To be worried about emigration

[YourOpenNavyAnt]

Our neighbours, 2 highly skilled Indian immigrants, who have been in the UK for 8 years are emigrating to another country. He’ll get an 50% pay increase for doing the same job in another country, plus a lower housing costs. According to him, a sizeable cohort of his friends, also want to leave the UK.

I have two cousins who have spent £10000s for their children to study for a masters in another country to make it easier for them gain the right to work.

A colleague’s children (both junior doctors) have both migrated to Australia, with no plans to return. Another colleague’s daughter (a dentist) has moved to New Zealand for 6 months, to determine if she wants to settle permanently.

I have a large circle Aussie friends and acquaintances from my time living in London and most (8-10 people) have either returned or are planning to return. These are people who’ve lived here for 10+ years and have British citizenship but they view the UK as being in terminal decline.

Has anyone else noticed this trend? Is this country really that shit?

I never thought I'd say this about England, but since Brexshit, I'd leave if I could. The Conservatives screwed the country up, climate change pushing prices up, Farage pushing division and racism, the economy in decline, effects of Ukraine etc

It will take a long while to recover, if it ever does.

No, I don’t know anyone who’s left but I agree that the UK is probably in terminal decline.

Yes. I agree with you. I was thinking of returning from Australia as most of my family is in the UK but not any more. It seems to be an unhappy place now.

I think the rot accelerated after Brexit, which I always felt was a big mistake . It’s sad to see. Before Brexit there was a nice Cool Britannia vibe going on.

It’s not perfect here in Australia either but there’s less anger and polarisation in general even though we are nearly all immigrant stock here.

We are quickly heading towards where the US is today. There’s a loud minority who want no immigration (legal or not ) because they think that’s why things are shit for them today. Who wants to live in a country where they feel unsafe and unwelcome? Asylum hotels today can progress quickly into other risks tomorrow.

The only thing that’s in terminal decline is people’s inability to understand economics.

For the last few decades, financial crash of 2008 aside, people think they are entitled (literally, entitled) to inexorable house price growth, low goods prices, low interest rates and borrowing costs, and “graduate” wages.

It doesn’t matter if previous generations try and tell them about 12% interest rates on mortgages, or about winter of discontent, everyone wants to look clever on their house purchase and drive new cars.

The UK hasn’t “gone to shit” just because times are getting tougher for a short while.

(written by a woman in her 40s before anyone starts.)

I don't think it's anything to worry about, after recessions comes growth and change which is a good thing of you can ride the storm.

It's only natural that economic migrants will move on pretty quickly to the best place to gain income during harder times, that's pretty obvious. There are a lot of Indians and Brits heading towards the middle east, that's been happening for the past few years but accelerating now.

However there are lots of people coming to work in the UK at least in both in mine and my husbands industries.

What is worrying you regarding people choosing to emigrate?

The UK needs a shake up in general, too many people are dormant, I would like to see less reliance on stealing talent from across the world, for both the UK and the countries people are leaving - it's not a strategy any country should use in my opinion. However, perhaps we are about to find out what it's like to be one of the countries talented people were heading here from.

Not surprised. The Tories wanted a histile environment and that"s what we have.

Well the discourse even on a mostly leftie site like MN is that immigrants are taking the job from some one else so...
Also the public has conflated all immigrants into one big lump. Skilled immigrants are the same as asylum seekers.
We don't have enough taxpayers as it is.

Eh? Labour have had a year to reduce the hostility but aren't most saying it's increased over this period.

My son emigrated to Australia 8 years ago, and as far as I can tell has no intention of returning and tbh I don’t blame him. He’s earning far more than he ever could here. A few of his friends have also followed suit.
The UK is not all bad but I do think there are too many entitled people who expect something for nothing and that’s what pisses people off, hence why professionals emigrate that and their earning potential is far greater. Tbh if I could I’d jump ship too.

This. I feel we’re trapped here, no realistic way out

I’d encourage anyone young and upwardly mobile to get out. Young people at my firm are asking for transfers overseas all the time. May still go for it myself.

Yes I think people are glossing over that.

yanbu op I’m glad we have options for dc

It’s not entirely friendly towards none British born at the moment, is it?
I’m not English, nor is DP so we have 2nd passports and options to live in Europe/North America/ Oz. It’s always a consideration even though I’ve been here 30 years and DP 20 years, professionals with British born kids.
were white though, so that deffo helps us on the ‘ go back to where you came from’ front from randoms.

We will definitely be encouraging our children to use their freedom to work and study abroad when they’re older.

Labour Governments ALWAYS crash the economy. Every single one.

The tax burden is way too high and is stifling growth but they are politically incapable of cutting spending (or even slowing the rate of increase). I will be preparing DS for a move abroad. No point in working hard here for the Government to confiscate everything.

Yes my dh encourages his junior docs to emigrate. He’s an immigrant himself and feels increasingly unwelcome and uncomfortable here now. I’m getting my Irish passport and then one for my ds. This Country is fast losing the plot.

I think that's fair. I'm Irish, and grew up in the severe recession of the 80s and early 90s. Almost one fifth of the country's workforce was unemployed. Virtually my entire cohort emigrated straight from school or university, having all spent the summers working abroad from as early as we were able to get a sense of the lie of the land. I've lived longterm in five countries. Obviously things changed, and Ireland became a far more prosperous place, began to attract international immigration, and some of us returned (though DH, UK-born DS and I finally left the UK after many years because it became, in the immediate aftermath of Brexit, a suddenly more unpleasant place to be Irish, so your highly skilled Indian neighbours may not only have economic motives for leaving...)

What I'm saying is that England in particular is unused to seeing significant outward migration of its own citizens. You'll get used to it. It's just a part in a cycle. Times will get better again.

It wasn’t Labournwhoncrashed the economy though, was it? It was the fuckwit Tories. Along with Brexit.

Good for you. Getting your DC an Irish passport means giving them the option to be in Europe for education and work. Also makes it pretty easy to go to Canada and Australia

Debt is rising that’s the problem for Labour, and the rest of us.

I think strictly speaking the tories make sure to hand over the reins only when things have already gone wrong

and I suspect that people from many minorities are feeling threatened by the far right wing which doesn’t tend to include that many labour supporters

people have always moved around and global circumstances are pretty “interesting “ now - look to France as an example close to home

I think the biggest issue is the cycle of negativity that’s being perpetuated by the media. Everything is doom and gloom. The entire narrative is that the economy is shit, COL is shit, benefit users are shit, asylum seekers are shit, the nhs is shit, the education system is shit, MH has gone to shit etc etc.
I really don’t think everything is as bad as the media would have us believe.

Part of the problem is the Tories vs Labour war. Once people start thinking and leaving old cliches behind. The situation will be less toxic but I do not see it happening. Reform is making sure they take advantage of it.

Yet when Liz Truss dramatically reduced tax the economy crashed and she was forced to resign after only a few weeks. Even traders didn’t think it was a good idea.

I agree with the other posters that the financial instability accelerated after Brexit and is difficult for any government to manage but the voters who chose Brexit all knew best didn’t they?