Say it with me...

[TesChique]

School. Is. Not. There. To. Be. Free. Childcare.

All this talk of bringing the school summer holidays down to four weeks is boiling me as not one argument is child education centred. Instead its all focussed on making parents lives easier

It is six weeks for more complex reasons than "oh its from when we had farms and we dont have farms now lol oh also itd help me"

I now have a 7 year old home all day in the rain due to cancelled camp. We are both working a full day from home. The reality is to enable us to do that he will be watching more TV than I would like. And we are lucky that we are WFH, I don’t know what we’d do if we weren’t. Take emergency leave probably.

The current situation is unfair on working parents.

So parents, higher taxes, shorter school hols and tired kids, or status quo and better and cheaper holiday clubs?

In fairness who do you think is going to subsidise cheaper holiday clubs? It all comes out of taxes.

Exactly. Very short sighted. And it will result in a drastic increase in kids being taken out of school for term time holidays. It's not going to work. However childcare during holidays really is a pain though so something should be done to incentivise more clubs and better options.

Switzerland also has 5 to 6 weeks in summer (there are regional differences. Some only have 4. And it seems to work for them... And 10 weeks in the Italian parts).

Also 2 - 3 weeks in autumn, 1 - 2 weeks over Christmas, 1 - 2 in February ("sport holiday" aka for winter sports), and 1 - 2 weeks over Easter.

SEND children don't just encompass ASD children; they also cover all of those who cannot cope well with school mentally and who thrive in the summer, away from that place. Why do we advocate for one group. but not the other?

I 100% agree with this. I suspect that there will always be some "losers" and some "winners". Some pupils and parents would benefit if the summer holidays were shorter. and Some would benefit if they were longer..

13 years old in Ireland currently have 3 months off in the summer! 3 months for parents to worry about screen time & what the hell their 13 year old might be getting up to while they are at work. They need to be in school.

No one ever mentions how busy schools are during the holidays. Every summer, the contractors move into our school and large sections of the building are no-go, even for teachers. There is a total lack of appreciation that schools are working hard to bring 1960s buildings built for 600 pupils, up to 21st century standards for 1300 pupils, on a shoestring budget. Opening schools in the precious six week period is an utter no-no.

Why is it up to schools to think about time off work for child care?
Why are people not lobbying to improve employment law and parental leave rights?
Stop complaining about schools!

Teachers are not childminders. Teaching is an exhausting job and if you don’t want exhausted teachers, they need a break.
I think holiday clubs might be the answer for some parents.

No chance of this happening, unions are too strong [thank goidbess]. Let's face it kids don't do much in the last week in summer or day before every half term - concentrate on that first!

My parents used to send me to summer camps... Some were simply "day camps" and some were sleepaway camps.

As a parent don’t you take into account before you have a child the school holidays? It’s not like it’s a surprise is it?

What about the employees that don’t have children? Are they expected to constantly pick up the slack. We constantly see threads about people feeling parents already get too much. And other threads about how grandparents shouldn’t be expected to provide childcare.

Yes, teaching is an intense job, but so are lots of jobs - nursery worker, nurse, police etc. All of these people could equally benefit from downtime. Why do we give it to one sector so much?

Ask a teacher?
My take would be that it takes two weeks to let go and sleep properly, 2 weeks for actual holiday and 2 weeks to get ready for the next term, sorting work schemes, classrooms, books, paperwork….

And to manage that for 6 weeks/two months ok, 3 months is too long.

As I’ve said before, I have no skin in this game. I love the school holidays but dont require any after school care. Only an older teenager left there now. But, looking at the teachers attitudes on here is why they will remain a poorly paid job. To be well paid they’d need to change from being union driven blue collar workers that want to work to rule. Can’t move with the times and meet the needs of their users and want long holidays. As a previous poster said, schools not taxing for children apart from possibly the very young. Kids would benefit from shorter holidays and better wrap around care where it’s needed. I like most of the teachers my kids have had and think most do a decent job. I’d pay more for them if they were able to actually meet the societal needs better. They provide childcare for a majority of the time whether they like it or not. It may as well reflect societal needs. And that’s the last I’ll say. Can’t keep repeating it. Repeat after me. School. Is. Childcare too.

Teaching is an exhausting job

I agree. But so is nursing. Child minding. Or how about first responders? There are a lot of exhausting jobs. And they might find longer holidays beneficial as well.

Edit: Singling teachers out as being especially deserving (or in a particular need of longer breaks) feels rather uncomfortable tbh.

But what about other works who get max two weeks at a time. Does it take them two weeks to let go too? Because that’s their entire leave.

I 100% think that teaching is a tough job. But most workers would benefit from a significant summer break. The mental health benefits alone would be huge.

Well, the arguments on here may not be child-centred but most of the educators that I've spoken to would say that all children regress a bit because of the length of the summer holiday and the time away from education, and that's much more pronounced in kids with learning difficulties and other SEND.

I'd be in favour not of reducing the overall amount of holiday time for schools in the UK, but certainly of spreading it out a bit more over the year.

I’ve only done one of those and I take my hat off to the others. I don’t think people see the monumental amount of paperwork that goes on behind the scenes, tbh or all the out of hours working,No doubt childminding and nursing have similar issues. 10+ hrs a day, normal, huge amount of face to face contact etc plus behavioural issues for some. We have a teacher shortage and I think it’s worth investing why.

Edit. Not singling teachers out, looking at the issues of modern day education.

Perhaps the best solution is for children to start working at a much younger age. They can do menial jobs, learn some practical skills, be supervised and also make some money. Win-win 🫠😜

I gather you've never been a teacher? Most of the other jobs you've mentioned go home after work and start work the next day. Teachers go home after work and start working that evening to prepare the work the next day. I've never worked so hard or such long hours as when I was a teacher.

I don’t disagree but yes, it takes days, each break, to re set.

You say that very flippantly without acknowledging the fact that we have one of the worst childcare systems and parental allowances in Europe.

It's not surprising that parents need to consider the childcare aspect of school and you are targeting the wrong people by getting annoyed at parents.

If you are annoyed about this then write to your MP about employment law and parental rights.

If more people trained to be teachers there might not be the recruitment problems they have now.

Everyone has choices.

It’s not a race to the bottom - teaching as a career is open to many changing T&Cs because if other professions is insanity.

My son’s teacher (Ireland) finishes contact time at 110. She leave the school an hour later. She does not work 10 hours a day!