To beg you for your advice on this

[Dailyncwympo]

I’ve name changed for this but am a regular poster (screaming at the Sistine, snapped and farted, cancel the cheque etc).

I’m at my wits end and need some kind of advice. My DD is 10 and has literally no friends, in school or out. She is desperately lonely and neither she nor I can figure out how she’s ended up being so universally unliked, if not disliked.

We think she’s ND (AuDHD) and are waiting on an assessment, same goes for me, so there might be something we’re missing. But:

• she’s clever, fun and funny
• she’s active and up for trying new things
• she’s never (that I’ve seen or heard — and I have asked school etc) cruel, mean or spiteful

Possible issues (my best guesses)

• she can be clingy — she longs for the fabled BEST FRIEND FOREVER
• she finds it tricky to understand/adapt when plans change
• shes quite precocious in some ways (very high reading age, wide vocabulary, can be a know it all/a bit ‘teach-y”)

She manages much better in adult company than with kids but she’s 10 and is gutted at having no friends.

I’ve tried arranging play dates but they always dwindle after one or two. We’ve joined clubs but they’ve never led to any real friendships just more of the same.

She’s had literally no play dates over the summer, and my messages about play dates to a couple of the mums of friendlier schoolmates have been ignored — to the point where I’m wondering if it’s me who’s the issue as much as her.

Not to drip feed but she goes to an expensive private school because her dad (who I’m not with) is loaded — I’m very clearly not loaded and stand out as such at the school gates.

Can anyone help? I’m open to any advice as I’m desperate for my genuinely lovely (flawed as we all are but very kind-hearted) girl to finally build some friendships.

My heart is broken for her, as her whole life has been like this, and I feel like I’ve completely failed her. She is desperately lonely 💔

Thank you for reading and for any advice x

I feel sad for you because it's clear you're caring and bothered, and really want her to be happy. So I'm saying this gently, you need to try and work on the know-it-all 'teachy' bit. I'd bet my mortgage on it being that. Kids just don't like this when they're trying to be social and play. I have NO idea of the best way to encourage your Daughter to not do this but I'm sure someone will be along soon with good advice.

If you don't feel that you aren't accepted my the other school parents (and I'm sure there'll be some who wouldn't give a stuff about your own financial status) then focus more on it of school clubs. Brownies? Gymnastics?

@FarmGirl78 Thank you for the reply — and for being gentle; I’m genuinely open to all input, including constructive criticism x

Definitely working on the know it all thing — I think it’s a combination of her wanting to share things she thinks are cool/interesting and feeling like she has to know things to be liked/valued. She can get stuck on transmit mode — I think I can be a bit the same, although I’ve tried hard to not be over the years.

I’m trying to get through to her that it’s ok not to know things, and that we have two ears and one mouth for a reason. The issue is that she gets so excited to have a friend (even for a moment) that she forgets and just blurts again.

The school is the kind where parents do drop-offs in Bentleys and Rolls Royces, and kids get the piss taken if you’re not in designer gear. Tried to move her but dad blocked it, so we’re stuck for one last year.

On the waiting list for local guides troop but yes, will go back and have another look for local clubs. There has to be something!

How big is her school? How much diversity does it have? Private school is great for all manner of things, but small class sizes means fewer potential friends. And if it's populated by a homogeneous sea of neurotypical middle class horse mad girls in ribbons (I know I'm stereotypeing massively here to make a point) there's fewer people interested in someone different. Maybe it's not the right place for her?
Have you spoken with her teachers/pastoral about her difficulties. Do they have an opinion? Or suggestions? What are they actively doing to promote friendships and social skills both in class time and breaktimes?

If her dad is loaded, would his money be put to better use in her trying different clubs where she might meet her tribe. Or even seeing a child psychotherapist who could help her with living with her autism/adhd

Aw, I could have written the exact same post as you have done at the same age, right down to the clingy, better with adult, "teach-y" bits. My daughter is dyspraxic and autistic. I'm assuming your daughter is just about to head into Year 6? We were overseas at the time and my daughter was very badly bullied by some of the kids because she was "different".

You are doing all the right things though so don't have a lot of advice, Brownies / Scouts might be a good shout if you have a troupe near you. As has also been posted, do try to explain about other kids not liking a know-it-all. It's hard, my daughter couldn't really understand as she thought she was being helpful, but did kind of come across as a know-it-all. The problem was, her school made it worse as they used to put her with the lesser abled kids to help them, so she kind of assumed the teacher position the rest of the time too!

The reason I posted though really was to say there is light at the end of the tunnel. It all changed when she went to high school, here in the UK and there were more / different children to get to know. She had different "besties" on and off, but one stuck like a cat hair in your sandwich and now, at 17, even though they took different college paths and live an hour and a half away from each other, are thick as thieves and as totally batty as each other. Neither of them really have other close friends, both have other people that they occasionally spend time with, but nothing like what they have with each other. It warms my heart to see. They are definitely BFF's!! Tell your daughter that the very bestest friends are worth waiting for!

Playdates are more likely when the mums are friends, especially if they involve sitting together having a coffee in a cafe whilst the children play. Try and get chatting with the other parents at the school gate/ club.

We don't do playdates so I wouldn't get hung up on that - my children have had no playdates all summer either.

In school do they say she has no friends? Is there no lunch clubs or activities that she can be directed to? In my children's (state) primary they do a lunch club that is generally for children that can find break times tricky (so often those with trouble socialising for whatever reason) these children do then generally play together if not at the club despite being across different age groups.

Play dates over the summer at an expensive school like that are unlikely as most will spend the whole summer away at holiday homes etc. My DCs were at much less swanky privates and we found this a lot.

What are your DDs real interests? If you can find niche clubs to match those, she is more likely to meet people like her, which might give her a better chance of meeting new friends eg chess, computer coding, science, art etc.

Sounds like she's the wrong type of person for that school and its a shame your ex didn't listen. Changing school can make a HUGE difference.

I'd be researching secondary schools very carefully! Expensive doesn't necessarily mean good.

For now I'd be pushing the school to help. Tell them she has been there X years and not made a single friend and you'd like them to help.

Have you tried connecting her with fellow ND kids? There are loads of groups/clubs if you search online.

I think she is in the wrong school, but appreciate your partner is paying so it's not so easy to move. Plus you would be moving in Y6 and no guarantee that any friends made at the next school would go to same secondary.

I would concentrate on finding interests outside of school and maybe not necessarily aimed at her age group. She may get on better if the age group was older. Less likely to feel the need to be teachy, maybe.

My DS was similar in that he had hardly any friends in real life and whilst on-line gaming is generally slated on here, it actually worked quite well for him as he was able to cope with on-line friendships far better than face to face.
But you need to be vigilant, of course.

I agree with this.

Have you tried clubs related to her interests?

She’ll find fellow minded spirits there who will also likely to want to share their knowledge at great length and so she can start up conversations on common ground.

I get it because my ds (now 21!) is autistic and he could discuss aeronautical stuff or the history of trains forever but general conversation like the weather genuinely confuse him and he looks like a rabbit in the headlights - and then tries to change the conversation back (read starts lecturing people!) on his chosen topic.

I w tried everything to indicate how it can drive people to distraction but he won’t change because his mind isn’t wired like that. I’ve tried to teach him about allowing others 30 seconds silence to speak instead. (Before he goes back to imparting his knowledge 🤦🏼‍♀️😂)

Also take her places on trips related to her interests. If she loves animals go to zoos and wildlife parks as she’s more likely to find children in the play park and area itself who she has common ground with. It won’t lead to play dates but it’ll help her develop her social skills.

Bug yes I would seriously look at whether a private school with small class sizes and less pooL of people is the best option for her if she struggles socially.

My da definitely has found it easier as he’s got older and he’s found his tribe now. Small group of lads but they are extremely tight.

Have you watched ‘love on the spectrum’? There are young adults on there who are coached by a lady and by their own family on the ‘blurting’. Tanner in particular. The coach explains to him that he has to ask a question, then listen to the response and then think of something to say about that response because that’s how you get to know someone and if you don’t get to know them you can’t make friends with them. Before the coaching he was just schooling them on things he wanted to say or educate them about.

Thank you so much for all your replies so far — I was feeling so hopeless and alone, and this has really helped.

I think I’m at a point where I’m realising that DD is “more” ND than I’d realised — probably because most of her behaviours are quite similar to my own (particularly at that age) and/or because they seem ‘normal’ to me.

I will definitely take on the advice given and look at the resources you’ve shared — thank you so much x

Bless you it’s hard seeming them struggle.
how about groups for like minded kids? You say she’s techy so a computer games type group maybe?
a reading club?
expand on her interests, and bring social etiquette into normal conversations, for example if she’s chatting about tech and it gets boring, you could say, that was interesting but can we chat about xyz as I don’t find tech as interesting as you.

my son (20) is a dr who fanatic and would totally take over the conversation, so I’ll answer a few questions then I’ll say that’s enough dr who for me today.

encourage her to be confident, above all xx

Really feel for you both. It's such a hard thing to go through. Try get her into girl guides, the new term should be starting up soon, email them now and ask is there any space that you think your DD would really benefit from the group. It seems to be a great space for kids who are a little bit different (my DD included).
It's so awful that the other mums don't even reply to you.
I'd also be onto the school, mention that your DD is struggling and isn't making friends. Ask them what you should do and how they can help.

My DD was like this. It gets easier as they grow up and are able to have friendships with adults.

As a teen she was into sports and became friends with coaches and other adults who were involved. Top year of primary was probably the worst 😕

This gives me hope — thank you ❤️ So gorgeous to hear your DD found her BFF and other friends x

I’ll give this a watch — thank you!

Keep inviting the friendly kids and as suggested invite the mum in for a coffee and a chat at drop off and/or pick up. Or arrange a few mums and kids meet up, bowling maybe? Where the mums have a bit of a laugh too. My DD went to a private school not hugely posh, but some mums were loaded! But mainly nice when you got to know them (with the notable exception of one who definitely thought talking to riff raff like me beneath her, but that's another story). You find you all have the same (school related) problems, homework, friendships, teachers, exams, etc to talk about, which leads to other things.

What about Woodcraft?
https://woodcraft.org.uk/
There was an article in the Guardian about how Jeremy Corbyn and Sophie Ellis Bexter were both members growing up. It is older than Cubs and Brownies. It is co ed. It is wholesome and friendly. They are often short of leaders. I became one for a while when my children were small. I worked ( teacher full time) but I felt it was important to support something so worthwhile. Look it up.

I have the same age asd dd. She sometimes struggles with friendships, but for different reasons to your dd. The school doesn’t sound like the right fit for your dd, which Im sure is part of the problem. One of the reasons people opt for private school is to be socially exclusive and it sounds like you might be coming up against this attitude.
You need to find other autistic girls - it can feel like you are alone but you’re not! The play dates my dd has had this holiday have been with nd girls. One from her class and one from an outside interest. There are places like the autistic girls network which run groups that might help her and you find people.

Goodness I read your post and could have pretty much said the same about my DS who is almost 10 (he isn’t what I would describe as precocious although he’s a smart kid and I think others can find him too much because he’s a bit more mature than them). We’ve pretty much given up on school friends. It’s really hard to see them being left out and wanting to fit in but for some reason you can’t put your finger on, they’re excluded and just don’t fit in.

Fortunately for us, he plays a sport at an elite level and we’ve focussed on friends there. We now have a little social life with them as a family, meet in the club house for a drink and the kids can all play. It ‘fills his cup’ and we have a fun time too. He fits in, he’s loved by them for who he is and they don’t want him to change, and the best bit is he likes them too and feels like they’re his friends. I’m dreading his return to school next week where he’s going to be feeling left out and lonely again. I’d like to move schools but he is refusing and I feel like he’s at an age where if I just did it without any further warning, he’d resent me for it and it wouldn’t go well.

Sorry not really any advice but needed to comment to let you know you’re not alone!

Thank you so much for sharing about your lovely boy — wishing you all so much happiness x

This

I've found areas a bit hit or miss. Usually these groups are set up by parents because there's none available. It's always worth trying to find out.