To ask...Do kids always see through Disney Dads in the end??

[AlliWantIsARoomSomewheeeere]

My recent ex, who has already missed the majority of our kids lives cos of his job, has made the not unsurprising, but disappointing decision, to permanently live 3hrs away from his kids.
He will have them every other weekend (as much as work allows) thus leaving me to do all of the actual parenting, whilst he just does fun weekends twice a month and has a much bigger budget for frivolities such as days out and holidays.
I personally cannot understand how someone can be ok with seeing so little of their kids but that i suppose is besides the point for this discussion.

I am 100% onboard with putting the kids first and not airing my frustrations when they may hear etc and I want them to have a good relationship with their dad purely for their self -esteem (daddy issues are good for no one 🫣) But equally I feel strongly that he doesn't deserve a good relationship with them due to him constantly choosing himself first.

I believe he will pay what he is supposed to pay and he will see them reasonably regularly, but he will also not think too much of cancelling on them if something he would rather do comes up and he always justifies missing time with them for work, cos well, money.

My kids are currently 6&8....those of you who have had similar scenarios, whose kids are now 18yrs+...what does it look like now?
Do they have good relationships with them or have they figured it out for themselves? If they have, how has it affected them?

I say this as someone from separated parents and who most of my friends growing up had separated parents...

You do not want your kids to "see through" their other parent, but very sadly and likely will have do at some point. You do not want your kids to have the relationship your ex does or doesn't deserve with them, but the one your kids do. And you should not hold it against your kids, even silently, if they do.

What you should hope for is that your children will have the best possible relationship with both of their parents and grow up appreciating that they have two parents, who have both supported and raised them even if just contributing in their way, and ultimately that they are loved.

In your case those Disney weekends are the love that your ex gives that you may not be able to, and the constant daily nurture is yours to give that he can't (or won't). Yours is obviously way way harder but also vastly more important, and your kids will love you more for it. But they can still love their Dad as well for his.

If you do anything I'd try to hold him to them. As sitting on the doorstep waiting for Dad can be brutally painful and that is an issue.

I think most kids see though their Disney dads eventually, especially if the dads weren’t around a great deal before the split.

In your case OP, unless your ex moves closer to you, the visits to Dad will lose their appeal when your kids go through their teens. In my experience there is literally nothing a parent can offer a 16 year old that is more fun than hanging out with their mates. They simply won’t want to travel 3 hours to sit in Dad’s house looking at their phones and hearing about the party they’re missing. Of course they’ll barely talk to you either, but you will at least be under the same roof as them, so you’ll get a daily grunt and an occasional conversation!

Thankyou Tammy ❤he is getting there. He's been keeping himself busy with meet ups with his friends & starting 6th form but he knows I am always here if he wants to talk. 'DF' thought he could use his emotional abuse tactics on a boy with ASD who was grieving a family friend at the time but these kids aren't 5 anymore and they're all a lot wiser than we sometimes give them credit for. Dad always said to me kids grow up and start seeing it for themselves. His loss as they say.

I am in a similar situation. Ex has DS (12) for part of school vacations (lives overseas). He is much wealthier, takes DS on expensive trips, skiing, French open and the like, but has never done day-to-day parenting, made him do his homework, cooked him meals, nursed him if he is poorly etc. If he visits and has DS during school term, he gets his parents to move in and help. DS loves his dad, but has realized that his dad spends money on him rather than time. I think DS also saw through him because ironically my Ex rants about me to my son, and DS is not impressed with that. It doesn't align with DS' knowledge of me, and I don't rant about Ex (I think it is ridiculous behavior, and children should be allowed to be children!). I think children know instinctively who will put them first, and who is there for them unconditionally.

We observe my BIL's family cluster fuck.
BIL was an absent parent when his kids were young, off earning money, having his independent adventures whilst SIL kept home going.
They split.
BIL had to quickly learn to parent. Dragged his mum into it. We refused to become cousin, eow childcare. My kids weren't interested in traveling hours to some grim soft play or being forced to entertain their emotionally unregulated cousins at our house. I was also not up for being used whilst BIL did hobbies with DH.
BIL shouldn't have had kids in the first place, they will always be less interesting then his travel, hobbies or work.
The kids get a double whammy because his ex has her own issues and after losing her career,being a single parent during marriage then scrambling around after is understandably but sadly vocally bitter.
MIL is also a 'favourites' kind of grand parent. So her favouring the oldest sibling and ignoring the other has split the kids bond.
Each kid just wants attention which plays out in different ways and ultimately they will have a lot to unpick later on.
The adults have all let them down and the older they get, the more unpleasant I find their company even for short bursts.

I can only suggest you live your best life, model calm and confidence and use eow to let out all the frustration and anger that comes with raising kids.

Completely agree. I barely saw the DCs all summer they were always out with their friends at someone's birthday party picnic or doing their volunteer jobs. Just as it should be. I'm normally in bed before they are! 😁

Yes in the case of mine. Got all the big stuff from their dad (games consoles, literal Disney holidays, etc). But as they got older they realised they didn’t see their dad very much and treats aside, he wasn’t actually a very nice man, very hot and cold. They are adult now, they do have a relationship with him but it’s not a deep one. They see him a couple of times a year, they do fun stuff (at his expense) but they don’t miss him in between. They basically use him (with no discouragement from me, he deserves their relationship with him to be transactional).

Can I ask though how you manage this though? Or what the expectations are?

Genuinely curious as we have a similar situation currently with DSD.

We would love to have her more often but we don't live near her friends / social life / school etc (mum moved away, not us!) so when she is due to be with us (was 2-3 nights a week, now more like 1-2 at a push) she asks if she can change dates / have a friend come over with her / go to a friends instead...

DH doesn't want to force her to come over as we know how important friendships and social life are to teens. Also inevitably her world will end if she doesn't go and hang around the local town on a Saturday! But likewise if we allowed every request then we would never see her?!

(FWIW DH definitely is not a Disney Dad but can see how from the outside it looks like that when he / we have her less and less!)

I have a psychology degree myself but most children aren’t going to look at their parents through a psychologist lens. Did you analyse your own parents in this manner when you were your children’s age?

For example I remember my dad being present and generous at birthdays. My lasting memory of that is happiness, it’s not going to be based on whether I saw him frequently in the weeks beforehand or whether he worked too much or whether my mum attended parents evening instead of him. That kind of tit for tat doesn’t really register for the average person when processing memories.

You only have to look at threads on this forum to see how many people pander to their parents including badly behaved dads, to see your answer - for most people there isn’t going to be a huge epiphany that their parents aren’t perfect, most people tolerate that. It’s not likely that your children will have some epiphany where they don’t want a relationship with their dad.

1. You don't know what kind of parent someone will be until you have kids. He was good with nieces and nephews wanted 4 kids, all about his family (supposedly) etc. the reality of it was too much like hard work for him. He wanted fantasy kids.
2. He doesn't want 50/50 and can't do 50/50 from 3hrs away, cos you know..school.
3. Easy, he can put his kids needs over his own.

You sound like you want to make me the problem, so I can only imagine you are projecting due to some personal experience.

I always put my kids needs first. This why I think he is an arse for not doing the same.

You're projecting.

I think what you do is instill good values in them, like good people keep their word and don’t cancel last minute etc and you deserve better and to be better than that. Don’t name their dad just teach this as a general rule and value.

Yes I agree. I definitely don't want them to see through it in a ways that hurts them...only as much as to expect more out of other relationships, if that makes sense.

I am very good and keeping my internal struggles to myself (many times to my own detriment) the kids are unaware of my feelings about him. I asked them what they wanted to do for Christmas and offered for daddy to stay here Christmas eve and be here for present opening, which they wanted and he agreed to. It certainly wouldn't be my first choice for myself! 🥴

Yes, that would definitely be a lot to unpack. I have seen similar play out too.

That is good advice and what I shall aim for.
I certainly intend to not do anybody my bitching in front of them.
Love your kids more than you hate your ex...so the saying goes. 🥴

My pals two have a Disney dad. One has realised what hes really like, one hasn’t seen through him yet although is mahoosively pissed off that he keeps cancelling taking her kids for the day during the holidays and shes scrabbling round for daycare at the last minute so she can work. (He has firm for cancelling if a woman is interested in him and thinks he might be in with a shout, the dc should know that by now after 30 years)

Re your Christmas plans and Disney dad staying over Christmas Eve, . I know why youve done that (3 hour commute) but it’s potentially going to cause confusion with them thinking mummy and daddy are back together. You might get more advice on here about how others navigate this difficult time.

My mum always referred to my dad as a Disney Dad, I don't agree. She chose to have an affair and to leave my dad for the OM and she chose to take him to court for custody and she won and he was given visitation once a week. Then she spent the rest of my childhood complaining that she had to do all of the hard parenting stuff while he got to do all of the "fun" stuff with me on sundays, she was always slagging him off and any time I needed new clothes/shoes or money for anything she would sneerlingly tell me to "ask old moneybags".

My dad never wanted that situation, he would have been a full-time dad if she hadn't taken me away from him. As he usually only got to see me once a week he liked to spend that time doing nice things and days out with me. Having said that he also spent a lot of time helping me with homework and school projects etc, something my mum never did.

Is it Disney when NRP does it, but if resident parent does trips/ treats alongside the daily grind its good parenting?
NRP presumably wants to spend quality time in the precious EOW scenarios, hence more 'spoiling'
I've anecdotally have seen more cases of RP playing games to make NRP look unreliable, constantly moving goalposts.
I also wonder if sex of the kids effects the outcomes. Do boys who see dad 'pushed out' become sympathetic particularly when they become fathers?

@AlliWantIsARoomSomewheeeere I am not and never have been in this situation but I sometimes feel, when reading these threads, that mums often try to protect the image of the doting dad! why? tell the kids the truth. tell them dad cheated and now has another girlfriend. tell them he doesnt want to see them on saturday because he wants to go out drinking with his mates. tell them all, warts and all. and if dad is not paying maintenance for kids, tell them, especially if dad is still working full time. dont keep all the secrets, let them find out what a shit dad he actually is.

I don’t think DH is a Disney dad but might be helpful. Him and his ex got divorced when kids where 8 and 13 , he was still very much present in the kids life with taking them to school and picking them up , had them 3 days a week etc , he did fight for them in court but in the country where they live mum almost always gets custody .
when the youngest was 12 he had to go and work abroad . So the dynamic changed a lot . In the meanwhile we got together a year after he moved abroad , kids still see him and us lots but tends to be 2 to 4 weeks in one go a few times a year instead of weekends . They are now much older 18 and 24 and they are a great relationship with DH and a big part of our life’s .
I know it’s not comparable to most dead beat dads some of you are mentioning , as DH is a brilliant dads and step dad , and his ex is actually the one that’s very narcissist ( moved them into a house with a new partner they didn’t meet before , moved them city mid year , constantly left the kids alone until midnight since they where 12 , extremely self centred etc ) , so I think the kids see him as a safe port .

When we separated (we only told the kids a month ago) we spoke about how they would still see daddy as much as they do now (he was always mon-friday as well as missing some weekends) we just wouldn't do stuff altogether anymore, but daughter (6) immediately was like "what never" 😫 to which I said occasionally for special occasions like birthdays and Christmas, but not all the time. I repeated that when I asked what they would like to do at Christmas...have some presents here and some at daddies. So hopefully they understand it's just cos Christmas is special. (But I will try to reinforce that before the big day.

It's Disney cos he has made the conscious decision on his own to move 3hrs away from his kids rendering him unable to play any part in the actual parenting that goes on day to day and only available for weekends and holidays.

Would I want to give up 50% of the time with my kids, hell no, do I still wish my kids had a dad who would want that? 100%

But equally I feel strongly that he doesn't deserve a good relationship with them due to him constantly choosing himself first.

I can see where you're coming from absolutely. It's a tough – and unfair – pill to swallow.

Ultimately, however, I don't think we should wish children negative or difficult relationships with their parents. At the end of the day, they are the ones who are ultimately going to suffer from that – for the rest of their lives.

On the other hand, you also don't want them growing up with the sense that it's OK to do this to your children.

In an ideal world they grow up worldly and sensible – having a positive relationship with the parents while also acknowledging their faults and but with the ability to be level-headed about them. Alas, I think that's rare with the child/parent relationships, and more often than not it's simply just very painful wounds that can never really heal.

Which is the worse?

This is the struggle. I want to protect them without protecting him.
Where is the line?
I certainly won't lie to them ever, but I won't air my grievances with him in front of them either. They deserve to judge him on their own experience with him...I just don't want them to have low standards for future relationships.

Eldest has a type of distant relative vibe with him last saw him about a year ago possibly longer. Younger one basically not interested tells people he doesn’t have a dad saw him over two years ago and has no interest in a relationship with him in the future.
Their father or deadbeat might text the eldest now and again. When eldest would go and see him she inevitably would call me come get me I’m bored he has left me in the house.
my children learnt when young he would let them down not show up etc. Always would have others around never did one in one with them they learnt they weren’t his priority.

I protected my kids from knowing what a selfish git their father could be. There was no way I was going to cause them that hurt and that feeling of rejection when they were too young to handle it. They came to their own conclusions in their own time and I stand by me not making him out to be the bad guy when they were too young to process that. As adults they still have a relationship with him but it’s on their terms now.

They get their standards from me. They see their dad as the role model of how not to do things.