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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Drug use- what do you find acceptable?

339 replies

Rachmumoftwo · 27/05/2008 11:55

There is a thread that has touched on this already. What is acceptable drug use in your eyes? Is it OK to smoke a little weed when the children are in bed, or take cocaine on weekends or holidays, or is it totally irresponsible to even entertain the idea of drug taking if you are a parent (or if you are planning to be)?

OP posts:
barnical · 27/05/2008 13:13

I do agree with you Bod, the whole drug issue is very big and one one easily solved if at all. alchohol is legal, but you still get the cheap stuff bootleg stuff that has legal issues as well.

It does come down to personal choice in the end as these things are available. IMo tho if were asking what usage is acceptable, as it stands being illegal and the history the products have, then the answer has to be for me none.
Is it okay to shoplift as long as the dcs don't see you do it??

barnical · 27/05/2008 13:14

*and NOT one

jojosmaman · 27/05/2008 13:27

Don't touch drugs now although I did dabble in my youth when I was young, single and carefree and when the after effects of the drugs/ drink didnt adversely affect anyone else other than myself. Its not the actualy taking of the drug that I believe causes the problems (providing it doesnt kill you) but the after effects, the hangover, the come down. For me this would often last all week, mondays were often spent in bed and tuesdays were a blur and it wasnt until my school grades stared slipping that I had to stop spending the weekend off my head before I failed my A-Levels. I can't imagine being able to bring up a family under this unavoidable cloud that follows drug taking

As for weed? I used to be very much in the "its not as bad as alcohol/ you don't see any stoneheads fighting/ its not addictive" pro -legalisation camp but i have well and truely done a u-turn in my policies after seeing DP slide in to a mental state of paranoia and depression, unable to socialise, go to work or hold a conversation. Luckily he has quit now and for the past three years he has made huge steps and is like a different person. He could not have been a dad to ds or run his own successful business, the person he was, and I am so proud of how he has turned his life around but unfortunatley I can't brag in RL like I could if he had stopped drinking or smoking cigarettes!

girlywhirly · 27/05/2008 13:33

I won't take any medicine unless I really need it. I don't smoke anything or drink alcohol to excess by choice, and have never taken illicit drugs, again by choice. There are no quality controls for the production of the latter, and they are often contaminated. People have no idea of the amount of active substance they are in fact taking. Mixing different substances together, causing interactions about which little is known can, and has proved fatal.

I agree with Booge that someone always should be 'with it' when looking after children. But if I had ever found out that someone had been drinking over the driving limit or taking illicit drugs while caring for my child, they wouldn't be doing it again. Just a thought about babysitters, or when children go to another home for a sleep-over.

Rachmumoftwo · 27/05/2008 13:34

I find it interesting that people I know in RL talk about how bad it is to drink and get stoned all day long on weed. Now, I like a glass of wine, have been known to enjoy the occasional smoke, but you can sit next to someone drinking and not have any effects yourself, while passively smoking is known to be detrimental to health, what about passively smoking weed. Can you then get stoned yourself and crash your car?

OP posts:
DrNortherner · 27/05/2008 13:37

Personally I had my time experimenting with drugs (Dope/speed and E) when I was single and not a parent. Then I grew up.

I don't think recreational drugs have any place in the life or a responsible adult who is in charge of kids.

Alcohol and fags are completely different - for a start they are legal.

Rachmumoftwo · 27/05/2008 13:39

(I mean and how bad it is to drink and then they get stoned all day)

OP posts:
sitdownpleasegeorge · 27/05/2008 14:01

To me class A drugs users are just people who never grew up to take full responsibility for their lives.

I don't care if they are the CEO of a large organisation, drug use (class A) is flaky behaviour.

Why can't people manage to have a good time without it ?

Alcohol in moderation, I'm O.K. with although I'm pretty much tee-total myself but I do think this country needs to address its underage drinking problem more aggressively. I'd have sinbin facilities to dump the drunk and disorderly folks in for a 48 hour stay and they'd be charged for use of the facility. There would be no discounts for the unwaged. You can be as drunk as you like in your own home but why inflict your antisocial behaviour on any one else out for a pleasant evening.

Although I'm a non-smoker I'll tolerate people smoking (just not in my house/car/face thankyou) particularly among the older generation who became hooked before it was banned in the workplace and in pubs/restaurants but I do have reduced sympathy for those whose medical problems were self-inflicted by smoking. I really hope smoking can be reduced massively in this country by prohibiting it from public spaces be they open air or indoors and gradually extending the types of areas where it is banned. If the youth of today can't smoke in pubs and clubs where they want to spend time then I really hope less of them will take up the habit as what's the point if you can't smoke in front of your mates who you are trying to impress.

sitdownpleasegeorge · 27/05/2008 14:03

I'd also add that its becoming clear that smoking dope isn't the same as it was say 20 years ago.

The stuff available these days is far harsher on the mental state of the, primarily young, user and I'd love to see a tougher line taken on this.

wishingchair · 27/05/2008 14:08

Alcohol and cigarettes are surely unlikely to be made illegal despite the health and social consequences partly due to the hefty tax revenue stream they represent to the government and the massive established industries that exist to produce them.

As one of the posters said earlier, if they were discovered today, they'd no doubt be illegal. I'm not sure therefore, that using the simple argument that they are legal and therefore are OK is totally valid.

I drink a couple of glasses of wine maybe 3-4 times a week but don't drink so I'm drunk and don't take any drugs. Despite having children to look after, I just hate that out of body feeling, and if I've got time to myself I'd rather do something than lie in bed feeling crap. I also think that life is for living in its rawest form, not viewed through the kind of bubbly cloud you get from being pissed or off your head.

And I agree with the posters that have talked about the hypocrisy of the organic, local, fair trade, no-carrier-bag-using yet cocaine snorting middle classes. I'm pretty sure there aren't any fair trade columbian drug cartels.

cazcaz · 27/05/2008 14:16

I'm afraid that for me it's a NO.
My ex partner and biological father of my eldest child had a serious problem with dope and then cocaine.

It left him with no job, back living with his parents and a mental illness. He also has not seen his child since he was several weeks old, and as far as I know he could be dead. He had always indulged in dope and then later moved on to cocaine, interestingly he didn't really touch alcohol. His drug habit was well hidden from me untill his mental state gave it away. He was secretive, decietful and not a pleasant person to know. He was also deeply unhappy.

It saddens me that my son will one day have to know the truth about his biological father, (I met my DH when DS was less than a year old and he is his 'daddy')and actually I'm saddened for my ex partner and his family, who did not see it coming either. He stole from his parents, sister, employer anyone he could really.

I'm afraid I don't think I will ever be able to be open minded about drug abuse with my children. Even dope can ruin lives.

ByTheSea · 27/05/2008 14:20

I personally don't see a big problem with moderately drinking or smoking a bit of weed (when DC are in bed). FWIW, I find alcohol much more dangerous than week. I also don't see the problem with a bit of E if you don't have DC around at all. Having dabbled myself pre-DC and known people throughout life who have used all the other hard drugs, I don't think parents should mess about with them.

Kewcumber · 27/05/2008 14:24

"I'm not sure therefore, that using the simple argument that they are legal and therefore are OK is totally valid" - I don't think legal is necessarily OK however I do start from the point that illegal is NOT Ok.

But then I had to be vetted thoroughly before having children and certainly wouldn't have taken the risk of not being allowed DC's for the sake of a bit of "recreation".

claraquitetirednow · 27/05/2008 14:25

Don't have time to read all the messages so apologies if this has already been said but the main reason I think taking illegal drugs of any kind (but particularly Class A) is irresponsible is because of the impact it has on the people living in severely deprived parts of the world who get caught up in it.

I have lived in Jamaica and I have seen the damage it does. Ok you may say that drug mules are not "innocent" but they don't have the chance to be as well educated as we do. Many of the people who are exploited are women and usually the reason they are doing it is for their children.

Any mum who thinks snorting a line of cocaine of a weekend is a bit of harmless fun should think of those women, the pellets of cocaine bursting in their stomachs on the flight to the uk or the years spent in prison when they don't see their children grow up, or the revenge taken out on their families back home if they are arrested and the drugs therefore don't get delievered. They are mums too.

I could go on, talking about the impact of drugs on a country like jamaica where there are 30 times more murders than in the UK and where many young men are lucky to see their 30th birthdays. But I suspect I am preaching to the converted!

cazcaz · 27/05/2008 14:33

Part of the problem is that people can be affected so differently. Some can just do a little of 'recreational smoking dope or Ecstacy' and be just fine. For others it's totally different and even just those drugs can ruin lives!

Also the long term mental health effects on smoking dope are not yet known.

cazcaz · 27/05/2008 14:36

alittleone, Sorry I just read your posts properly. How very sad for you and your family. I hope the situation is able to be resolved soon. Your right - families fall apart over things like this.

Its just devastating.

cestlavie · 27/05/2008 16:19

I think the difficulty with these debates is the phrase 'drug use' is an emotive/ loaded phrase in its own right, as we've seen in the various debates on here, despite the fact that it covers an incredibly wide range from someone who has a spliff once a month to someone who's mainlining crack on a daily basis.

In particular, those who are against any form of drug use tend to take a very hard line about it. Partly I think this is because it's illegal and people (rightly or wrongly) believe that if something is illegal then it is bad by definition and there can thefore be no middle ground - any amount of illegal drug use is wrong. Partly it is because many people know someone who has had severe problems as a result of drugs and therefore similarly but subjectively views any amount of illegal drug use as carrying the same risk. Partly it is because there is very relatively little readily available objective public information available - most data or evidence which comes out is immediately politicised by pro or anti-drug campaigners.

E.g. The cocaine industry causes deforestation - at 300,000 hectares per year it does according to Colombian Vice President, but it also ranks a long, long way behind logging, mining, oil and gas, cattle farming, plantations, dams and other engineering projects, fuelwood, fires and even tourism according to the World Rainforest Movement.

E.g. Just one pill can kill you - it can and it can do so rather quickly, but with 16 deaths from Ecstacy in 2006 out of an estimated 26 million tablets taken in the same year (Source: ONS, Guardian), the actual risk of is a miniscule 1 in 1.6 million vs a 1 year risk of 1 in 400,000 of dying in plane crash. Even the odds on being struck by lightning are not that much higher at 1 in 2.0 million.

E.g. Modern strains of drug (e.g. skunk) are far more potent than before and are likely to have a more damaging impact on mental health - they are more potent in terms of TCH content and in theory, regular usage of higher dosage drugs should have a more negative impact. On the other hand, the number of people admitted to consultant care with drug related mental health or behavioural problems has fallen over the last 10 years by 4% (according to the NHS).

I'd also add that people who are pro-drugs can also be very black and white, their arguments typically coming down to either (a) I've used various sorts for ages and have never known anyone including myself to have any ill effects and (b) alcohol is just a 'legal' drug, almost everyone uses it and it causes many more deaths than illegal drugs which actually may just be an argument to regulate alcohol a lot more.

I think what is clear is that from a personal health standpoint, the absolute risk from drugs is relatively low. There can be virtually no question about that. With over one third of the UK adult population having taken drugs at least once in their lives and 10.5% having taken them in the last year alone, the incidence of death or physical or mental illness resulting is truly minimal as evidenced by many sources, including government reports. Equally, whilst use of recreational drugs clearly does have a negative impact on global society, this will clearly vary depending on the type of drug, e.g. Ecstacy is typically manufactured, distributed and consumed within its own country. Equally, being purely objective, from say an environmental and sociological perspective, I suspect the global drugs trade has a lesser impact than many other industries, e.g. petrochemicals, mining, logging, biofuels and pharmaceuticals. If you're boycotting drugs solely on these grounds, there are probably many, many better products to be boycotting first.

Personally, it what is acceptable probably comes down to the individual. If you are anti-drugs then any personal health risk, however small, or wider impact, however small, is too much. If you are pro-drugs, or at least ambivalent, then objectively there should be a level of drug use which you could consider as being acceptable.

tiredemma · 27/05/2008 16:21

FAntastic post cestlavie.

alittleone2 · 27/05/2008 16:24

Message withdrawn

jcscot · 27/05/2008 16:28

Absolutely no drug-taking is "acceptable", as far as I'm concerned. I don't agree with heavy drinking and I don't agree with smoking either. Every artificial stimulant causes impairment of judgement of some sort and thus, when around children, isn't a good idea.

On glass of wine won't kill you, if you're not planning to drive anywhere - I'd never get in a car with nayone who'd been drinking/taken drugs. I also wouldn't drink if I was solely in charge of a child - what if something were to happen and was not capable of making the right decision?

Other drugs? Not on your nelly - I've never touched the stuff and I never will.

expatinscotland · 27/05/2008 16:30

I find ANY coke use unacceptable because of the impact it's had on Latin America.

And smack, well, why not just make a donation to Al Queda? It would be more honest.

sleepycat · 27/05/2008 16:35

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

beaniesteve · 27/05/2008 16:38

I have a very very hard time with drugs.

I have taken drugs and I think there is little wrong with light cannabis use. I have also got no objection to pills as long as they are taken safely.

I have issues with Cocaine, having never used coke myself but having been in situations where everyone else but me has I just don't like it at all.

but... Much as it scares me and worries me I try to have an accepting attitude towards other people's drug use. I can't be a hypocrit and kick off about drug use when I have used/taken drugs myself.

The only thing I find hard personally is when drug use comes hand in hand with lies. I am not stupid and I hate being treated like I am.

If my kids started using drugs I hope they would do so in a responsible way and that they would be able to be open with me.

DirtySexyMummy · 27/05/2008 16:39

Oh my god the government scaremongering on Ecstacy really worked with you lot.

Read CoteDAzurs posts and links, and get some education.

beaniesteve · 27/05/2008 16:39

oh - my attitude to drugs in in no way black and white BTW. I have different attitudes to different drugs.