Do people really think PIP claimants are fraudsters?!

[Greedybilly]

As someone with a chronic illness in the middle of claiming PIP I think it's important to point out it's very stressful to go through the process and actually get the benefit.
To those who were inferring it's an easy blag - I would say yes there will always be a few scammers who claim fraudulently ( though god knows how tbh?) the majority have to struggle for years/go through appeals/give up.
Just saying this for balance as I feel MN is turning slghtly into the Daily Fail.

It’s a shame your bullying and aggressive nature didn’t undergo meaningful change as well. Oh and what was it ? Oh that’s right the knuckle draggers comment that you called people, well they are the ones who actually pay for your PIP so you may like to bare that in mind. You won’t of course and i’m sure you will come back with another pointless and equally worthless aggressive stance.

For example my collegue, he is in a wheel chair because he lost a leg but he is an amazing software coder. He earns far more than most people because of his skill, which his particular disability has no bearing on. This is not that unusual. Yes he has some challenges in life but he doesn't need to government support he gets, he says so himself, but as he also says he'd be foolish to turn down the free cash. People seem to struggle with the idea that some people with disabilities are high earners.

i assume they're going down the Savant route with that.

I think we just have to accept some posters have a vary narrow view on the world and accommodate that.

They must be pretty desperate then

Not at all.. i have a relative who is a literal Genius, top 4% IQ in the country level and like your collegue, a Coding Architect. but is very badly impacted by autism, ADHD, ME/CF and a chiari malformation that means they have to work from a specially adapted bed/chair contraption at home.

It's why we keep reminding people that PIP is not an out of work benefit.

If i wasn't a carer for my disabled kids, i'd still be working and making a difference for the SEN kids in my local schools... and despite knowing i'd need to do it from a wheelchair these days, fully intend to go back to it if i ever can.

I am severely physically disabled, as mentioned in a previous post, completely blind since birth and with multiple joint deformity due to juvenile arthritis. I employ carers to help me with personal care and daily living tasks. One of the things my carers do is brush, wash and dry my hair and cut and file my nails. I cannot do these things for myself and if I were unable to employ carers to do this for me then I would have to pay a hairdresser to wash my hair and a manicurist to cut and file my nails. The only other alternatives, allowing my hair to go unwashed, uncombed and untrimmed and my fast-growing nails to grow out of control would be both extremely unsanitary and unacceptable. I consider clean and unmatted hair and clean and trimmed nails to be a fairly basic personal care need. I assume you occasionally tend to your own hair and nails and that your blanket remarks are, therefore, at best ill-considered and at worst hypocritical.
I receive PIP as well as working full time. My PIP is paid into the same account as my wages. The actual monthly costs associated with my disability exceed the amount I receive in PIP. I pay for the adaptations which I require from my bank account, these include carer support as well as adaptive equipment and technology which allows me to function day today and to remain in work.
I also go o holiday, out for meals and buy other non-essential things. Given that most of the money I receive each month comes from my wages and that I also have to use some of the money I've earned to cover disability related costs, I don't think I can be begrudged spending some of my money on 'what you might consider luxuries. I cannot guarantee if the specific £1 I use to buy a cake came from my wages or PIP as they are paid into the same account, the monthly PIP amount is not ring-fenced. Should I be prevented from spending money I earned however I want just because I also receive PIP? Would you ask non-disabled people to feel ashamed of themselves for any expenditure you may consider frivolous?

I don't agree with that. If you can't work due to disability then I agree you should get help, similarly if you don't earn enough to support yourself, but if you are a higher earner I don't think you state support.

Actually I think I have got under your skin. 😆 you don’t like your behaviour reflected back to you. Like all bullies really. But carry on it’s entertaining

I've reported this. No one should be aiming to get under someones skin in such a goady way. You claim to be a professional in this area. Please act like one.

I agree with your last sentence. People definitely do have set ideas about what it is to be disabled. Of course people with disabilities can be high earners.

I don’t think it’s correct that most disabled people have advanced skills in other(?) areas though. Being disabled means that there are far more systemic barriers, and physical ones of course, than non disabled people have to face across all different domains including in the workplace.

i think that’s an impossible ask. I can almost visualise the puffing out of the chest and the furious typing all in an effort to belittle and bully others who don’t share the same opinion.

I tried to claim PIP for my daughter when she turned 18. She has cerebral palsy and ADHD and I wanted there to be a bit of extra help for her at uni - someone to help with the domestic stuff and some cover for ubers. Her assessor didn't even touch her, let alone try to find out what she was able/unable to do with her hands, nor did they take her poor executive function skills seriously. We got knocked back and ended up having to provide the additional support ourselves. This shows that getting PIP isn't a given and the application process is not straight-forward.

On the other hand, there is quite a lot of talk about claiming PIP in a forum I am in for a medical condition that I have. Everyone always says, describe your very worst days and lay it on thick. This I do feel is slightly fraudulent because you should be describing your day to day life. But perhaps I am just envious that because I was very honest and didn't exaggerate, my daughter's claim was unsuccessful. (PS: Despite having the same condition as these PIP claimants, I do not consider myself anywhere near as disabled as my daughter and would not claim for myself).

Thank you Bumblebee. Mumsnet obviously agree on the aggressive comments

Your daughter should have received PIP. Congratulations on her getting into university. You must be really proud of her

Yep.

My son is only coming up to 10 and has only been disabled for 18 months so I obviously don't know what the future holds but so far, he doesn't have advanced skills in other areas and his barriers include missing large parts of Year 3 and only starting Year 4 for the first time after Easter. He's now in Year 5 which is the first time he's actually started the school year since Year 3 and then he was only in Year 3 from September-March.

We now have an EHCP in place with fantastic support and his school is amazing but they also aren't miracle workers. He is finding Year 5 tough so far and I struggle to see how he will ever catch up.

"I don't think nail appointments are a good use of money for anyone. I will never be convinced otherwise."

And if a person cannot cut their own nails?
The NHS doesn't provide a free nail cutting service. You have to pay someone to do it.

What is a 'higher earner'

@Kirbert2 It must be very hard. It’s reassuring that the school is amazing and there is good support in place for him. It must be so much to navigate. I hope some of the astonishing ignorance on this thread doesn’t upset you. It is very easy to for others to judge when they’ve got no skin in the game.

You’ve done amazingly well to get the EHCP. as that’s a full time job in itself. I hope this will open doors to him getting the support he needs in school so he can reach his fullest potential. All children deserve to get the education they need

There is a huge difference between the kind of personal care you are suggesting you need and the other poster that clearly stated her nail appointments were to get her nails painted at a salon. This is the problem with taking things out of context. My comment regarding nail appointments are clearly about the latter scenario but without context they can be used to make someone seem like a monster that is against disabled people recieving basic personal care which I am absolutely not.

I don't want anyone to feel ashamed of themselves. That is absolutely not my intention. I also think though there is a valid debate about what the state should and shouldn't be funding and also whether means testing is appropriate in a scenario where someone can afford lots of luxuries (I'm not necessarily saying this is you) and then also claims PIP. Are people with lots of disposable income the most obvious choice for additional state funding when there are many disabled people struggling to even survive? It isn't really disabled Vs non disabled but just a question of how do we allocate a scarce resource (public money).

There is a fine line on PIP forms between underplaying, being honest, and overplaying. It can also depend on how well you articulate how something affects you within the section that the PIP form is asking for.

You HAVE to be honest, brutally honest without prevarication and and 'weeeelll, its not THAT bad' attitude, because that isn't doing yourself (or the person you're filling it in for) any favours.

It is also always worth requesting a Mandatory Reconsideration if you're refused. And even a tribunal if you still think its wrong. One of my friends was denied and it shocked CAB so much they rang up and asked for a new form to re-apply with new information because she SHOULD have got it, and it was atrocious she didn't.

@mugglewump As for your own condition, apply if you think it will help, don't if it won't. took me about two years of getting slowly worse before i took the plunge after the costs of my disability started making it hard to get by without asking for help from relatives.

It can be hard. I sometimes dream of my old life with my then 8 year old who never got so poorly and we never experienced the trauma we did but then I also feel so grateful that he survived, even the hospital call him their miracle and it is worth this new life I'm still learning how to navigate.

It is easy for others to judge, especially since it is also easy to believe it will never happen to you or your child and it can happen just like that. I had a healthy child on a Friday and by the end of that weekend he was fighting for his life.

I never thought it would happen to my child either.