To reject trainee surgeon?

[RunningThroughMyHead]

My young child is on the wait list for eye surgery. It’s a complex surgery with risks of blindness or other permanent eye issues if not done correctly. These risks have been explained to us but the benefits outweigh the risks.

My husband took him to the last appointment and the surgeon explained that a student surgeon may undertake all or part of the surgery under his supervision. My husband nodded along as far as I can tell.

Whilst I fully understand that healthcare professionals need to practice, perhaps selfishly, I don’t want my son practiced on. I wouldn’t forgive myself if something happened and I want someone well experienced to do the full surgery.

AIBU to request/insist on this?

OP I am on your team with this one and don’t understand some of the comments on this thread!

How do they get that experience?

I think you are wrong, you will have the consultant there and a registrar, two senior doctors with many years experience. The one with less experience doing the surgery but under the guidance of the consultant.

If it is an unusual surgery the theatre might also have quite a few observers.

Most surgeons that I have known are pretty fussy about who is operating on them and have a good ask around first. So I am not convinced by those who are coming on here saying that the trainee will be fine.

But, OTOH, if the trainee has actually done the operation many times before, he may be an excellent choice. Totally fair to ask.

But I also take the point that on the NHS you don’t get the choice other than the hospital, and there may even be a long wait for that.

Maybe, OP, if you say what the procedure is, some experts on here will be able to advise whether the risks are actually considerable or that it is relatively straightforward.

That,
they train next generation and you can say no but you won’t be there so they will do as they please.
you can refuse the surgery or pay privately for an very senior surgeon…but there aswell can be a mistake. What will you tell yourself then?

Having recently gone through the same i hope your daughter is doing well

Having recently gone through the same i hope your daughter is doing well

There is no such thing as a student surgeon. Whoever this is will have a minimum of 10 years experience and will be watched by an extremely experienced eye surgeon so you’re child will be doubly safe and get the highest level of care.

Are you sure the consultant said ‘student’? They are usually referred to as Resident Doctor or Registrar. Most of us have no idea who actually carries out our surgery but there is always a Consultant on hand supervising the process. You should be grateful your DS is getting such good treatment free of charge.

What is it you don’t understand?

As a ODP 100% the “student” will be supervised by the senior who will be scrubbed in to assist should the need arise…..when they say student its definitely not someone in 1st 2nd or 3rd yr of Uni 🤣🤣 theyve had a wealth of experience and knowledge and could be now specialising in this role.
further to this its known that more experienced people tend to make more “mistakes” because they are complacent and “could do this in there sleep” where as a junior would be well read and prepared for the procedure whilst seeking out guidance if they needed to.

@KidsDr no, actually I don't.
If you have been following this you would know why I wrote it that way.
I hope assuming isn't something you do often, maybe next time ask and find out. Diagnostics at its finest............

If you are under the NHS then they are not asking you I'm afraid. They are informing you. Unless you go private you don't get a choice, besides refusing the entire surgery.
Be mindful that if you refuse it they are not obligated to offer you another surgery with the consultant operating - you will be put to the bottom of the list to wait again and you are likely still end up with a registrar doing the surgery.

Regardless of who operates the consultant is still responsible for the outcome - so they're not going to let a registrar do anything they are not fully capable of.

People are frustrated, I think, with the fact this information is readily available online, you can literally google it and it will tell you registrars are incredibly well trained, are not considered "students" and that you don't really get a choice - not in the sense that you can insist a consultant does the entire surgery. Best to do minimal research yourself before seeking an opinion in such a large forum.
Your OP does sound rather disparaging, it would have been less so if you'd looked into it a little bit and understood who would be assisting and the level of experience they actually have. Realistically your question would be different also "Should I refuse a surgery my child needs because a registrar will be performing some or all of it? Despite the fact if I refuse it the next surgery I'm offered may also be performed by a registrar?" I think that question really answers itself and you would not have had to endure the negative feedback.

As a parent you're going to worry - but you also are responsible for being realistic. It's hard but we have to at least try to set aside our emotions and make logical decisions.

Yes you do have the right to choose to go private.

So why did you ask, if you've already decided?

Im very grateful for the NHS - but it’s not free. I pay for it every month.

I'm sorry that I seem to have offended you. I wasn't trying to be rude. Whereas I think you are now trying to be rude. So we'll leave it at that.

As we all do. So how does that work, if we all pay through our NI and so on, yet YOU want to call the shots on who treats your family? You must see that can't work. And you do know there is a different more expensive option that gives you that choice.

Mother of a doctor here. Quite cross to realise she probably has to put up with stuff like this from entitled patients.

It is free at point of access! You wonder why people have been harsh with you on this thread it’s because of this kind of attitude. A lot of people work very hard in our NHS which is massively underfunded and staff are overworked.
Would I be happy that a Registrar was carrying out an operation on my child - yes, I would 100%

The majority are actually net takers rather than net contributors so it would depend on your income and other factors.
Even if you are a top 1% income tax payer, you still don't get to pick your surgeon if you choose to use the NHS. That is what private medicine enables.

Maybe the student is the person who’s been doing these surgeries daily and the experienced person has been watching to make sure that it’s done correctly, which is usually the case a majority of the time, how else are students going to gain experience and learn??

NHS is free at the point of access for citizens. We don’t directly pay for it. If you are referring to taxes / NI then that is for a range of public services with some of it going into the NHS.

We are extremely lucky to have an NHS service. In other countries you would pay taxes and separately still have to pay for medical insurance… which may or may not cover the costs of such an operation. Or you would pay privately as needed. Even if covered via insurance you still couldn’t dictate who did the operation.

Are you paying in as much as you’re getting out though, given that your child is having a specialised operation?
(Not that you would have to be, as this is exactly how the system is supposed to work, but something to consider if you think you’re paying enough to decide which highly qualified medical professional meets your criteria)

I think for your peace of mind, you need to make a phone call and ask the questions to the hospital themselves. If you're still not happy with their answers, request a different dr, but I would hear them out properly 1st

You pay a contribution. It is very unlikely you will pay enough this year to cover the cost of your son's surgery, let alone everything else he will have had leasing up to that.

Come on @RunningThroughMyHead, of course you contribute to the NHS and your family's treatment on it with the NHS.

And they take on responsibility for sourcing pipeline of GPs, specialists & surgeons - training them up AND deciding when they are ready/need experience with adding new surgical procedures.

If you are not happy with the NHS's decision on who will perform the surgery on your child, you are - of course - welcome to withdraw the patient from the list.

Or go private so you can select exactly who your preferred surgeon is and pay accordingly.