To ground dd(13) all summer?

[becausesam]

Dd(13) hasn’t had her finest week. To be fair to her, she’s polite and helpful at home, doing well at school and has never been in trouble before.

-She lied about where she was and who she was with ( or at least plans changed and she didn’t tell us) which meant meeting up with older kids.

-Dh was supposed to pick her up and she wasn’t there or answering her phone because it was dead, it took her 20 minutes to to contact us on her friends phone then another 20 minutes to actually turn up.

-She’s supposed to hand her phone in at night which she has been doing but found out she’s been using her sisters old phone instead to message through the night.

-she then last night climbed out of her bedroom window to meet her friend at our gate which we saw on our security camera. It looked like something was handed over during their short talk which she has denied.

Dh thinks she’s broken all trust and she should be grounded for the rest of the summer.
he has an older dd (my dsd) who had several traumatic experiences as a teen and so as a result tends to be overprotective and easily panicked.

I think 13 is a really important age for friendships, gaining responsibilities and pushing boundaries. If she’s isolated from her friends all summer its going to leave her out of the loop by the time school starts, lonely and depressed.

I also think if we ground her all summer when she eventually is allowed back out she’s going to be just be more sneaky and less likely to talk to us if she thinks we're likely to overreact.

Who is unreasonable? Him for wanting to ground her all summer or me for not? What would you do?

I’d just have a strict curfew and make sure there is some kind of tracker on the phone and tell her that there will be big trouble if she’s not in when she’s supposed to be or not where she is supposed to be ie different town etc . I’d also make it very clear that forays out of windows will mean grounding during the day .

Is she Y8 or Y9?

DD is 12 (Y7 going into Y8) and I would be apoplectic with rage but also beside myself with worry if this were her. I don’t think a full on summer grounding would help but there must be some consequences for her actions and most importantly, you have to get to the root of her motivation. Why is she sneaking out, why has she adopted an old phone behind your back?

If it were my DD I would take her on a dog walk, the two of us (this possibly isn’t relevant to you but anything that’s routine & relaxed works) and be completely open. Highlight the dangers of her actions and why you’re so upset and let her talk to you. Have the conversation about why being truthful is so important in a family unit and why you need to know where she is so that you can keep her safe. Share an element of your history if relevant - I know I wasn’t perfect growing up and it can be helpful for mother/daughter relationships to discuss history and experiences.

We haven’t gotten into the world of phones yet but I would absolutely be ridding the house of any old handsets so this can’t be repeated (was her older sister complicit?) and enforcing a daily phone check.

As you say, it’s important she has time with friends over the long summer, but equally important she has family time and that your channels of communication are open. If something was passed between her and this person then this won’t be the last you’ll see of this behaviour and the more open you can be, the more chances you have of nipping it in the bud.

I really hope things improve, it sounds extremely stressful.

I'd be worried about county lines from what you're saying.

I wouldn't ground, I don't think, but have you anyone you could send her to that she'd love and will get her out of the area for up to the rest of the holiday. A good break away.

I'd ask my mum if she could take her, if it was one of mine. Several counties away and a totally different group. My dc would think they were having a treat too, which would help.

I'd get her a new phone with a new number, and restrict who is on the phone address book.
You can also get apps where you can view anything they send/receive. I don't like doing that in a lot of ways, but there's something going on here and you need to be aware.

I wouldn't ground her. I would talk to her and attempt to make her see how not telling you what she is doing causes a lot of worry. Having said that, it depends on what she was actually doing and where she was. How old were the other kids she ended up with? When you tried to contact her she did get back in 20 minutes, which isn't the end of the world. My kids used to do similar, a lot of the time they couldn't hear their phones, or it was in a bag somewhere (at the skate park etc.) I'm not sure being with some different friends to the ones she set out with at 13 is that big a deal - I didn't really tell my mum where I was even going in the first place, though I appreciate it's a different time.
The climbing out of the window thing warrants a chat. Especially if you're definitely sure she handed something over.

She’s usually well behaved so grounding is over the top. I think talking with her when out for a drive or in a cafe would be helpful. Grounding is so depressing and bad for mental health. I would track on phone and ask her to check in with a text every so often as plans do change

I'd be really worried about 1) older friends and 2) a possible hand over of something illicit in that she didn't want to tell you. Sit her down and talk to her about grooming and drugs, County lines etc etc.

Grounding for the whole summer is extreme and one of two things will happen.

You will uphold the grounding and she will go into September feeling resentful, isolated and determined to be more sneaky next time.

You will fail to uphold and your threats will be meaningless.

Far better to impose a realistic sanction but have a proper talk about WHY you are so disappointed. WHY you need to know where she is and WHY curfews matter. DD is 20 now, but i recall having this sort of conversation with her and explaining that the sooner me and her dad know there is a problem, the more likely we are to solve it for you. Whether that means you are in trouble/out of your depth/lost/drunk/scared or worse - if we are lax with curfews, we won't realise until much later that something is wrong. Once she really understood the reasoning, she became so much better at communicating and following rules.

I would also say now is a good time to introduce a safe word. If she calls and says 'did you remember to feed the neighbour's rabbit?" you know she needs collecting. We also did this on a no questions asked basis.

Show her that you recognise she is going to want more freedom, but with freedom comes responsibility and a bit of caution.

For now though, rather than ground her, find my phone on as a default, final warning before a week's grounding which kicks in if anything else happens and at least one other friend's number every time she goes out in a group. My caveat to this would be that you need to talk to her about drugs/country lines and ask again what she was handing over. If you definitely saw something, she needs to tell you what it was in order for you to trust her.

You need to get DH on board though. You can't be pulling in different directions.

I dont think this is about punishment or grounding so much as changing some rules, expectations and boundaries due to safeguarding. She cant manage the amount of freedom and phone use she has, she doesnt know how to manage online safely by the sounds of it (ie hooking up with older teens and meeting a friend to collect 'something'),

Therefore its about supervision, monitoring, withdrawal of the privilege of particular types of devises until she is able to demosntrate better decision making skills. Its about protection rather than punishment. Who is persuading her of all of this anyway?

The bit that is most concerning is (1) older kids and (2) climbing out of the window.
the phone going dead and plans changing could be a one-off unlucky.
Myself I would take her phone for the week, and make her do family stuff (I guess grounding). Then she earns it back. Tracker on phone when it’s given back, no phones in bedroom (daytime or at night - shd can use it downstairs).

You won't be able to ground someone who climbs out of windows.

Secret phones, handing over packages, meeting up with older children, climbing out of windows it’s screams county lines!!!!!
Have you got relatives who live elsewhere that she can go and stay with?

Surely missing something she was looking forward to will make her think twice about her actions in future. Going by your way you might as well tell her she’s grounded for a week but don’t worry we will still let you do the fun stuff you planned. I’m with your DH, with your attitude to it she will walk all over you

Too harsh. She will hate you forever.

I'm sorry I'm erring on your DH s side. Maybe her friendship loop is what she needs to be out of. Either she's being influenced in which case the more space the better OR she is the bad influence in which case your doing the other parents a favour and showing her your not a push over. She's not keeping to agreements she is just saying enough until she gets a workaround or enough time for her mum to push dad into caving in.

My Mum didn't believe in grounding and neither do I. She would prefer to let me go out and know about it than have me try to sneak out. If you do ground her she is just going to sneak out and you won't know where or with whom she is. There has to be a better punishment that doesn't isolate her from her friends which will just cause more problems for you. A temporary ban on tech at home. No snacks or treat foods. No pocket money.

Agree

This x

I read to 4th bullet point thinking you are being unreasonable to ground all summer.
I think I would prefer to increase restrictions on phones, remove devices and have a good talk rather than go to the extreme.

The part about sneaking out at night and handing over something is really worrying though. I’d still rather monitor devices and remove internet from a certain time. She sounds addicted to it and not able to regulate - very normal btw.

Can you find something else for her to occupy her summer OP? So she doesn’t realise?

One thing I would add would be childlocks or alarms on windows. At 13, they don’t get the risks of going out without parents knowing.

All summer? Much too harsh.
sit down with her and draw up a list of rules and consequences.

I think it's relatively unreasonable to expect a running commentary of where she is and who she's with. That's the conversation for after she's home - 'met so and so and we did x and then met y and z and did a different thing' when you're comparing your days.

If she wants to send a running commentary because she's unsure of the situation she's in and wants advice / reassurance, that's different.

Inconveniencing someone who is coming to collect you is rude and it'd be just as rude for an adult. So teach back up options - battery packs / how to use a public payphone / carrying a spare Nokia brick or other phone with v long battery life.

It being the summer holidays and her being 13 and not much younger maybe time to let her have her own phone overnight and see how her sleep is affected. Aim is her understanding that sleep is important and the internet can wait overnight rather than external rules she's finding workarounds for.

Why did they feel the need to meet in secret at the gate? It's bizarre and makes them look guilty of something. Is the friend in difficulties at home and unable to visit at a more sociable hour? Make home a safe place for her to talk about what's going on.

If she is involved in county lines this is serious it is highly dangerous for both her and the entire family and the OP needs to make sure ASAP that this isn't what's going on. If it is, they need to contact police and children's services because this won't just go away.

I think it’s definitely too harsh. I would impose an earlier curfew for a week and if she sticks to it release it the week after BUT if she doesn’t stick to it, it gets an hour earlier.

That way she is getting a punishment but it’s in her then to do the right thing.

Explain the dangers of not knowing where she is. If something was to happen to her you need to know who she was with. It sounds awful but I’d scare her. She could be raped, kidnapped or worse. Let her know that no matter what happens she can tell you and call you and you will be there no questions no anger. If she doesn’t feel she can you rely on you she will hide more things.

Trust has been broken and I would be worried but I would not ground all summer. A week grounded then stricter boundaries to build up trust, such as not allowed out as late or as long or as far away as usual until trust built up again. Regular check ins by text or phone call etc.

It seems very harsh to ground a child (who in her own eyes is well on the way to adulthood) for 6 weeks when she is usually well behaved. It seems like an overly unfair punishment which will lead to her being more secretive, more likely to sneak out, and unable to feel she can come to you with issues. The loss of her friendship group - which will happen if she misses a whole summer with them - will have a knock-on effect at school. The only thing you said in your OP that concerned me tbh was the 'handing over of something' which does need some resolution but if you ground her for 6 weeks she is never going to tell you what it was.