Is fatphobia a real thing?

[AnxiousApocalypse]

Having watched the Panorama documentary on the Met Police and the police officer making rude comments about a fat woman and how "she was so fat she had two pussies", I'm wondering how much hate and disgust most people truly have against fat people? I'm not excusing it and saying it's not dangerous for your health to be overweight or obese, but surely being rude and ignorant isn't the answer?

Having been an almost ovese body (size 18) and dropped to a size 10 I can confirm in my experience people are treated differently (better) when thinner. Maybe it’s actually that when bigger people become invisible. I don’t know but it’s a horrible feeling to experience.

And I also now look at women who are fatter with empathy and sadness at the impact the weight is on health & knowing the not impossible steps I took to reduce (no medication) it is possible to sort out. I realise that’s ironic because I used to be bigger but when I was bigger I wasn’t able to connect the dots of my breaking body (and mind) with my size. I can now.

so yes people do think on the whole in my opinion more negatively on people who are fatter.

on a side note - the documentary showed disgusting behaviour from people meant to protect and serve us.

I'm so sorry that happened: its awful - and I hope you got the job anyway!

Strangely, in answer to your question about what must they be saying behind your back, there is something about the people who say these things that means, from what I've seen, they tend to be equally unkind to someone's face as behind their back. I think because the underlying drive IS to be unkind and it's never going to have that impact on a third person. I have a couple of larger friends, and the worst comments I have heard about them were either said to them when I was with them or reported as having been said to them.

You may need to work on your body, but some people need to work on much deeper problems than that.

I do agree with you, and funnily enough in my post I was going to speculate that the pressure on the NHS may be part of the mindset. But then that would also apply to alcoholics, to smokers, to.. I don't know, motorcyclists.... none of those groups get the level of vitriol that fat people do, so there's something more to it than that I think. Plus of course this vitriol is not confined to the UK.

And it doesn't explain the annoyance that a lot of people seem to have with those who are using Mounjaro, despite the fact that the vast majority of those people are paying for it privately. Presumably those who are worried about the NHS should be universally delighted with the take-up of Mounjaro...

Maybe it's also an evolutionary thing - a very overweight person would not be much help in times gone by. Too fat to climb trees for berries, walk far for water or stalk animals. So not attractive.
There's also the inferred gluttony, mentioned upthread. When food is scarce, as it was for most until very recently in evolutionary terms, over-eating would have been rather a faux pas. Fat people would have been despised for taking more than their fair share. That is no longer the case, but the judgement remains.

But I think there is something more going on to be honest.

All the time I see faces I think are actually really ugly. Ironically, its often very slim women past a certain age, who have a sort of sour, gaunt look. But many, many people are ugly. We think things - of course we do - but I would take every measure possible to try to avoid them guessing I was thinking anything uncharitable.

I also find certain body types unattractive. I wouldn't treat them differently for it. I don't much like the look a long-bodied, short legged people, or of very pear shaped women with wide hips and flat chests. Skinny-hipped or narrow-shouldered men are not attractive to me. It happens that we don't like things but we GET OVER IT and treat them the same as everyone else.

There is something different going on with fat-shaming beyond just not liking the look of it. I think it's to do with it being socially acceptable to be nasty in that rare circumstance so certain types of people have to milk it as an outlet for something going on inside them.

It also has its evolutionary advantages. Maybe my fat genes come from ancestors who successfully stored fat for hard times?

I don't think it's that because in some societies and eras fat - or at least plump - has been seen as attractive.

I'd almost say it's the opposite: when times are hard or food is not easily come-by, fat has been seen as a sign of superiority in the sense that they have lots of what everyone else can't get.

I think there's also an innate sense of revulsion when we perceive others to have taken more than their fair share of resources. We're animals, and for many thousands of years life hasn't been this cushy. We used to live in tribes hunting and gathering food, obtaining food was the bulk of our work and if we didn't make sure what we had went around everyone some people would starve. So when we see really overweight people (not just a bit overweight, obese) I do think there's this subconscious revulsion/anger as if that person has deprived others of food by hoarding and scoffing the lot.

Obviously most of us don't have to live like that now thankfully, someone eating triple their needed calories doesn't mean I can't get enough calories. But I don't think evolution can change our psychology that quickly.

I had a former MD tell me she wouldn’t employ a fat person. And that member of staff who was overweight surprised her and actually works hard and isn’t lazy

Made me feel awful as a person whose weight has fluctuated up and down and if I’d applied for work there at the ‘wrong’ time I would have been rejected

I think heavy drinkers, smokers and motorcyclists DO get the same level of vitriol.
Noone minds someone 1 stone overweight, in the same way noone minds someone who drinks half a bottle of wine at the weekend, or likes the odd pint. But, I guess if we're using this analogy, an obese person is like an alcoholic - pissed up, damaged liver, ruddy face - and they ARE harshly judged.

Wow.

A pissed person is judged harshly because they cannot interact sensibly, not because their face is ruddy.

Also do I infer from your username you have tattoos?

We can all be judgmental about appearances ...

He isn't fat phobic he is a horrible misogynist. Who incidentally is also overweight.

Well yes that’s the point isn’t it! The oh I don’t judge threads are rubbish. It’s an evolutionary imperative, it’s why we have survived. It’s why I need to know if the person I am alone with is male or female

Yes of course it's a thing.

How's your voting supposed to work?

Yes but the distinction is between simply not liking the look of something and thinking it is a justifiable basis for rude and derogatory comments, or for treating someone as somehow lesser.

Really? I think a boozer who endlessly props up the bar at their local can probably interact sensibly most of the time, but they're still harshly judged for being a boozer.

And no, my username is a reference to something else entirely - an old xfm radio show! 😅 I'm not called Stan either!

To be brutally honest, I despise obese people. Hopefully, this would never show, however, as everyone deserves to be treated with respect, dignity, and kindness.

Yes, there are some conditions that cause or contribute to this condition that are nobody's fault, but the majority simply eat too much and refuse to take personal responsibility.

We don't see many obese people in areas hit by famine, do we?

But why "despise" them?

In answer to @TattooStan, I believe drunks are judged harshly because their drunken behaviour often - usually in fact - impacts others round them, either because they become violent, or abusive or irresponsible.

What would make you despise someone for a reason like that? There are lots of superficial things I don't like about people because they aren't to my taste, but despise them for it is so strange. In fact, I'd say that kind of attitude is actually more despicable than physical appearances could ever be.

Do you despise people who are underweight? I mean it's not difficult...take some responsibility and eat more...

Exactly, hypothyroidism is very easy to treat. It's harder to diagnose but treatment is generally just oral medication. In hyperthyroidism they actually will sometimes damage the thyroid because it's easy to meditate.

@StripyShirt can I ask why you actually despise obese people? As in, what form does that take internally for you? Do you think that's a reasonable position to hold? Do you think you are successful at hiding your views when you are forced to interact with someone who is obese? I think that despising someone might be quite hard to cover up.

Thankfully, I am now just a bit overweight, so I guess you might just dislike me a bit, rather than despise me, as you would have done previously when I was morbidly obese.

I’ve certainly sensed that feeling of being despised before by a trimmer workmate. Horrible. This was also someone who, when someone died, liked to point out whatever he felt the person had done in terms of lifestyle to cause their own death. I think it was a form of self-preservation. A lot of people do it. But he was particularly smug.

@StripyShirt not that I want to pile on, but surely "despise" is a bit strong? You can judge a lack of action or against your personal standards of beauty/attractiveness etc. Contempt is one thing but hatred is quite another.

Obesity is one of the leading causes of death and illness, and is a selfish use of food and medical resources. Being underweight isn't.

Anyone allowing this to happen to themselves and inflicting it on others because they can't/won't control their appetite is not deserving of indulgence.