Drag - Fun or Fundamentally Insulting

[hellosumner]

Triggered by the strictly line up thread I wonder how people feel about drag.

YABU - Drag Queens are incredibly witty and talented and they are not insulting women by dressing as an exaggerated version of the female sex. It’s funny and clever.

YANBU - Drag is woman face and any other type of comedy based upon stereotyping a group in an exaggerated manner would be seen as unacceptable.

Well, I think I can guess how you feel about them by your loaded way of asking the question.
"Incredibly witty, talented, clever"
and "drag is woman face (usually only said on here by far gone FWR regulars <ducks> ) 😁
I suppose it's been a while since the last "drag is laughing at me" thread and it's drag queens turn again to be demonised.

Drag is a spectrum. At one end we have panto dames alongside women playing princes etc, and at the other we have men sharing a sexualised and disgusting personal fantasy. Unfortunately, the trans movement has made this end harder to criticize, and it appears to have grown larger and bolder as a consequence.

Personally, I draw the line closer to the panto dames end, although I did enjoy a performance by the Trocaderos and applaud the all male swan lake. But drag queens in schools - just no.

Blackface is white nen doing a parody of black men and drag is men doing a (often nasty) parody of women.

Perpetuating these nasty representations of ‘women’ is not going to decrease violence against women it advance our equality and might well contribute to the levels of misogyny in society. If you our women up as a figure to mock and denigrate, that is not good for women.

Added to that, actually quite a few children had no choice in being made to sit in front of drag performers with their schtick reading stories that teach kids if you don’t like the stereotypes for your sex, you might actually be the opposite sex. In some cases parents were not even informed. I hope those schools have regained their marbles and recovered from this sanity free period and realised that is utterly horrendous behaviour now.

So a man dressed in an often quite ugly version of woman face effectively tells little girls that if they don’t like the aspects of being a woman he presents to them, they might really be a boy.

Some drag queen names

Tiffaney Wells
Ginger Minj
Cheryl Hole
Wilma Fingerdoo
Isaborne alady
Karen from Finance

yes, just misogyny.

The vote ratio says different

Sorry but - Wilma Fingerdoo 😂

Don't forget the kids performers
Aida H Dee
Flowjob
Anna Bortion

and…

Malestia Child.

https://bergbristol.wordpress.com/2022/05/24/drag-queen-story-hour-for-children-coming-to-a-library-near-you-unless-we-can-stop-it/

Too many people have completely lost their minds and all sense of what is appropriate for children.

I don't mind the panto Dame, it's silly and inoffensive and traditional. I generally don't like drag acts and I do find them a bit offensive but don't tend to let them bother me, each to their own. All that said I think drag queens and their fans are generally a bit thick, their jokes not that funny and aimed at people with low intellect who laugh at crude humour.

I love drag and I love drag queens. As a student I worked bar jobs in Manchester's gay village in the 90s. The queens looked after me and all the other young people (many of us young women) as we finished shifts in the early hours. They were amazing and were far more effective than door staff or management in caring for staff.

Yes, that's definitely clouded my judgement and I'm conscious that things may be somewhat different now. I still go to the gay village, but rarely at night anymore. Anyway I love drag acts and find most funny, sexy and stylish - albeit with a very exaggerated look. The ones that I feel demean women are, in my experience at least, few and far between. Most just love an excuse to look fabulous, be incredibly camp, lipsync to Girls Aloud and make some adult jokes. It's not meant to be high-brow entertainment; it's very much rooted in the same history and comedy of music hall and working men's clubs and as such it's mass market, mass appeal stuff - albeit within its own niche.

Wow that is awful!

Anna Bortion

At a children’s reading session wth

Can't see where it says Anna Bortion was at a children's reading session, where did you get that from?

I know Aida H Dee read stories, but can't find anywhere that an Anna Bortion did?

sorry it was Flowjob.

"For example The SNP MP Mhairi Black “accompanied Nathan Mullen, a
drag queen who performs under the name ‘FlowJob’, to Glencoats primary school” to read to children."

Some of them are insulting, others are just stupid and rather boring.

I know quite a lot of Drag Queens … at least one already mentioned on the thread, a couple from Drag Race, a a few who are less famous but working in London / Manchester / Birmingham.

Not one of them hates women, or is remotely misogynistic. I read more (internal) misogyny on MN most days. I feel much safer around them, than around most heterosexual men.

I agree some acts aren’t suitable for children … but that goes for all comedy. Comedians know the audience .. I’m sure if Ricky Gervais was at a local primary school he wouldn’t be doing any of hilarious “disabled children” jokes, or Jimmy Carr and his “rape jokes”

But a drag queen’s appearance and name are a big part of their act. Even if they’re reading a kids’ book ( and the kind of ‘gender-affirming’ books read at some of these events is a discussion in itself), they’re still sitting with a class full of kids with large fake breasts and exaggerated make-up, and the kids know they’re called Flowjob or Cheryl Hole or whatever.

Has that actually happened ? Is there some footage of a Drag Queens dressed inappropriately, making smutty jokes ? The ones I have seen are dressed very much in the “Dame” tradition

I can see why people find it problematic and I think it seems rather dated. I don’t get offended by much so I wouldn’t want it banned and I don’t get upset by it. I have always thought it wasn’t for me.

I'm not offended by them, and unlike much of Mumsnet, I do like a good drag queen, but I agree that it's a bit dated now, and could probably do with consigning to the history books. It is a little offensive to women. And no woman I know acts - or dresses like most drag queens! 😆

Ooooh @BundleBoogie what did you post? Must have had a link that's not allowed, as it was taken down so quickly!

I struggle to see why woman face and blackface aren’t the same, but I honestly wouldn’t have too much issue with either provided it’s not done from a place of malice… except I get that blackface is universally accepted as bad, and so assume I’m the uneducated one there, but then that brings me back to not understanding why womanface is then celebrated pop culture.

I think drag queens and their fans are generally a bit thick, their jokes not that funny and aimed at people with low intellect who laugh at crude humour.

You got me! 😂 I'm not thick, with 'low intellect' but I do like the odd bit of crude humour!

My notifications said I was quoted so I looked but it had gone 😕
Must have been an automatically link hide as you say, especially with it saying hidden instead of breaks talk guidelines.
Also can't see the mods being that on it with it being a Sunday bank holiday, probably out in the garden with a glass of wine somewhere 🤣

I’m not sure if it goes as deep as offending women. But on the whole, I find the whole drag movement just seedy and unfunny.