Why is the public directing their anger at the individual asylum seeker that arrives at the shore…

[AnotherNC12345]

… rather than the smuggling / trafficking gangs that are responsible for the journey?

I think it’s very extreme to put all of the blame and the anger at the individual that arrives, rather than the people responsible for orchestrating the whole process. These individuals are often ‘sold the dream’ and hooked in by organised crime groups who direct them to the UK. I’ve looked at sample routes from different parts of the world (screenshots may be pending) and these are complex and would need local people, as well as law enforcement, customs officers and other government officials to turn a blind eye involved in smuggling across multiple borders.

It’s no secret that these crossings likely cost a lot of money, and I think it would be safe to assume that refugees would often be in crippling debt to the OCGs who will put pressure on them to pay it back, by threatening them and their families and I would go as far as to say they could then be coerced in to further committing crimes when granted asylum in order to pay back their debt.

These OCGs are likely involved in other trafficking / crime, not just of asylum seekers but likely drugs, weapons and sex as they have the connections across those borders.

I think it’s very unlikely that an asylum seeker is sitting there looking at all the European government websites and shopping for a country with the best benefits package and approaching a trafficker with a brochure like they’re picking a Jet2 holiday. But this is the narrative that’s often put us and fuelled in the media.

I don’t think it’s unreasonable to have a better system and want to control our borders better on a whole, but this sheer anger and blame placed at the human in front of us seems very misplaced, when they were likely manipulated in to thinking they can have a better life in this particular country and not another, and the problem is way way bigger than an individual.

Asylum seekers and refugees make up less than 1% of the population of the uk.

Make plans to leave if you can. It isn't going to be pretty when people realise that Reform isn't going to fix anything for them.

The enemy of the working class is not a man on a small boat. The enemy of the working class are the 1% of billionaires who now own 43% of ALL global capital assets.

You think they aren’t paying to get across Europe? The last bit is a tiny drop in that ocean. They risk death the entire way, they risk being murdered and dumped by traffickers the whole way.
one guy I spoke to was beaten more than 5 times between Syria and the U.K. he came here as he speaks good English and is a veterinarian in Syria. He hopes to work here once he is granted leave to. People choose here for all kinds of reasons that have nothing to do with our benefits system.

https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/immigration-system-statistics-year-ending-march-2025/how-many-people-claim-asylum-in-the-uk

will the governments own statistics do then?

I think Scotland might be my (only) best hope. I’m disabled from cancer and still undergoing treatment so there’s nowhere that’s gonna take me. My kids thankfully have Irish passports. I’m making plans for them.
I hope you will be ok also.

I'm sorry to hear that. It must be scary to think about what Reform might do to the NHS. Scotland sounds like a good plan, and it's good that your kids will have options.

We will be OK too, thanks. DH and I have options, and dd will be a doctor by that time so she should also have options, hopefully. I'm worried about my elderly dad though. If he is still alive at that point, I don't think I'll be able to just abandon him.

Yes? Men left to countries like America and Ireland. In Ww2 they left to commonwealth countries not to fight.
also, you could register as a conscientious objector and be allowed to argue your case for not going to war. Around 16000 men in ww1 and 60000 in ww2 registered as such. in ww2 about 100000 went AWOL.
Some were forced to the front and if they refused to fight they were sent to prison, A few were sentenced to die, but had those sentences commuted.

In Afghanistan if you refuse to fight for the taliban, they murder your whole family, potentially your whole village. And then cut off your head.

not quite the same is it?

Also in WW2 Europeans went to Casablanca. There was a film!

• Adult Males: Roughly three-quarters (75-76%) of small boat arrivals are adult males aged 18 and over, according to GOV.UK.
• Children: Around 17%

And we've all seen pictures of the ' 16 and 17 year olds rocking up to their' kids '. accommodation...... 🤔

But I would be quite happy to keep on refuting your bogus figures.

Because some of them don’t speak English, or not well enough to understand or be understood.
is this so hard for you to understand?

I think we have slightly crossed wires, my figure was for asylum seekers overall, not those on the boats, that’s my error. However, that still means they not All young men.

I actually had to google to see if you were being sarcastic or not, as I’ve never seen that film! 😂

Yes, the equality act says that interpreters must be provided if requested for medical appointments.

He doesn't have any Welsh ancestry.

But these 1% millionaires are not living next door to people and hanging out in groups.

Furthermore, you strip all the super rich of their assets - how does that change matters? People, as a pp mentioned, are unhappy with a visual cultural change as well as knowing that the pot is being dipped in unfairly.

The people largely immigrating to this country are not scientists, engineers, interior designers (as stated on another thread!) but a poor class who need support. The ongoing financial impact would bankrupt even Elon Musk in a couple of years.

And free accommodation.

And when will it all end?
What happens when the hotels and b&b's are full and the boats keep coming?

This Country is going to buckle completely.

They would make up a lot more if you were in charge.

Setting the thread off on a completely different tangent, but I think this is really interesting. What makes somebody Welsh, or English or anything else? I was talking with my husband a few years ago about this very thing (or something very similar). We were talking about if you can be Japanese without being ethnically Japanese and if you will ever be accepted as Japanese by other Japanese people. I suspect (in the case of Japan) it partly depends on if you 'pass' and how many generations your family have been there. I have a friend who has lived in Japan for 35 years (white European). Her kids, born and raised in Japan can't get Japanese citizenship and actually had a real struggle to even stay in Japan, because of their immigration rules when they reached adulthood.
I don't think the same thing exists (certainly not to the same extent) in the UK, I think you can be 100% British without being ethnically European. If you are black or brown though, you will never 'pass' and that must be difficult at times. I remember talking to an African American (even that term, white Americans aren't called European Americans, they just get to be Americans) friend who was shocked to learn we have 2nd/3rd generation black British people. There was very much the view from her that you can't be European and black although she didn't seem to hold this view about being American and black. This conversation was about 35 years ago. I would be surprised if views haven't changed over that time, especially following the success of black British actors and sportspeople on the world stage.
This isn't to ignore the fact a 'passport of convenience' definitely exists. Look at all the people getting Irish passports for themselves after brexit, I wish I could get one myself. I remember seeing some people (immigrats to UK, not born) from India describing themselves on TV. They all said they were Indian, just passport was British.

Anyway, legally, what makes someone a national of wherever might be clearly set out. As always the notion of who is English/Welsh/ Japanese/whatever is more complex.

Many years ago I had a boyfriend who was born in England, educated in England and had lived his whole life in England. Both his parents were Welsh. He was 100% certain that he was also Welsh. "Welsh blood" was the argument.

Even in my road - and I have lived here 20 years - I am “new”. People like their tribe. And regarding racism - it’s more classism . Ds’s best friend since Reception is Muslim. His parents are middle-class professional people and we go to each other’s houses. The dw does not walk 10 paces behind her dh, have to bear 12 dcs nor do they take 1p from the public purse. Furthermore she said once that someone “well-meaning” at the school had suggested she could get to know another Muslim (fully covered) mother. Friend was aghast at the thought.

To make things even more complicated for Japan they have ethnicities within Japan (Yamoto being the dominant one) and a kind of history of not treating all of them that great. Which is ironic, because you would think in a country with only 2% foreigners there would not be that much space for discrimination/division but it seems human beings can always find a way. If it was only white people in England we would still be arguing about who was "really" English.
I think Americans are often coming from a position where, although they are very proud to be American, their "heritage" or other identity is also really important. Hence Joe Biden was "Irish". For that, you kind of need "Irish" or "European" or "British" to mean something ethnic. Since its the only way "American with European ancestry makes sense". Which is fine. But not to the extent that they override those own countries definitions of themselves (insisting black people can't be English/British because Englishness/Britishness is a heritage) I don't think your friend was doing that she just seems not to know much history. It's only a problem I guess when American views sort of swamp social media.

Immigration is very much needed.

Would you risk your life in this way? You must see that people must feel pretty desperate to do that.