Page 12 | Had you heard of Charlie Kirk before yesterday?

Bruminbrum · 11/09/2025 22:34

MasterBeth · 11/09/2025 22:29

Sure, he hated women and black people but he always kept his hair neat and tidy.

Right! White supremacy at its finest.

the man was literally ok with school shootings.

Ohdearanotherone · 11/09/2025 22:34

No i hadn’t but my teenagers had. I felt really stupid I hadn’t until I read that none of you have either!

WildJoker · 11/09/2025 22:34

l knew of him and had seen some of his stuff on line - l found his rhetoric on the whole deeply offensive - he seemed to me to be full of hate for anybody that wasn’t like him.

Underthinker · 11/09/2025 22:35

I had watched many of his short video clips that popped up on social media. In some I sided with him and in some the students he debated.

I don't doubt over his life he said a few things that qualify as genuinely awful, but I also know that in at least some of the examples cited in these threads, his words have been deliberately twisted or taken out of context to make them sound far worse than they were (because I've seen the original clips).

I am disappointed that there are people here who must be deliberately and knowingly lying to defame a recently murdered man.

ToWhitToWhoo · 11/09/2025 22:35

YelloDaisy · 11/09/2025 22:21

Perhaps if public figures are shot instead of school children they might consider changing the gun laws.

Doubt it; plenty of public figures have been shot. Trump was slightly injured, and an innocent bystander was killed in that shooting. Reagan was seriously injured but recovered. And of course several presidents and senators were assassinated, including RFK Jr's father and uncle.

Ireolu · 11/09/2025 22:35

Nope never heard of him. Heard about him here for the first time yesterday when the news broke he has been shot and then died. I'm grateful I hadn't heard about him, wouldn't have been a fan.

Fetaface · 11/09/2025 22:35

Yes I had, hated him and his misogynistic opinions.

JaneJeffer · 11/09/2025 22:35

FKAT · 11/09/2025 22:33

Yes over in Europe we never shoot people over their beliefs - we just stab MPs to death and firebomb journalist offices - so much more civilised.

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Where would you rather live?

theDudesmummy · 11/09/2025 22:35

OK sorry i think I read that wrong, you weren't disagreeing with me..

deedeemeloy · 11/09/2025 22:36

No but my 16 and 14 year old both had, and both saw the video of the murder that was shown on YouTube.
Neither of my teens agreed with his views but we’re still obviously shocked by the shooting.

NotTerfNorCis · 11/09/2025 22:36

The reality is he was good at debating

I saw a video of him 'debating' this morning and it wasn't really debating, it was talking over his opponent and constantly shutting them down. Maybe that's a kind of 'debating' if all you want is to make people think you won.

Vivi0 · 11/09/2025 22:37

Kreepture · 11/09/2025 22:20

so we can put you in the racist, misogynist, islamophobe, rape apologist, pro-israel camp along with everyone else who compares abortion to the Holocaust.

Thanks for the heads up!

Edited

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Lol - that’s a bit much.

The PP was only saying how she felt - you need to dial down the drama, honestly 😂

Rewis · 11/09/2025 22:37

ImthatBoleyngirl · 11/09/2025 22:21

I'm 46 and I've watched loads of his videos. He was an excellent debater, so calm and articulate. I disagreed with some of his opinions, such as abortion, but on the whole he made a lot of sense. I'm actually really shocked and upset!

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I have to admit that I haven't spent too much time watching his debates. But the ones I have seen, he seems to debate significantly younger people with alternative truths and nobody calls him out on those facts. He also seems to run the clock by speaking over people.

VanCleefArpels · 11/09/2025 22:38

User37482 · 11/09/2025 21:53

Yes, I didn’t agree with his views but it was a refreshing change to see someone willing to engage with people he disagreed with vs banging pans outside a debate like a giant toddler.

The reality is we have got so used to people shutting down debate rather than just having it. I saw this with women's rights issues. If you went on the BBC and you were a perfectly reasonable person (thinking people like Helen Joyce) you would still be painted as a bigot and extremist.

Our society is full of children who can’t cope with disagreement and celebrate the death of people we disagree with because we have lost all moral reason (I’m an atheist btw). Grown adults crow over murder as if it were a video game and not a human life. I thought his views on abortion were frankly dehumanising to women and girls. I think he was brilliant and exposing the shallowness of identity politics. I could hold both thoughts in my head at the same time and not be happy he died. We have become so debased as a society that people actually celebrate murder publicly with no sense of shame whatsoever.

I’ve also been thinking about how we use the word tolerance. People keep using the word inaccurately. They talk about tolerance for people they have no problem with and often agree with. We are only actually tolerant with people we disagree with, we refrain from harming them and despite the gulf of opinion Between someone like Charlie Kirk and me he demonstrated that by actually speaking to them. Often they failed to articulate their ideas well because they lived in bubbles where they never had to justify their beliefs. But we need that as a society, we need people to be able to articulate their positions and to be able to debate effectively. We rely too much on emotion and censure.

I love this. The very fact that he stood out from his peers precisely because he was prepared to debate says an awful lot about the ridiculous shouty politics that we have got used to. He reached outside his echo chamber and was prepared to back up his views with detailed arguments. We can both disagree with what he said but applaud the way he said it.

Bruminbrum · 11/09/2025 22:38

NotTerfNorCis · 11/09/2025 22:36

The reality is he was good at debating

I saw a video of him 'debating' this morning and it wasn't really debating, it was talking over his opponent and constantly shutting them down. Maybe that's a kind of 'debating' if all you want is to make people think you won.

He definitely wasn’t good at debating or generally making logical arguments, as exhibited by the Cambridge students debate. He was objectively terrible and also deeply stupid

MyrtlethePurpleTurtle · 11/09/2025 22:38

BramStoner · 11/09/2025 22:16

Good grief, this is possibly the worst thing I’ve ever read on here. Yes expressing views can have consequences but when people say that they’re not saying “fair enough if you get murdered”- they’re saying you might lose friends or a platform, not your life. Absolutely shocking,

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Don't get what's so shocking about the post you've quoted. Of course words have consequences - and we have restrictions on free speech precisely because of that

gellielli · 11/09/2025 22:39

Bloody hell, I've just seen the video and it actually hurts to think his wife and kids might have seen it happen. Wish I didn't type his name into twitter now! How on earth will they ever recover.

MoltenLasagne · 11/09/2025 22:39

User37482 · 11/09/2025 22:32

He’s am american, it’s in his constitution, it’s a completely different culture. Equally if you believe it’s ok for people to be murdered for their speech, that applies to everyone, not just people we disapprove of. I don’t agree with his beliefs, I think more people should have been able to construct reasonable arguments against his views. The reality is he was good at debating because it’s a skill the left/centre and centre right have lost the ability to debate. I’ve watched the videos of garbled arguments relying on sentimental nonsense put forward by his opponents,I’m not surprised he did as well as he did frankly.

The left is intellectually empty, no sane person would have claimed transwomen are literally women and thought they could actually supoort that position in reasoned debate for example. It’s a nonsense. We have lost reason and common sense. Instead of being mad at him for what he saod the question should be why do we not have better arguments? Why do we rely on cancellation, mockery and snideness instead of authentic good faith arguments.

The women’s rights issues of recent years demonstrate exactly this. How many feminists have been called all sorts but ultimately rational argument is winning out not “ewww what a bigot”.

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Yes, his positions are so easy to argue against, why was the ability to debate them lacking? Its because tribalism has been the norm for a few decades now and saying "no debate" and refusing to engage with viewpoints we considered bigoted is the order of the day, rather than testing our arguments against them and working out the weak points in our own and counter arguments. So many students have been taught the right thing to think and not how to think, and it has weakened us as a society.

TheSwarm · 11/09/2025 22:40

He was a deeply unpleasant man who travelled around "debating" children who were unable to deal with someone presenting high-school level arguments about women's rights, gun control and right-wing extremism with a veneer of authority and articulation. When faced with people who could see through his bullshit he always came unstuck. His arguments on gun control were fucking laughable.

Nobody deserves to be killed for that, obviously, but I'm not particually sad that there is one less person like him in the world.

NorfolkandBad · 11/09/2025 22:41

To quote a popular Twitter / X response

Tell me you've never listened to his output and are posting rubbish without using those words.

"I've never heard of him until now but he was " racist / misogynist / abhorrent views / extreme views / the usual tropes others use and I want to use to get a brownie point.

I've watched his stuff for years, I didn't always agree but he was respectful and tried to meet in the middle with opposing views. I don't recall him ever saying anything racist but then "racist" to some means "you don't agree with my views on anything", I guess I shouldn't really feed the underbridge dwellers though.

Idinnaenah · 11/09/2025 22:41

Havetoagree · 11/09/2025 21:28

Just that really? I hadn’t and wondering if I’m the only one. And why is it such a big story? I guess the association with trump. What would be the equivalent level of fame over here?

Yes, mainly because of his homophobic views.

MeTooOverHere · 11/09/2025 22:42

Havetoagree · 11/09/2025 21:28

Just that really? I hadn’t and wondering if I’m the only one. And why is it such a big story? I guess the association with trump. What would be the equivalent level of fame over here?

I'm 62. I'd heard of him of course - one of the right wing white supremacists who wants to wind back everything to the 1930's or further.
His views were broadly divisive, racist, xenophobic, and extreme.

Christian nationalist. Against the separation of church and state.
In a 2023 speech, he said that "all men are created equal in the eyes of God, all men and women, but not all cultures are created equal. To say that, you get attacked in every direction, but excuse me when I say that Western civilization is the best that humanity has produced. It’s an outgrowth of the Bible."

Anti abortion, anti birth control and pro early marriage and child bearing for women. Reckons women hit the wall at 30 although he then married a 33yo. Strongly Biblical in his views of the roles of men, women and marriage.

School shootings were just an unfortunate side effect of everyone being allowed to have guns.

Crikeyalmighty · 11/09/2025 22:42

Dreadful situation and violence and murder is never the answer ( although I might be tempted to make an exception for Putin and Netanyahu) - but it does stick in the craw with Trumps comments about ‘looney radical lefties’ - he certainly didn’t blame looney radical right wingers for the Minnesota governor and his wife - didn’t even attend the funeral - it’s always the same with him - Can you imagine Obama or Biden blaming looney radical right wingers -? You need to depoliticise atrocities

Mumtobabyhavoc · 11/09/2025 22:43

Bruminbrum · 11/09/2025 22:38

He definitely wasn’t good at debating or generally making logical arguments, as exhibited by the Cambridge students debate. He was objectively terrible and also deeply stupid

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The r

Kreepture · 11/09/2025 22:43

I don't think anyone deserves to die for having opinions.

I will neither mourn nor celebrate his death.

My only feelings on the matter are for his children who witnessed him being murdered while doing his job.

I strongly oppose just about everything he said, everything he was, and everything he stood for. But i am not happy he died.