To beg you for your advice on this

[Dailyncwympo]

I’ve name changed for this but am a regular poster (screaming at the Sistine, snapped and farted, cancel the cheque etc).

I’m at my wits end and need some kind of advice. My DD is 10 and has literally no friends, in school or out. She is desperately lonely and neither she nor I can figure out how she’s ended up being so universally unliked, if not disliked.

We think she’s ND (AuDHD) and are waiting on an assessment, same goes for me, so there might be something we’re missing. But:

• she’s clever, fun and funny
• she’s active and up for trying new things
• she’s never (that I’ve seen or heard — and I have asked school etc) cruel, mean or spiteful

Possible issues (my best guesses)

• she can be clingy — she longs for the fabled BEST FRIEND FOREVER
• she finds it tricky to understand/adapt when plans change
• shes quite precocious in some ways (very high reading age, wide vocabulary, can be a know it all/a bit ‘teach-y”)

She manages much better in adult company than with kids but she’s 10 and is gutted at having no friends.

I’ve tried arranging play dates but they always dwindle after one or two. We’ve joined clubs but they’ve never led to any real friendships just more of the same.

She’s had literally no play dates over the summer, and my messages about play dates to a couple of the mums of friendlier schoolmates have been ignored — to the point where I’m wondering if it’s me who’s the issue as much as her.

Not to drip feed but she goes to an expensive private school because her dad (who I’m not with) is loaded — I’m very clearly not loaded and stand out as such at the school gates.

Can anyone help? I’m open to any advice as I’m desperate for my genuinely lovely (flawed as we all are but very kind-hearted) girl to finally build some friendships.

My heart is broken for her, as her whole life has been like this, and I feel like I’ve completely failed her. She is desperately lonely 💔

Thank you for reading and for any advice x

What about groups like Girl Guides? Local churches often run youth groups aswell, id hope she would receive a warm welcome there.

On the waiting list for the local troupe — church groups could be a good shout too, although we’re not Goddy — I wonder if that would be an issue?

Unfortunately dad is a dipstick who’s not been allowed to see DD since last year, and who blocked a school move despite agreeing to it in court.

I need to sort finance stuff, as he’s currently paying a princely £22 a week for DD, but I’m tangled up in the child contact stuff atm x

Sorry to hear this OP and totally understand why you are feeling so desperate. Lots of great advice so far and I'm sure there will be more.

My kids do / have done quite a variety of clubs and activities and the ones that tend to have a higher proportion of kids that might be described as 'different' or 'geeky' (including my own) are definitely guiding, which I know you've already had recommended, and musical instruments. So taking up an instrument might be something to look at, with a view to joining a band or orchestra.

All the best to you both.

What are your DD's interests @Dailyncwympo?

It wouldn't be an issue where im from, you could always ask first for peace of mind but I really dont think it would mean she couldn't go x

Usually quite solitary ones, unfortunately!

She has singing lessons, which she enjoys, but doesn’t want to join a choir, singing group or band.

She loves art, reading, creative writing. She did martial arts, which she’s considering getting back into.

She has real exec function issues and won’t/cant self-motivate to do things at home, so tries to spend a lot of her time watching Netflix or playing Roblox. Obviously I’ve put strict limits on these but the desire for them has dulled the appeal of other activities, unfortunately, and she’s a tendency to mope saying she’s bored or has nothing to do.

Active, fun clubs would definitely be a big help, I think x

My dd is the same but seems unbothered by the lack of friends. My ds is the teachy one but has lots.
I picked high school carefully as hers ( state mainstream) has a nice place to go at lunch and break time with sofas, TAs games etc.
She also does lots of clubs, things like ballet, musical theatre and guides. At guides she has a group she hangs with though rarely speaks to them. They accept her and seem to like her.
I take comfort in the fact that life does not push us to spend time with people our own age the way school does. My dd also gets on well with adults so I hope adult life will be easier.

I had the same situation with my DD and know how heartbreaking it is to see. We desperately wanted her to move schools but didnt want to force it on her either but by the time she got part way through year 6 she'd had enough and asked us if she could change schools as she hadn't had a single friend for a couple of years and the school did nothing to support her in making any, they just made things worse if anything. We moved her to a primary school where the majority of pupils go to a different high school to the one she'd just left, it wasn't the best education wise (not the worse either) but the staff were fantastic and their policies on creating an inclusive environment were great and as "the new girl" she made lots of friends very quickly which in turn made the transition to high school much easier than it would have been if she stayed where she was and now in high school she has even more friends as she is starting to find "her kind". Maybe worth pushing with your ex to move her, it's not him that has to go school for 6 hours a day with no friends to interact with.

But surely at 11 they're beyond that?

Good luck to you and your daughter OP

I'm reading through The Unwritten Rules of Friendship which includes a chapter on The Little Adult (know-it-all types; I recognised myself immediately hah) It's an old book but has practical suggestions like encouraging your child to fit in and speak to peers as a friend and not in an overly formal/preachy way etc

Life will get easier for her when she's older and can find a niche - DnD gaming type things are understood to be popular with autistic people but may be tricky finding a group where children are welcome.

Worth having a prod online for safer places she might interact with others who share her interests.

Other people have said Guiding - this has the advantage that once she's been a Guide for a bit she'd be able to go and help with Rainbows or Brownies and get to be the expert.

Rugby can be good for ND kids and in my experience clubs are stuffed full of friendly, lovely, often somewhat socially awkward people. I wish I’d found it when I was a child.

Agree with others that the school ‘pool’ of possible friends is going to be smaller than at a mainstream state school - so other activities and clubs may be the best option. Have seen your daughter is waiting for Guides already. How about a drama class or group? Youth groups linked to church? Music and or singing clubs? Dance classes? Sport?
Also agree that if your daughter tends to try and lead a lot of the time, this is likely to also be a factor so talking about that and helping her to learn to follow a bit more will certainly help. Good luck.

Maybe. But if the parents have each other's phone numbers and addresses, it helps.

Oh my heart goes out to you, OP. Mine is now 14 - she has ADHD and the doctor thinks possibly autistic traits as well. She's always been outgoing and would make friends in parks, anywhere. All through school the feedback from her teachers was that she was a lovely, bubbly friendly girl who was interested in all sorts of things, but while she did have friends she also was bullied a lot. It was heartbreaking and they didn't seem to be able to deal with it. One thing they did tell us was that she wasn't great at picking up social cues, would tend to talk AT people and didn't get it when others in her class were basically telling her to go away.
Eventually she moved primary school after we moved house, and as the new girl she did make lots of friends. But it was only a couple of months before lockdown , so even when lockdown was lifted we didn't know anyone for playdates over summer. While she did have a group of friends that she moved to grammar school with, she's since drifted away from them but the good thing is that she has really found her tribe. She's into anime, gaming and art and has found a group of like-minded friends, some of whom are in older years at school. As we speak I am listening to some very silly, giggly phone conversations while they all play Roblox together. They're all spread over a large area, so she doesn't have many friends nearby, but she does have one friend that she knows from Guides and now hangs out with at youth club. Because they're so spread out she has had a lot of screen time this summer but at least they are all socialising together - it's good to hear her so happy. I've noticed that a lot of her friends are neurodivergent and they all interact in quite similar ways and are much more accepting of each others' quirks. So you may find that when she's in a bigger school with a wider range of personalities she will find her people. I would say try to encourage her to have a go at lots of activities at school - not only will it help her find her passions but she will meet a wide pool of potential friends. Do you have any neurodiversity groups or hubs in the area? We have an ADHD cafe which I found helpful as I also have ADHD - it was someone there who pointed out to me that ADHD people tend to be drawn to each other and it really is true.

Hello Op - I started to suggest she’s learning resilience, will be able to navigate relationships as she grows and exploring her independence. But then I remembered, it sucks to be lonely when you’re 10.

Is the school girls only? I wonder if she has much exposure to a mixed environment? I also wondered about the range of hobbies as well and if it’s worth considering any where she isn’t the expert (or where there’s no expert)? I wondered if 1:1 play dates are intense - is there a way to host a small group?

Has she been to any holiday clubs in the school holidays? Appreciate that’ll only be every now and then but could help with meeting a friend and then you keep the friendship going during term time?

Lots of great advice.
Have you thought of online chess, and looking for a club?
It attracts bright quirky children who tend to be competitive but very nice.

Try your local scouts.

Try a musical theatre group.

There is this false idea that every child just instinctively knows how to make friends. This is not so, particularly when a child is NDI'm a former teacher and I have seen this. I've of my friends was a special educational needs teacher. She would on occasion work with children who sound like your daughter.
You could spend time with your daughter chatting about the children she lives and explicitly ask about what she likes about then/ didn't like about them. I would also explore what she thinks it is about some children who are popular that makes them so. Also worth pointing out that not every popular child is actually well liked/ kind/ clever etc. But everyone had a Best Friend but it is natural that she might like one. would obviously not do as if this at once, I would also not make it a high pressure "session " Quite informal whilst you two are doing something enjoyable together. But I would be honest and say that you know this makes her sad, and that makes you sad because your love her and would like to help.
BUT. Given her father is minted I would ask him to stump up for an appropriatekyv qualified person to help your wonderful child. It can be easy to inadvertently make things worse and what I have suggested may not work with your daughter -these are suggestions only, I am not qualified to work in this area.
Best wishes to both of you

I came to suggest this.

My DS managed to make friends superficially early on because he was cheeky in a cute way and happy to get involved in nonsense, but as he got older the teacher-y stuff came to the ‘main stage’ and friends dwindled.

He has some very good friends who are autistic like him (similar profile to your daughter it sounds like) and they basically love to lecture to each other.

Does the teacher have any suggestions of who might be a good match friendship-wise in her year group?

Agree - DS has discovered D&D at his specialist senior school - it’s the most popular club by far.