To find the homeschooling fad really braggy

[Kudosss]

Am I wrong to think there's something braggy and arrogant about homeschooling?

I'm NOT talking about the parents of SEN children who may not have been able to access a school, or feel it's in the child's best interest. I'm not even talking about the quiet ones who just get on with it. I do acknowledge our school system has it's problems but...

I'm talking about the loudly wholesome parents bragging about their lives and day, how much richer their kids are for being home schooled, outdoors yahdiya.

I mean I would love to be able to homeschool but the reality is I a) can't afford to and b) quite like the little bit of sanity I have left and c) I'm not so arrogant that I think I can undermine qualified teaching professionals with years of experience.

It's almost like these parents are basically announcing their wealth and privilege to the world without announcing their wealth and privilege and making everyone else feel inadequate.

@ThisGentleRaven Really? I haven't seen any threads like that.

But why can't home schoolers just be inspected like schools are?

Yes there are times where it has to be bit generally i am not for it, but i dont get people who have to make something about them, people talk about home schooling no i dont think it is bragging

If people think what others do is bragging i would say they need to look what is wrong with their life snd it says more about them than the home-schoolers, this 'they need to stop because it is all about me' is weird

Because that would be completely unrealistic for both the parents and the inspectors. Schools have to provide an overwhelming amount of evidence to verify what they're doing which parents realistically simply won't have if they're HEing. OFSTED often reach out to parents with children at the school to gather opinions and views so that they can check what the school is saying they are doing and the perceptions of external parties. They observe a variety of lessons for days at a time and interview lots of members staff. They review things like staff training, leadership and processes etc. They also take into account academic performance across lots of subjects using objective measures.

From doing all of the above, they can begin to understand how a school functions and how it is performing. There is absolutely no way such an inspection could be carried out for HE. All too often they rely on some submitted work as evidence and will carry out a relatively light touch review. There is far more lenience in terms of expectations in HE than there is for schools. For this reason it is absolutely possible for crap HE to not be identified and for children to be completely failed. Education is a human right and we are placing too much trust in people to deliver this properly. Ultimately the children will be the ones that pay the price and society will be stuck with a bunch of adults lacking basic skills.

I don't think home schooling people should be inspected as such but i think there should be someone similar to a health visitor or school nurse to look after homeschooled children in the same way that health visitors do for little ones. Routine development checks once every 18 months or so, vaccination clinics, free sessions similar to "stay and play" toddler groups but for older ones.

Obviously, it wouldn't need to be the same type of inspection, as it's just for one or two children. But I don't see why someone can't just visit, look at the children's work, chat to the parents and the child, and make sure it's all okay. I believe that's what happens now, except it's not compulsory.
I wouldn't like to see homeschooling banned or parents not given the choice. From our own experience, my dd had a horrific time at state secondary school, experienced appalling violence from other pupils, and the school and LEA were worse than useless. In the end, we withdrew her and sent her to an independent school, but if we hadn't been fortunate enough to be able to get help from family to do that, we would have considered homeschooling.
I think parental choice is important, and frankly, after our experience, I really don't trust the state education system to have the best interests of children at heart. I've seen plenty of threads on here of people who have had similar experiences to ours, so I know we are not alone.

But can't you see that the kind of light touch inspection that you suggest isn't massively useful and can be easily manipulated by the parents? It's not robust enough to identify where a children's emotional, social and educational needs aren't being properly met and would struggle to differentiate between parents talking the talk and actually walking the walk. Would you accept this kind of inspection for a school or nursery setting? I imagine you wouldn't as you know that an inspector really needs to get into the detail to spot failings, especially when it's in the school's/parent's interests to hide them. An inspector popping over to setting for a few hours looking over a bit of carefully curated work, chatting to teachers and some kids that have probably been coached and then signing everything off as ok would be extremely worrying. This is even more true in a HE setting where there are less adults involved and therefore less potential whistle blowers that will highlight wrongdoing.

I think most children have more than one state school that they can choose from or move to. Focus should be on getting these up to scratch and tackling issues. I also think that VAT should never have been added to private school fees.

@Marshmallow4545 I don’t think Ofsted inspections are particularly beneficial to state schools, so I don't feel homeschoolers not having that kind of inspection is any great loss. In some ways they can even make things worse, schools can end up prioritising looking good to Ofsted over the actual needs of pupils. I think you have a rather naive and idealised view of state education. I don't see why with homeschooling an inspector would need to 'look at a bit of carefully curated work', the parents can be asked to keep a record of all the written work done that year, the inspector can have a look at it and ask the child some questions if need be to gage their understanding, which actually gives them a better idea than an ofsted school inspection where the inspector will never see the individual children or their work, in fact many schools have been known to keep disruptive or sen children off school when ofsted come.
I would only consider removing parental choice to home school to be in any way appropriate if we got to a point where the state education system provided a safe environment and a good education for every single child, and that is very far from being the case at the moment. If we could get there that would be great, but at the moment we aren't even moving in that direction, if anything things are going backwards!
Right now home schooling provides an important alternative to many families where children have been badly failed by schools.
Most parents don't have a choice of several state schools. Many people live in areas where good schools are massively oversubscribed, or the cost of housing in decent catchment areas is extortionate. Many live in rural areas without a choice of schools. Many parents have children with sen who have no access to any school that can meet their needs. I didn't have any options of other state schools for my daughter, we were very lucky we had the option of private school but for many people home school is their only alternative.

It's so weird that you're so confident on talking about stuff that you really just don't know anything about.

The entire point of flexi schooling is that parents DO keep the child caught up on what they're missing when they're not in school. That's what flexi schooling is. So you're getting your knickers in a twist about... Nothing.

It's so weird that you're so confident on talking about stuff that you really just don't know anything about.

The entire point of flexi schooling is that parents DO keep the child caught up on what they're missing when they're not in school. That's what flexi schooling is. So you're getting your knickers in a twist about... Nothing.

It's almost like these parents are basically announcing their wealth and privilege to the world...and making everyone else feel inadequate

You can only feel inadequate if you think home educating is better/aspirational. You obviously do op but not everyone feels the same.

I don't feel envious of home schooling families at all, from either my own or the dc's perspective. I just feel a bit sorry for the kids in many instances.

I can't afford to home Ed. Even if I could I absolutely wouldn't do it. My teens have autistic traits and have struggled at times at school to fit in, understand and follow the many seemingly pointlesss rules school set. Both were even at risk of being kicked out at one point! which was very stressful.

However they have liked the structure of formal Ed and have gradually overcome some challenges with their social skills and dealing with demands. I am glad they persevered and both doing OK now with the odd wobble.

School is a bit of a one size fits all, but unfortunately so are many work environments. When they go into work the reality is they will need to deal witb demands, cope and adapt even with reasonable adjustments. I don't think home Ed would have set them up in the same way. I do appreciate though there are higher levels of ASD and some kids simply cannot cope with school.

oh yes, and we all know how it all works in real life😂

You know a lot about the theory, well done you. Unless you are one of those parents.

Who's going to pay for that? Councils are understaffed as it is, I think the priority might be social workers.

I absolutely don't have a naive view of state schools. I went to a below average state school in a rough area myself and my kids have been to state schools that have been rated as Outstanding in great areas and very mixed schools. I think OFSTED do an important job and whilst not perfect, I have broadly agreed with their findings at my children's schools. One school got a lower rating and this absolutely reflected the fact that standards had slipped. I have never experienced children being hidden or heard about it from friends that go to different schools. I'm not saying it doesn't happen but it certainly isn't commonplace in my opinion.

It simply isn't realistic for an inspector to look through a year's work for each individual child (which could be any or no syllabus), grill them on their understanding specifically and get a realistic view of what is happening at home everyday. Especially because unschooling and every other random theory or approach is apparently acceptable if the parents thinks it is. Most worryingly, how would safeguarding concerns be addressed in such a short session and how would it root out concerns around religious extremism or abuse? It's easy to cover up in a one off session but much harder to disguise when a child is amongst trained adults day in day out.

Most parents absolutely do have a choice of several state schools. In fact statistics suggest the majority of parents choose a school that isn't closest to them. The rural cases where there is only one viable school are very much the minority. Of course not everyone has access to the best schools but this doesn't mean that HE is a better alternative than school. HE is extremely risky for the child and we simply don't have the systems and safeguards in place to derisk it.

If they don't want to offer Flexi schooling they just... Don't

@Marshmallow4545 Here's an article about schools hiding disruptive pupils when ofsted visit. It's from a while ago but I am aware of another school doing something similar fairly recently. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-11773130
An inspector doesnt need to personally mark all a home schooled childs work, but they can look through it, and ask the child questions, which is more than happens for individual pupils at a school ofsted inspection.
I do think it's very naive to think that ofsted and the government are currently ensuring that children in state schools get a safe and appropriate education. A huge number of people do not have the ability to choose an appropriate school for their children, families of children with sen as well as many others. Home schooling is growing exponentially for that reason. The u.k. needs to focus on massively reforming state education, not forcing more pupils into it in its current state. There has been a huge rise in violence in schools. When surveyed a third of girls do not feels safe from sexual harassment in schools.One-quarter of them in mixed-sex schools experience unwanted touching, and an estimated 9 in 10 receive unsolicited images or experience sexist name calling.
Anyway, we will have to agree to disagree, thankfully there is no prospect of the government banning home schooling, so its all academic.
www.nasuwt.org.uk/article-listing/teachers-declare-pupil-behaviour-emergency.html
https://schoolsweek.co.uk/understanding-and-tackling-violence-against-girls-in-schools/
https://www.endviolenceagainstwomen.org.uk/campaign/abouttime/

Homeschooling is more than just a passing trend. When done properly through a reputable online school with all the necessary resources, it can be an extraordinary experience. On another note, bragging is worth discussing. Digital influencers essentially market themselves as products, and if their influence becomes overwhelming, it might be best to disconnect from them or even the internet altogether. Parents also tend to brag online, especially those with children in state schools, spending hours celebrating their excellent institutions. In this country, such behavior is often seen as a mark of extreme privilege. Meanwhile, they harshly criticize families who choose private education, labeling it the ultimate sin of privilege—though their own actions could arguably be worse.

Yes, a sect of them are. They're on social media thinking that they're talking down to people. Pontificating about how their kids know about taxes and corruption.

As if you can't teach that stuff in the time they're not in school, and so you should.

But teachers may be qualified but that doesn't mean they're intelligent and it's not really teachers they have an issue with, they work very hard and I've not seen anyone deny that. It's the curriculum, which they deem redundant.

What they fail to realise though is that it's not the content of the curriculum which truly matters. It's just fodder to teach and practise learning. If you can write an essay about WW1 you can write an essay about quantum physics (if you also know about QP obvs). If you can do algebra you can work out change. If you do basic maths and English you can navigate further in the world. That's why you gain a GENERAL certificate in secondary education. Although it should be CGSE.

So why bother writing a curriculum about Elon Musk when we can just teach Hitler, for example.

You mean the inspections that drove a head teacher to suicide a few years ago? You want that for home ed parents?

Not at all. I was responding to someone who said home schooling should be banned as its impossible for it to be inspected. As I said in another post, I think an inspector visiting, taking a look at the childs work and chatting to the child and parents is more than adequate.

" I think it's very naive to think that ofsted and the government are currently ensuring that children in state schools get a safe and appropriate education. A huge number of people do not have the ability to choose an appropriate school for their children, families of children with sen as well as many others. Home schooling is growing exponentially for that reason. The u.k. needs to focus on massively reforming state education, not forcing more pupils into it in its current state. There has been a huge rise in violence in schools. When surveyed a third of girls do not feels safe from sexual harassment in schools.One-quarter of them in mixed-sex schools experience unwanted touching, and an estimated 9 in 10 receive unsolicited images or experience sexist name calling."

I agree with this. For every thread full of vitriol towards Home Education, there are at least the same number discussing teacher burnout, teacher shortages, poor behaviours and violence in schools.

With Labour smacking VAT on Private schools, pushing yet more children into already full to bursting state schools, why on earth would anyone wish to make it harder to home educate and try to hold and push yet more children into state? Most of them left because of how awful it is.

The bottom line is, that the UK State Education system, much like the NHS is failing, outdated, oversubscribed and the staff within in it are in despair.

Reform and overhaul of state schooling is what is needed. You need to treat the disease rather than the symptoms of it then perhaps with a decent system, you all might see less "smug home educators".

ETA Quite where people think the money would come from for local authorities to provide all these visits and assessments of home educated children, god only knows. Most councils are broke.

We chose to home educate. DD has never been to school and this was our choice (though now she’s older it’s her choice and I would be happy for her to try school if she wants to see what it’s like, although I’d worry that she wouldn’t be getting as rigorous an education as she’s getting now).

I don’t think you would find our family particularly unusual if you met us irl; most of the families in our local HE community are normal professional families. There are a couple of “odd” folk, but I’m sure the same can be said of schools too and in my experience they are definitely the minority. How many elective home educators have you met in order to confidently make this generalisation?

It feels a bit damned if you do, damned if you don’t: if you show your life home educating then people like the OP think you’re being smug, if you don’t then people assume you’re strange or that you’re hiding something!

"It feels a bit damned if you do, damned if you don’t: if you show your life home educating then people like the OP think you’re being smug, if you don’t then people assume you’re strange or that you’re hiding something".

Exactly this!!