School residential vegetarian/vegan only

[vgp1234]

My child had really been looking forward to their year 6 residential, but a new head has joined and had changed the format somewhat.

They have now booked a Sustainability Centre in Hampshire, which only caters for vegetarians and vegans. My child is not a vegetarian or vegan, and across the cohort of year 5 and 6 only one child is vegetarian.

While I appreciate that there is a view that they can go 5 days without meat and they should just suck it up, I find it incredibly frustrating that you would not ask a vegetarian or vegan child to suck it up and eat meat for 5 days. So I don't understand why we do not treat both dietary preferences with equal measure.

The new head is very keen on government guidance, and has changed our lunch menu to comply with the current guidance for school lunches which is that 3 days should include meat or fish (previously we had a meat and vegetarian/vegan option every day). However it seems this guidance only applies on the school site, so you can disregard it at a residential. While they are within their rights to do this, it does seem like quite a contradiction.

I have tried speaking to the Sustainability centre directly but they were very inflexible and just stated it is a against their ethos (may I add that they also offer a day trip at a cost to visit a working farm, who rear animals for meat, so their ethos does not run all that deep). This really goes against my ethos as not only do I think you should treat all groups equally, I can't help but feel that this is forcing their ideas on children verses allowing them free choice and the ability to hear both viewpoints (meat is unsustainable/sustainable) and make their own decision.

In all honesty I'm quite perplexed as to why the school choose the venue when it would clearly be controversial, as this is quite a personal choice for parents and the cohort has so few in it that have this dietary preference.

I'm sure some people will not agree with me, and I am open to your opinions as I'm a big believer in hearing both sides of the argument and our ability to think critically for ourselves and not be told what to think (I want this for my child too).

I do plan to send the school an email initially and request that they provide a rounded menu including meat. But I'd really appreciate any advice on how to word this appropriately as I'm quite upset by it, and I'd prefer to send a well worded email than an emotional one.

Except we don't know that. Those glossy marketing image are a big red flag. No school child is getting a food that that look like that.

I have tasted good vegetarian food but the center there will absolutely not have the budget for mass producing food of that quality if they are catering for schools.

Whereas the meat options would be free range, organic and grass fed no doubt. 🙄

I now understand who the parents handing turkey twizzlers through the schools gates in protest at Jamie Oliver were.

Won’t someone save the children from big fibre!

Oh I do love a good dose of irrationality and completely unfounded accusations to support a weak position

and If the food quality was questionable then I would never eat the meat offering / sawdust and minced sinew ( and if you think that sounds unjustified look again at your own statement )

This thread has also discussed the merits (or otherwise) of a vegetarian/non meat diet, so it was a perfectly acceptable comment within that context. Discussions invariably tend to expand on the original subject. Besides, what harm could it do to read a snapshot of children's diets during the war. If nothing else it offers a bit of interest and educational value and you could always just ignore those couple of sentences if they offend.

And lentils would be quite a cost-effective option for a ‘shitty residential camp’ . . .

100%. In many of these cases it is obvious that it is their parents who have a restricted diet which they are been imposing on their children. Of course there are many ND kids who have genuine aversions to certain textures, or Arfid etc . But I can tell on here which parents are the ones influencing and supporting the limited diet at home.

i forget that there are still families in this day and age who have to have meat every single day. It feels so old-fashioned to me.

What an unnecessarily unpleasant way to talk about somewhere you've presumably never visited. And if you want to talk about the cost effectiveness of a vegetarian diet, lentils, chickpeas, beans etc. are about as cheap as it gets. Even paneer is cheaper than a decent cut of meat.

I have a vegetarian neurodiverse child - imagine! They are all different...

Depends on the menu. If its nice fresh veggies with pulses and imaginaive dishes that qspundqsq fine. If its mass catering and they are reying on processed soya/tofu based fake meats then no, I would not be happy as my child wpuld be unlikey to eat them

One is an ethical, religious, environmental harm decision ..the other is a personal preference..they are not equivalent positions unless you are severely anaemic without access to healthcare or some similar extreme situation. Vegetarian and vegan food isn’t just vegetables either. Would your child not eat soup, jacket potato, chilli, macaroni cheese, pasta and sauce, lasagne? I don’t get the drama at all

YABVU

It’s 5 days and completely incomparable to a veg child being asked to eat meat.

The whole point of Y6 residential trips is for children to have new experiences. I think it’s fab that they are carrying this over into mealtimes.

Also curious, where I used to work the Y6 went on a residential in Hampshire that was veggie but then visited a farm on the last day and ate meat and eggs from the farm, again as part of the experience. Maybe it’s the same place? If so, our Y6s LOVED IT.

I meant that variety and being exposed to a wider range of foods/dishes can lead to a more sophisticated palate.

Whatever the budget, it is cheaper to.provide good quality vegetarian food than good quality meat.

So providing meat would require either a) increasing the cost or b) reducing the quality of the food.

The photos are irrelevant.

If that’s the case, if they were serving meat it wouldn’t be lightly poached corn-fed chicken, or grass fed steak, would it? It would be cheap bangers and nuggets.

No offence taken 😊

Whereas they cater for meat eaters with grass fed organic beef and free range chicken. Sure they do.

Meat eaters almost all (99%) eat vegetables as well. In fact most people are omnivores not 'Meat eaters' or carnivores. They eat everything.

Vegetarians by definition do not eat meat. They do not eat everything.

Omnivores are being asked to omit one bit of their diet for 5 days. They will be given suitable nutrition, they may even eat better.

You are asking vegetarians to add something to their diet that they do not eat for moral/ethical or even religious reasons.

It also makes me think you are 'that parent". Sorry about that but thats what I come away thinking from your post.

Actually I'm surprised at the number of protests from parents of ND children, as mine has never eaten meat as has issues with the texture (and as she got older and realised what it was it also became an ethical thing) - for ND children real meat is surely a nightmare texture wise. V unpredictable. Totally off topic but just noting my surprise.

I think I am not the person you intended to ask this question? I haven't cited anyone.

If you ask a vegetarian to eat meat then we are talking about the presence of a food that for whatever reason they do not consume, asking them to eat something that is not a part of their diet ever. So they would be going against a medical, ethical, religious, sensory or whatever it may be rule that they follow.

If you ask someone who eats meat to have meals that do not contain meat, then no such thing is happening. You are simply removing one of the foods they do eat from the meal but you are not asking them to consume anything they cannot already eat.

A better comparison would be a vegetarian child who always has pudding or always has some kind of grain in their meal being expected to eat meals without that.

I sympathise with the fact that you may be unimpressed with the menu, and you have every right to raise that issue. Please do try and understand the difference above though because if you go in with this false equivalence they will just think you have no understanding of the issues.

I think you need to educate yourself. Of course isn't is entirely possible to provide a nutritious, balanced vegetarian diet for a child. It is harder to do this with a vegan diet, but unless the child is dairy and egg free then they can eat well.

The argument you put forward is presumably something you have researched, or at the very least read somewhere? I’m assuming you’re not making those claims out of a blue sky? I would be interested in tracking down the peer-reviewed source(s) for your argument. I have a professional interest and am curious about where these misconceptions come from.

Not sure why it should surprise you that different autistic children have different preferences.

Yes, i've had this experience. Work events decided they were going to be only vegetarian/vegan which took off the few gluten free options they had completely off the menu. Couldn't even get a brand of crisps that were gluten free!

"why meat eaters are treated differently". Have you ever seen a menu? Usually they have one or two vegetarian options and perhaps one of those is vegan too. It's always spicy. Whereas meat options are usually over 10 choices.

Go or don't but put the self pity violin back in its case.