Working expectations for parents on UC

[BlackCatGreyWhiskers]

AIBU to find this really frustrating? Basically there is no expectation for parents to work until their child is age 3. So if a family has more than one child that could be several years.

Whereas maternity leave is only 9-12months.

Especially as universal credit claimants can actually get help towards childcare expenses.

I don’t understand why there is a mismatch between the employed and unemployed?

When I went back after maternity, my pay was around £1500 and my childcare £800, then after I went back with my second my childcare went up to £1200. So I earnt next to nothing for 5 years before the eldest started school.

This is a thread about parents not working until their child is three because they get UC.

The really bad part is that it does a huge disservice to these people, as the prolonged period out of work is very damaging to their skills and employment prospects. That's before you consider that it creates an expectation gap, where people get used to having that amount if time with their children, funded. It means when they do come to consider work, it does not seem "worth it" because the incremental money earned might only be a couple of hundred pounds a month for 30 or 40 hours less every week with your children. This has the effect of disincentivising work long term, which traps people in poverty.

It's a benefits bashing thread.

If you already have a career a gap is bad; if you don't then it can be more difficult to get in to work as low paid jobs don't pay enough to cover the costs. Sending you child to nursery at 3 and starting part time is more realistic.

I used to have similar views to what you do OP as me and my DP have a child and whilst we both work and receive a little UC as we are low earners, i still went back to work after maternity leave and we struggled with childcare etc until my DD went to school.
Then there was my friend, she had her DC and was on UC for 3 years. Her bills were paid and she had money left over each month, she got childcare vouchers when her DC turned 2 and sent them to a lovely nursery as she had the time to drive the extra distance to this nursery compared to the local one i had no choice in using. She took her DC on lovely days out while everyone else worked and ill admit i was jealous.
But the thing is she couldn't go back to her original job as the shift patterns were all over the place & she couldn't find a suitable job around childcare. She had 0 support as she has no family and DC's dad didn't stick around.

So essentially she brought up her DC on her own and gave them an amazing early childhood, her alternative would have been to find a minimum wage job, pay most of those wages to childcare, increase her stress by working and being a single parent with no chance of rest bite.

I genuinely can't blame her for claiming the UC and not getting a job for 3 years when she was entitled to it can you?

I don’t understand this argument. The point is that for me to go back for work the net gain for the household, which includes both parents, was £700 pcm and then reduced to £300 pcm. How we apportion our finances makes no difference. The only difference was whether or not my children went to childcare or not.

On UC your household expenses are covered too. So what’s your point, yes my husband also contributes to the household. But however you apportion income the consequences to the household remains the same.

Why are you better off not working?

in this wages-minus childcare equation have you considered:

pension contributions
long term benefits of staying in work- from annual increments to promotions.
death benefits, sick pay, maternity pay.
other benefits - like work discounts, car lease schemes, salary sacrifice for childcare.

when you look at a snapshot it may seem like you’re better off, but 5 years down the line when your child goes to school, you will be far, far better off than had you stopped work.

when I put in funding for a new member of staff their take home is no where near the full cost of salary+ pensions + benefits.

I have nothing against benefit claimants. I think the system is wrong though, as does OP and many others. Are we not allowed to discuss that?

So you only value people who are economically productive?

No, but it feels like working and building a career is increasingly pointless in the UK, particularly if you have children.

@spoonbillstretford It’s not up to employers to pay for children! Do you want every business in the country to go bankrupt! Just become a country with the state operating everything and no companies making money at all? The issue is probably that the op works in a low paid job or part time. It’s not economic to have 2 in childcare. Only £1200? In London it’s £2000 a month for one. All decisions to continue working are based on economics. It’s better for some to see working as a loss leader so future earnings improve a lot. Or don’t have 2 dc. Get back quicker. UC limits parents but they haven’t had great careers they wish to keep.

Exactly. There's many flaws in the system but it's not my first complaint. It's not going to be cost effective to have 2 small children in child. There's lots of factors...

@Username0900 i don’t begrudge claimants but think the system is inherently flawed.

@Thelnebriati I haven’t said that. Is your contribution to this thread just to fabricate opinions of mine.

I get your point though op. It's the inconsistency.

Why has age 3 been the determined as the age a child can reach before a parent on UC must seek work?

Why doesn't the same criteria apply when judging what is the reasonable age a previously employed parent must return to work after maternity leave?

It should be consistent at what age of child it is considered reasonable that the parent should return to work, regardless of their employment status before having a child.

I am not low paid, I was PT. But if I worked more, my childcare costs would have also risen proportionately so the point remains.

You’re incorrect in your net gain calculation.

you haven’t included pension contributions. Sick pay, maternity pay, salary sacrifice, life insurance (aka death in service)

it may not be money in your hand, but if you were to pay all those things yourself it would add up. Life and critical care can be £100 a month, pensions £600, and if you went sick and couldn’t look after your child then what?

add in the decrease in real terms to your salary if you do go back to work. You’ll be nowhere near the salary you’d be on had you stayed, so that adds up to a pretty big financial loss.

Childcare is not the only difference.

Because UC claimants don't have to look for work for 3 years?

Dramatic much.

@FortheloveofCheesus thank you for understanding 👏🏻 exactly that! What’s good for one should be good for the other!

@ChristOlive they always call it “benefit bashing” so no, I don’t think we’re allowed to discuss this topic 🙄

That makes no sense. They 100% should be made to look for work and shouldn’t have access to free childcare if they don’t work.

if I didn’t have my own home, I would consider UC!! Meanwhile I’m here saving for maternity leave and childcare and mortgage payments when I’m not earning during maternity leave like a fool

This is just one of the many reasons.

Why do the right wing have such a begrudging mentality of race to the bottom? It is in everyone's interests for children to have the best upbringing possible as there will be less crime and miserable.

Maybe sit for a minute and think about what you want your life to be. Is your sole purpose on this earth to be economically productive?

I also don’t see the point of constantly kicking others into the ground at the slightest hint that they may have something you don’t have.

If you are not happy with your circumstances you can do something to change them without making others including small children worse off.

Tbh I’m pro of the one system that supports a parent being able to sah with their child unlike everything else that wants parents back to work as soon as possible . Uc is for lower earners they are not living the high life
id be interested to know your family income if bet you have a better standard of living than those on UC so not sure why you feel so strongly

Quit your job and rely on the state then.