How can I not get angry at my child?

[Helpeith]

Please help me I want to get better for next academic year so looking for advice now. When I’m helping my daughter with her homework and explain anything she gets wrong she just screams at me “YES I know”, when she clearly doesn’t as she gets it wrong and then calmly ask her to explain to me if she understands and she isn’t able to. She will be in year 6 and teacher has expressed concern with her maths and she’s slightly below where she should be, school has given me homework to do especially for her to get her to the level she needs.

I don’t want to be rude but I often find mumsnet threads derail from any off hand single comment the OP makes - I’m really appreciate of responses i will get but can i please get advice on how to deal with the “arrogance” rather than any underlying issues which I know and school know so no need to go into depth. Basically I need help in how not to get frustrated with her screaming she knows when she clearly doesn’t. She’s really lovely in school but with me she’s quite arrogant. Not just in learning but household stuff she tells me I’m doing it wrong (I think she gets from MIL, as mil takes delight in telling me I’m wrong)

im really scared of responses I will get , I genuinely want advice on how to deal with the “YES I KNow” and she put her fingers in her ears and stops me from explaining to her. She does this to my husband too but he just walks off and says he doesn’t have time for this. He’s a secondary school economics teacher btw and his maths knowledge is far superior to mine. I’m not claiming to be an expert but she does t even let me finish my sentence before she starts screaming and ignoring me,

I don't know if this is the right question to ask - you want advice on how to feel less angry about her response but it's quite an annoying/frustrating response, isn't it? So it's quite natural to feel frustrated about it.

I think you are looking more for advice on how to respond? Or how to manage the entire interaction before it gets to the point of her screaming? Or how to support her with maths homework in general?

Sometimes children respond better to a neutral/non-parent teaching them - would it help to look into summer maths tutoring maybe?

Changing the way you view her response will help you stay calmer. It's not arrogance. She knows that she is finding it hard and she can't cope with the feeling that she can't do it, so she fights back to avoid having to face the feeling. It's a much more common response than you might think but it's really unhelpful for her because it prevents her from being able to learn. She needs a lot of confidence building in school. If she consistently isn't able do the work that is coming home giving her more is just going to switch her off rather than encourage her. Have you spoken to the teacher to discuss how she responds at home?

@BertieBotts thank you. I don’t know what I’m looking for tbh I’m just really fed up. I’m sat here in a different room crying as I got quite wound up by her. I know I’m an awful person. I shouted and screamed at her and just stormed out. I feel so guilty. My little one got scared (he’s 3). I’m just so frustrated by her. I want to be calm but not sure how to

@Lostthefairytale thank you

it makes sense. U think I’ll go bs k in her room and apologise to her and try again calmly or just take them for a walk maybe

How does the conversation go before the “yes I know”- are you saying “that’s wrong”?

Also try to keep her away from your mother in law, and you need to try to stand up to your MIL’s dissing behaviour towards you. Your DH’s response of ‘walking away’ is not helping either, leaving you as the default parent.

Firstly, I would be asking her if she wants help with her homework. I don’t know if you’re doing this, but looking over someone’s shoulder and correcting mistakes that you have noticed is going to put them on the defensive straight away.

Secondly, if she says she’s struggling and does ask for your input then I would try getting her to talk you through her process and explain to you what she has to do. Sometimes this slowing down and looking through the steps more methodically can help people see their own errors.

If she really can’t do it then you could offer to explain it. If she doesn’t want you to explain then suggest that she writes a note in her book to the teacher saying she didn’t understand it and would like them to go over it with her again in school.

Don't fret xx It's really hard to help kids with homework when it's such an emotionally charged area for them and then for us the worry about them not doing well feeds into it as well.

I get into these patterns with my 6yo - we both have ADHD which doesn't help.

For now I think go in with the aim of changing the scene completely to something which is easier for you both, like going for a walk. If she spontaneously wants to work on the maths then great - but putting a pause on things before it gets heated would be a good idea. I find the tricky thing at least for me is spotting the signs that things are going to explode before they do.

Kindly - maybe you're not the best person to help her?
I have seen this with my DD and her Dad. He's a qualified teacher (but doesn't teach) and one of the gentlest and kindest of men. He tried to help DD with school work and it was a disaster. I have never seen them less able to communicate!
I agree with the other poster - her reaction is from shame and anger. You reacting back to that is really unhelpful for you both.
Perhaps you need to work on your general communication skills with her - especially if she is a bit spiky.
Maybe step back and let her do the work and then explain it to you and where she's struggling let her unpick why. Don't step in and explain it all. Maybe suggest at the point she's stuck a way around it but essentially give her the tools to work it out for herself. Use comparisons rather than the solution to the answer in front of you.
Or. Find other resources for helping her - online maths/clubs/tutoring

It sounds like she isn’t able to accept help from you. Can you find a nice 15 year old babysitter who can work with her whilst you’re out of the house?

do you talk about the ‘yes I know’ fingers in ears before starting?

do you need to take it back a level even further to easier stuff to help build her confidence?

My son was very difficult to manage with this. I tried marking his homework, and just underlining the questions he got wrong. Then I’d hand it back to him and ask him to give those another go. He couldn’t then say that he knew it already, or get annoyed at me explaining. Just had another go at it.

Sometimes he’d fix his mistake and I’d ask him to show me how he did it, so he was explaining to me instead of me talking at him.

If he couldn’t fix it, that’s when he’d have to say “I don’t know” and I’d explain it to him. But you have to manage how the conversation goes and plan in advance so tell her that this is how you’ll do it from now on; explain that after her second attempt, she needs to listen to you and cannot shout in your face or stick her fingers in her ears. It takes some time and patience, and you do need to practice the conversation a couple of times. But my son did come around to it, the fact that he couldn’t do it a second time meant he couldn’t sit there shouting that he knew.

Make the settings before she starts work right too. Have a snack, be calm, maybe have something nice lined up for when you finish, etc. so you create a good learning environment from the start.

I teach maths and have had the same reaction from my own kids when trying to help them. They’d never behave like that at school. So, first of all, the reason she does it with you is because she can, you are her safe space, so in a weird way it’s a compliment! I find I can manage these situations best by just staying completely calm and not reacting. If she starts shouting just go quiet and wait. Be ready to help when she needs it, but just back off and sit silently as soon as she has a go at you. It’s hard to do but I’ve got better with practice. If she escalates things then calmly walk away, reassuring her you’ll be back to help when she wants you. The key thing is that you don’t escalate things. Also don’t react to her shouting, or even acknowledge it, ie don’t say stop shouting at me, don’t tell her to calm down etc. Some schools of thought would suggest you say things like “I can see you’re feeling frustrated”, etc, which may be worth a try, but with my kids that tends to make things worse so I stick with completely ignoring them having a go at me.

Yes, you are ‘mis-diagnosing’ her responses to you. They are not arrogance; they are frustration and embarrassment.

You need to change your approach to helping her with the work. Make it more collegiate - ‘let’s see if we can work this out together!’ - rather than you telling her she’s got it wrong and this is how to do it.

It’s really tough, but your approach and tone will make all the difference to her.

I agree with the idea to leave the homework to her and give her the choice about whether she wants help/feedback or not and then respect this.

I also agree she might need more work at the sort of "previous level" - if she's struggling in maths generally, more of what she's struggling with is likely to feel hard, confusing and make her feel stupid and like she can't do it.

So it might be that extra homework at that level is less helpful - it might help her more to strengthen the foundations/previous "level" of maths so that she can more confidently work at this level. And it might feel more accessible to her to practice these skills in some kind of game format rather than as a worksheet which feels like school maths, where she's already got this negative association.

Thank you all. Really lovely advice. I shouldn’t be shouting back and screaming. I feel awful

Some schools of thought would suggest you say things like “I can see you’re feeling frustrated”, etc, which may be worth a try, but with my kids that tends to make things worse
@ThreePointOneFourOneFiveNine thank goodness it’s not only my daughter who finds this very patronising and immediately ups the rage if I try this.

She's not arrogate she is frustrated and probably embarrassed. I can understand it must be difficult (and very annoying) when she responds like that but try not to respond by further putting her on the spot. I would say something more like "Great you understand but shall we go through it again just to make sure it's really sunk in" Or "Ok that's great but this part is really tricky so let's just run through it again". Essentially you 'go along' with the idea that she understands whilst still trying to explain it to her. That might make it easier for her to accept the explanations and she might feel less self conscious and embarrassed.

Yeah, you really can’t. If she still does it when you’ve given her chances to correct her own work but she can’t then you need to just walk away. You cannot shout.

Go back and have a chat when she has stopped her nonsense. We all know it’s nonsense but they don’t, and they won’t listen when in that state nor will they listen if you shout. Just walk away. Talk it out later, talk about her behaviour as well as the maths without the work in front of you; just a general chat about how this can’t keep going. Then get the maths, ask her to try it again, or try it with you so you do a line each of the problem and see if that helps.

Is a tutor an option?
If you find yourself becoming stressed i.e shouting back at her, put the homework away and come back to it later when both in the right frame of mind. Its not going anywhere - its okay to come back to it. :)

As well as all the helpful advice above, I'd have a conversation about it at a separate time when you're both calm. You could ask her about her response, ask if she wants help from you, if she'd rather have some independent help eg tutor.
If she does want you to help, agree expectations.

But agree with others, could well be that she's upset and defensive about finding it hard, so maybe do some easier things that build her confidence. But also I think it's common for kids to react in a more annoying way with family, and it's frustrating to be met with that reaction when you're just trying to help.

This is what I was going to say. Take the focus off of it being her that doesn’t understand it and shift it more to “this is really hard, lets just go over it again”, or “I’m glad you understand this, I’m not sure I fully get it so lets just go over it together one more time etc”.

Firstly, it isn't arrogance. She struggles and her brain goes into defense mode, hence the attack of shouting/fingers in ears. It's her panicking that she doesn't think she can do it. Your, as her safe person, unfortunately get it all aimed at you which is so hard. Looking into the lizard brain research that children go in to when they feel under threat may help you understand and be able to regulate yourself, as your daughter's brain. Isn't developed enough yet to manage it. She literally can't.
My top tip would be to excuse yourself and go to the bathroom, I wring a towel, I do box breathing (Google it) and I swing my arms as much as possible. Because your reaction is your body going into that fight/flight mode too. The difference is our brains as adults are developed. I would also say that when your daughter is calm that you show her different regulating techniques (box breathing, blow out the candles, press ups on the wall, wringing the towel, etc and see what works for her).
Your husband needs to step up. I'm a secondary teacher abd it is waaaaay harder teaching your own kids than at work. But he can't just walk away and not parent. That is down right rude, uncaring and selfish of him to both you and your daughter. He can't opt out of parenting, especially when he is more professionally able to support your daughter.
A tutor/third party can definitely be useful, but expensive. Some apps are educational but fun. My son is very behind at school, much younger. He has to play the educational apps for XX amount of time every day. Non negotiatable. Then he gets a reward, so star, screen time, activity, whatever gets him!
It is hard supporting your child at home as they know how best to push our buttons. I find it extremely hard with my 6 year old (adhd, single mum, dad only does the fun stuff). But don't give up as what you put in place now will massively help you in secondary.
Also, get some key sentences/phrases to say. Mine are: let's do this together, we are a team let's tackle this as a team, oooo this is tricky but I know you can do this, i see you are frustrated and that is understandable, let's have a wiggle break (silly dancing together, put a song on, gets the body back to being relaxed and having fun, resets the whole mood).
I think you're amazing for reaching out for advice and putting yourself in the firing line when it sounds like you are dealing with it on your own and you haven't given up! So give yourself a break, you obvious care about your daughter but can see that you need to tackle it differently- sign of a good mum right there!

Her behaviour is triggering for you and it’s good that you want to address it because shouting and screaming at her is going to affect her confidence, damage your relationship and also model more of the behaviour you don’t want to see.

it sounds like her response of “YES I KNOW” is more of a defence mechanism linked to feeling shame/insecurity about struggling. She’s going to be more emotional when doing homework with you because you’re her mum so she won’t be holding her feelings in as well as she tried to at school. Would a tutor be possible to support her instead of you? It might be better for everyone.

in response to you shouting screaming and storming out on her I really think you need to own that and apologise to her. She will feel shitty enough about struggling with the maths without thinking that frustration somehow makes her an unlovable kid. Go tell her you’re so sorry for shouting, it wasn’t fair on her and you’re going to work really hard not to do that anymore. Reassure her that you and her can work together to get a plan to help with homework that is less stressful for everyone. Give her a big hug and tell her she’s a good kid, with so many talents and you love her. You’re teaching her here that everyone makes mistakes, nobody is perfect but you don’t have to be as long as you do your best and try to make things right.

then apologise to your 3 year old, say you’re sorry mummy shouted and scared you. Give them a big hug and tell them you love them too.

then make yourself a cup of tea, you’re finding this hard because you’re holding so much on your own. Get support from elsewhere if your husband won’t step up. Work on your emotional regulation, it is doable it just takes practice. Sending support because I know how guilty it makes you feel to shout at your kids, and it’s a sign that you need to look after yourself. Know that you are a good mum that’s why you want to change.

My daughter has a hard time with maths and I’ve been helping her. It did not go well at the start but it’s improved.

what helped us was to structure it. We sit down once a week when my son is at football for max 30 minutes. Making sure we wouldn’t have distractions was really helpful. I’ve asked the teacher to provide additional worksheets and we work through them. At the start we would work through the previous week’s worksheets but now we are caught up. If she’s struggling it might be necessary to step back a level or a chapter or something like that.

but honestly it sounds like a neutral person might be more helpful. A tutor or a different family member or someone who isn’t you. She obviously feels safe and secure with you which is why she’s putting everything on you, but that’s not necessarily a framework for a teacher/student relationship. I could never ever let my parents help me with anything - I’d have rather failed my classes.

you also have a husband problem but you know that already.