Schools admission criteria......

[LookingforMaryPoppins]

So, my youngest has her heart set on the same grammar school as her sister. She has worked hard and successfully passed the 11 plus. Really proud off her, she is dyslexic so no mean feat.... having just checked the admission criteria, having a sibling at the school makes no difference. Passing the 11 plus is the first criteria followed by children in care, pupil premium and then distance - she is bottom of the pile. If she doesn't get a place, which with that criteria is likely., the option is a sink failing school..... how is that fair?

How many miles is it door to door from your home to the school?

Could you upload the oversubscription criteria as I would anticipate the Pupil Premium criteria is likely to be linked to distance or living in a disadvantaged postcode (IDACI) and also limited in number, e.g. there was an article in the press this week about a high performing grammar which has changed its criteria this year to prioritise up to 15 pupils / 10% of the Yr. 7 cohort in this way, but that still leaves 85% plus of places for other candidates. When I checked the 2025 GCSE performance tables, published online, that particular school had not one child (0%) eligible for FSM / PP in the Yr. 11 cohort.

Very few kids go to grammar based on being in care or pupil premium. If they manage it after they’re states in life they more than deserve it, but it’s likely none are in care and only a handful are pp.

Unless you’re in a military town, there’s not gonna be that many kids in care/ eligible for pupil premium….

Thank you. Although I truly believe that me and my husband are the lucky ones to have found them. My kids aren't perfect, but neither are we and they just make me so proud. I can't begin to understand what they have been through, but we make sure they know everyday that we love them.

I do wonder if @LookingforMaryPoppins has ever really brushed up against poverty before and therefore she genuinely feels that prioritising DC who have been dealt a tough hand in life is unfair?

I know a few parents like this. They have always lived in a naice Grammar school area. Their DC have all gone to the naice village school. Quite a few of the mums haven't worked since having DC. They are in this afffluent bubble and genuinely don't have a clue how bad the world is out there.
I grew up in one of the poorest areas in UK, poverty and generational ineptitude were everywhere. Those who did work to try to better themselves and their family - via education & career prospects - just had so many barriers to overcome compared to MC families in affluent areas.

But all schools have to give priority to PP/FSM and LAC children? I'm not sure if it's different in grammars, but you'll need to remember that the school is literally paid by the DfE to assist these students and most schools can't function without that funding. LAC children also often move locations, so they can't really be expected to adhere to proximity rules.

Some stats for you: depending on the area, there are usually less than 2 LAC children per year group and around 30% PP/FSM. This may be much lower if they're required to pass the 11+, as disadvantaged students typically have lower educational outcomes (which is awful, unfair, and the reason it's a priority to support these students in most schools).

Our (not so) local grammar has the same admissions criteria - siblings don't even come into it - they serve their local area first.

If she doesn't get in (she might actually get in?) you can always waitlist and hope that your daughter will get in, on appeal - they may rank siblings higher at that point.

My husband is teaching at a grammar school. Imagine less than 5 pupils admitted from foster care/low income and it's not a small school.

My husband work voluntary for a programme with free tutoring for children in care and low income households. So few of them have a reel chance in life and doing well in education. Many are moved around placements frequently and change school often.
Foster parents are of couse not required to have an academic level to tutor or spend own money on it. Foster children don't come with money for tutoring.

it's mostly a thing for well educated or high earning families to pass +11 for grammar schools. So don't envy a few children higher up the list than your own.

I too have found it a bit strange that pupils who are "looked after" always seem to be prioritized

So in essence, this is a thread complaining about pupils in care / on pupil premium being prioritised for admission. Nice one.

I’ve just checked are looked after dc have had priority by law since 1998 so nothing has changed between your dc op.

You are being ridiculous. Children qualifying for PP are usually massively under represented at Grammar schools - stating the obvious children on PP tend to come from families without spare funds for tutoring that seems rife these days.

LAC & PP will make up a tiny number of acceptances. So your DD is on distance same as almost all the other candidates.

There will also be loads of other children at the non-grammar who also just missed out. When you slice away top set children, the average results in the remaining schools are bound to be lower, but that doesn't automatically mean your child can't do well.

Our grammar admission is a PAN of 200 with over 700 applications for these spaces.

This is their criteria;

1. pupils in EHCP or care
2. 22 closest to school (no test required)
3. sibling (no test)
4. musical aptitude (separate music tests)
5. up to 65 academic ability (weird ranking and eligibility systems in place) in eligible areas...
6. children of staff
7. closest to school

Out of 200 places.

Education, Health And Care (EHC) Plan - 9

Children looked after - 5

22 closest to school - 22

Sibling - 66

multiple birth- 2

Music - 10

Academic - 65

Children of Staff - 17

Any other applicant - 4

I can't believe you have come here with a 'poor me' attitude. The number one factor for any child in getting in is passing the 11+. It is statistically far harder for a pupil premium child to pass the 11+ because they are disadvantaged. There will be a far fewer number of children living in care.

The fact you are blaming kids from this category for potentially taking a place from your child is disgusting. A child in these positions is actually far less likely to even apply for the school let alone get in. If your daughter doesn't get a place it won't be their fault at all, it'll be yours for not living close enough to the school. You're awful.

@MoosesareREAL There are different types of PP, you are thinking of the military service aspect, but the majority are eligible because they are eligible / or have been eligible in the past 6 years for means tested Free School Meals. Some schools may have one child in that category and for some it could be half (or more) of their cohort.

If I were, which I wasn't but let's play that game, then these parents on less that £7399 would only be marginally more workshy and useless than those on £7401, with all the same disadvantages that you laid out.

The point, my point, was these cliff edge points that attempt to achieve equity often only achieve the gloss of progress can be achieved at the expense of those who only just surpass the threshold. But knock yourself out, enjoy your righteousness.

So you're happy for the government to fund an enhanced education for your DD but annoyed that said government wants to also use those funds for other pupils it thinks should have access to it ahead of your child? Righty-ho then.

Of course you’re not unreasonable to want the best for your daughter and it’s great she has a parent behind her advocating for her and trying to get the best for her.

OP, if your child is bright enough to pass the 11+ she is likely to be one of the 20% who get the required GCSE grades no matter which school she attends. She may also have a better experience than struggling to keep up in a grammar school and the toll this takes on self confidence, particularly as she’s dyslexic.

We still have grammar schools in our area, so we moved out of the area when DC were very young to avoid them. My DC went to the local comprehensive school and all did very well. We moved back when the DC were adults and the same divisive issues still exist - relentless tutoring, kids travelling up to 40 miles each way to get to grammar schools, kids suffering from MH problems because of the pressure etc. I’m very glad we made those decisions on behalf of our DC.

Do you know what "looked after" means? It means that for a multitude of reasons their birth families can not care for them and they are "looked after" by the state. These are the most disadvantaged and traumatised children, who have had to experience the worst things in life at a very young age. They should be our absolute priority for education support.

You're a snob op
Find the private school fees you'd be more comfortable there seemingly.

Just a thought OP - your grammar school is usual if there’s no staff places. Most round us have 4 or so places reserved for children of staff who have passed the 11+. (In many years, that would be more than look after places).

No, I don't think this is unfair. It's the same type of argument used by those that resent kids with an EHCP getting extra support or those with serious medical conditions receiving DLA or PIP.

Children in care are already significantly more disadvantaged than your daughter. Giving those that manage to pass the 11+ (no doubt with no tutoring) priority is an attempt to level the playing field. It's also not new or a choice made by the school; it's a requirement for all state schools.

If your daughter scores well enough in the exam, she will get in.

You genuinely can't think of a reason why they would have priority? Or by 'strange' do you really mean that you don't agree with it and believe that the privileged children of middle class parents who can afford to pay for tutoring and to buy houses in the catchment areas of high-achieving grammar schools should continue to take priority?

Have a look on the school website for the % of children that have PP, in most grammar schools is it usually much lower than the catchment area. It might reassure you that your daughter isn’t being disadvantaged.

OPs kids have much bigger issues than if they get into grammar school. Namely a mother who lacks any intellectual curiosity as to why looked after children or on pupil premium might be identified as benefiting from some positive discrimination. And as for describing her family as normal ….. and the unspoken abnormality of anyone not like her. If you are still reading OP catch yourself on. You should be ashamed of yourself.