

If you can avoid contact with the education, healthcare, social services, and legal system, I guess you're OK.

Although re-mortgaging can be surprisingly hideous.

I'm not sure i've ever rang my bank. I know the last time i stepped foot in one was 15 years ago when we took out the mortgage.

I didn’t think there was any such thing as life admin until I had elderly parents….then it went off the scale! Being a POA, managing their appointments and care (all at a distance) is time consuming (especially if you aren’t used to keeping accounts).
I managed a team at work, children through school, bills etc without the blink of an eye but being accountable to someone else is much more time consuming and relentless

I mean some of this comes down to luck, location and lifestyle.

I'm not somehow less organised than my DD's friends' mums where the child doesn't need an EHCP. Quite the reverse! And I say mums deliberately, as SEND admin is largely done by women in my experience.

Isn't life admin only really an issue when half of a pertnership leaves it all for the other half to do?

I live alone, for me it's just stuff I have to do.

When my husband was alive I was often infuriated by ending up having to sort his car insurance, buy his parents birthday presents and always having to book the holidays and travel.

To be fair, I tried to find the information in my app first but was unsuccessful. And sometimes I just like to hear it from someone rather than read it.

I think life admin is part of the 'we're so busy' thing that people come out with.

They're just chores, that take way less time than they used to thanks to the internet. I mean pet insurance and jabs? That's a once a year job, one of which only needs a few clicks on your phone to sort.

It is also about different stages of life requiring different types of life administration and more or less time.

For instance, money management. When we were young and skint, it was a simple matter of ‘balancing the budget’. Once we had children it got a bit more complex because we had to think of investing for both their university funding and our future retirement.

Now we are retired, it takes up a lot more time as we need to decide between cashing in vs keeping invested; if the latter, what investments for a shorter time horizon, might an annuity be worthwhile, should we take tax free lump sums from our pensions… It can get quite complex and requires a fair bit of research and planning.

I'm not being goady either, so I probably label them as "banking and essential correspondence".
When I was growing up, there was no such term as "mental load" and I was taught by my very down to earth parents that I can only truly rely on myself, as far as getting things done goes.
Also sorted myself out for a pretty easy life, which I wanted since teenage years.

So if all this is life admin and not life, what is life?

I rhink, OP, people who use the term 'life admin', do so as they think it sounds important. It's just stuff that needs doing.

I think a lot of it just organisation. I think my diary carries the mental load so I don't have to.

I'd say 'life' is the bit you get autonomy over, with your friends, family or chosen hobbies, which you only get to experience in the time left over once you have earned money to buy the items required to meet your needs and also done all the chores required to facilitate them.

When I say researching, I mean finding out what we've got available in the local area and then working out what day of the week they are on, how much they cost and then looking at the reviews, then contacting them to find out availability and if they actually have space. It took a few months to get DD into swimming lessons and I had to contact several pools before we found one that had an open waiting list.

Don't even get me started on the process of getting an NHS dentist for her.

Re dates in December, she has at least 2 birthdays, she's in a Christmas show with her theatre group on one of the Sundays, she has swimming every Saturday so a Saturday matinee is out, so we're looking at going to at least one of them on a weeknight, which can't be Tuesday or Thursday as she has activities on those nights. And then she is going to a different panto with school and another one with Rainbows so I'd like to try and put some distance between those as no-one wants to go to the theatre twice in one day. Maybe we'd be better going after Christmas.

Sorry, but when you're looking at taking a young child to a climate where you're expecting temps of -30C you'd be an idiot not to do as much research as possible around the best materials to wear, how many layers, where to buy them and what brands are trustworthy, what can be picked up from Primark or Lidl and what really needs to be the best quality. Unless you're a millionaire and can just buy the very best of everything.

As I said, some things, like getting her to decide on a Halloween costume and the finding it for a decent price (after she's already decided and changed her mind 8 times) isn't that time consuming, but it's all those things that add up.

And as I also said, if you find all this effortless then I'm very impressed by your organisation skills as I have always got a to do list running through my mind.

I do not live in a deeply sexist household, we've made a decision that I do the admin and he does more of the practical side of things which works well for us. We're both busy and frequently exhausted because that's what full time work and parenting looks like for a lot of families.