Irresponsible and unhelpful article about baby’s death?

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https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c864g0evz9jo.amp

I am genuinely very confused about this article and would appreciate if someone could shed light so we can learn from it.

It says that the mother “had failed to notice her daughter's deterioration” and this presumably led to the baby’s tragic death. But I have no idea what the signs of deterioration would have been? As a new mum maybe it is not as obvious to me as it might be for others.

There seems to be great emphasis on the alcohol and tobacco consumption, but nothing to say that this directly impacted - e.g. baby someone fallen on or got hold of cigarettes so it’s unclear why this is actually relevant? Clearly it is not a crime have booze and fags, so what exactly has happened here?

It seems like there is some fairly crucial information missing? AIBU to think this type of article is alarming enough to raise anxiety levels but too vague to actually help inform or equip parents and careers. And also stigmatises a mother who, other than drink and smoke, does not explicitly seem to have done something harmful. If she has missed some critical signs of declining health then we really need to know what they were!

Are you seriously trying to excuse her behaviour?

Being too drunk to look after your 5 month old to the point you do not realise they have not woken in the morning IS harmful though. If a
sober mother did the same it would also be neglect but in this case the alcohol is a crucial factor in neglect.
i presume the critical signs of serious illness will be the same as they are for any critical illness in a baby - lethargy/struggling to breathe/unresponsiveness/mottled or blue colour etc…

This is the second thread this weekend trying to excuse what the mother did. Crazy.

What the actual fuck are you on about op

I don't think anyone is suggesting that if the baby was looked after properly that she would've died.

I am not excusing anything. I am asking what CAUSED the death! Drinking booze and having fags alone does not cause a baby to die? Was it therefore SIDS!
My issue is with the vagueness of the article, I am not trying excuse or criticise the mother in any way - I can’t because I don’t understand exactly what happened due to the lack of detail!

Can anyone actually identify what the cause of death was here? That’s my question, to make it simple

err no

That helpful to understand the signs - what was the illness that caused the death then do you reckon?

The article states that she didn’t cause or foresee the child’s death which is why she was convicted on child cruelty rather than murder/manslaughter.

However, the references to alcohol and going outside to smoke are because she wasn’t supervising the child properly or in a fit state to notice and deal with any issues. Again, she didn’t directly cause the child’s death but she had a duty of care to look after her child and she didn’t do that because she was too intoxicated and repeatedly left the house to smoke (sadly the child died which meant her behaviour was investigated).

It’s unclear from the article why the child died and whether there would have been signs of deterioration that she could have noticed if she’d been sober and supervising properly (the lack of causation is probably why she wasn’t charged with manslaughter). Sadly sometimes there aren’t always signs that a child is deteriorating (e.g. SIDs), but sometimes there are (e.g. when the child is unwell, crying/distressed etc) and she wasn’t in a fit state to notice, monitor or address any problems.
She failed to notice that the child didn’t wake up in the morning and she didn’t properly check on her during the night- the signs of rigor mortis means the child had been dead for some time before her mother noticed. If there had been an issue and the child could have been saved then the mother wouldn’t have known.

It doesn’t confirm the cause of death. It doesn’t need to. Your curiosity about the cause of death here is execessive.

I am genuinely very confused about this article and would appreciate if someone could shed light so we can learn from it.

The actual cause of death has not been shared that I have seen. It could have been sids, it could have been something like positional asphyxiation where the baby got wedged somehow in the couch and wasn't able to breathe, it could be that she hadn't had milk in so many hours that she became critically dehydrated.

I think what we can all take from this is that if we are the only adults responsible for a baby we should not get so drunk that we are unable to actually be responsible for the baby.

Er no, just trying to understand exactly what happened - why would I try to excuse her, I don’t even know the details of what happened which is exactly why I find it unhelpful! A healthy baby does not simply die within hours due to lack of supervision, milk or attention. So what caused it

And also stigmatises a mother who, other than drink and smoke, does not explicitly seem to have done something harmful.

Well it sounds very much as though you are

Wow, I’m sorry if wanting to learn about important signs and critical illness to prevent baby death as a new parent seems excessive to you

They aren’t obliged to share the cause of death with the general public.

How regularly do you get extremely drunk, dump your baby on the sofa and then ignore them for 14 hours?

My entire point is to understand what actually happened. If I don’t understand it, due to a lack of information provided by the journalist, I can hardly excuse or criticise it can I!

I’ve never done it? Not sure why that is your assumption here! I am just trying to learn from what is a tragic event which has been reported presumably for the public to learn from, but which I think fails to provide some pretty crucial details… how on earth am I being painted the bad guy! Mental

As a new parent I imagine you are alert to every sneeze, snuffle & cry from your baby. If your baby stopped behaving normally you would almost certainly be aware. The cause the death of this baby doesn't need to be publicised, but the carelessness (other words spring to mind) of the mother does need to be publicised so that others think twice.

Your best bet for this kind of information is to ask your health visitor or look at the NHS website (there are a list of signs for when you should seek medical attention). The Lullaby Trust also has good information on safe sleep to prevent SIDs and positional asphyxia.
The court report into the death of a child isn’t going to have this information for you.

This isn’t the way to go about that. This is an article about a specific case in which the parent was so drunk off her arse that she wasn’t even aware that her baby didn’t wake up.

If you’re concerned about other things such as SIDS in general, then google the lullaby trust and stop speculating on this case.

i also agree with a PP about your ridiculous ‘stigmatisation’ comment.

Well as you’re after tips to avoid doing the same thing people will likelg assume thats how you choose to parent. As otherwise you don’t need to ask how to avoid doing it.

Another thread defending this parent who failed to care for their baby to the extent that the baby died? How odd.

I know, there was also a thread I think on Friday where a number of posters were annoyed that a nursery worker was being punished for sexually abusing children. A lot
of MN parents don’t seem to value the welfare or safety of children at all.

I can see what the op is saying. Is the offence being drunk and irresponsible or is it her failure to act to help her child who needed medical supervision? If it's the latter, and the child was healthy when put down to sleep - is the expectation that it is criminal to not pro-actively check that a healthy child has become unwell overnight?

I expect the baby wasn't fine when put to sleep though, op. You can have say a wheezing baby who is general unwell, but might perk up in the afternoon and be described as 'fine', but actually if you have been told to look for blue around the lips, or tugging at the throat and under the ribs, that they aren't and were never fine - they just weren't being noisy in their distress - and that kind of observation would require you to be alert and sober. Breathing issues is the one I'm most familiar with but I expect there are lots of things which are similar.