Patriarchy and marriage, how do you do it?

[Cdu2021]

I want to get external opinions and see if I am being unreasonable.

Having previously held several stressful jobs with long hours, I quit my job last year and I am now at home looking after my 6 and 4 year olds (who both go to school). We are in a very lucky financial position where we could afford for me not to go back to work. My husband has a demanding, stressful job with long hours and travels fairly often.

However, my husband's attitude is killing me. I have always done about 80% of all the housework / childcare and general mental load management, even when I was in busy jobs. That is probably why I found it so hard to juggle all the demands. My husband was on board with me quitting as he could see how overwhelmed I was.

Right now, logically, I do pretty much 100% of housework and childcare etc. But my husband now seems to have this vague notion that it is completely normal, and that his sleep and needs are somehow superior to mine because I don't work. He never phrased it in this way, but for example, he will often sleep in on Sundays, have a nap after lunch and leave all clearing up to me, and go for a walk and disappear when it's dinner time and bedtime. He won't get up in the night if the children wake up, and he won't get them up and ready in the mornings. He used to be like that sometimes, but now it's like he can justify it to himself because he's the only one in a really stressful busy job.

I guess I feel I'm screwed either way: if I have a job, I am still doing the vast majority of housework (although my husband never recognised that), and if I don't work, it feels like I am here to accommodate his needs (sleeping, resting) and cannot in any way ask him to do a bit more at home without him telling me, well, why don't you go find yourself a big job and I'll stay at home? But I know I wouldn't want that, and I suspect he wouldn't like it or cope with housework without me hand holding him.

Also, his mum is very much of the mindset that women were put on earth to be caring and look after everyone, so there's definitely an element I recognise here (and hate).

AIBU?

If nothing had changed in 5 years time,would you still be in this marriage?

A core of entitlement is really hard to deal with. Your husband is very unlikely to change because when it comes down to it, he doesn't think he should have to, and nothing is making him (apart from potentially the prospect of you leaving)

If both kids are in school can you not designate a day or two during the week as ‘your’ weekend? Nap and relax to your hearts content, and use the other three days for housework etc? Realistically if you’re at home full time and kids are at school, there should be enough time for BOTH of you to get plenty of relaxation - his obviously needs to come out of the weekend but no reason yours can’t come out of the week.

** obviously just before summer holidays probably isn’t the best time to start, and I’m sure he should put more effort into acknowledging your needs too. But more to say - maybe start claiming the time for yourself the same way he is!

You aren't being unreasonable at all! I think this is really common in many partnerships - the mental load is a very real thing.

The obvious solution is to say talk to your husband but I know that's often easier said than done. This might sound a bit silly or cheesy but a friend of mine ages ago said she and her husband used a set of cards called fair play - it's supposed to be a kind of fun way to redress the balance in your relationship and divide up the mental load a bit.

And I suppose the next bits to think about are how respected/listened to you feel overall in your relationship (has he always expected you to do more?) and whether or not you want to re-enter the workplace? It's absolutely fine to be a sahm if that's what you want but you shouldn't be forced into it because of an unhelpful and sexist partner. And there are bound to be jobs you can do that aren't on the same level as your previous one if you'd rather reduce hours or have a change of direction.

Your children are at school and you have time during the day to take care of housework. If that doesn't suit you, then go back to work but it seems the man you married sees childcare and housework as 'women's work' - you're there to make his life comfortable and take care of his children.

You're in a very vulnerable position financially and I hope he's contributing towards your pension. An alternative is to go back to work and spend money on home help such as a cleaner, laundry service and wrap around childcare.

Well you can try and change his attitude, ask him to carry out designated tasks, make plans for yourself on a sunday out of the home so he's left eith the DC etc. Try communicating with him how you feel and the impact of his behaviour on your relationship.

And/or think of it that you have 30? hours to yourself a week: dedicate some of that time to yourself, to hobbies, downtime, volunteering, etc. If you can afford it, outsource the cleaning, gardening etc.

How do you see your future in 10 years time when the DC are more independent and you've been out of the workforce for a decade? Would you go back to work? Hope DH steps back to spend time together? Resent that you've put everyone's needs before your own for so long?

You do have 5 days a week on your own for like 5 ish hours a day so I actually think you’re pretty ok in this. I am sure your husband is exhausted because he gets no time on his own! Running a house having kids etc is hard work, but your role is this is to do the running of the house / looking after the kids. You’re very privileged to have all this time! I don’t think your husband is unreasonable at all!

Here’s the thing, you are enabling his behaviour. Get a job and fairly split housework, life admin etc. Sorted.

I would get back to some form of work asap.
maybe part time?

If your children are both in school and you're a sahm then yes I'd expect you to do pretty much all housework....I'd expect respect from my DH as in don't drop your clothes on the floor and expect me to pick them up and you can put your plate in the dishwasher...but otherwise you have plenty of time to do it all.

Both of your children will be in school come Sept meaning you’ll have everyday in school hours to yourself. Surely things will ease then?

During the week, fair enough. Your H should certainly be doing his share of wake ups and tidying at the weekends though. Plus a designated lie in day each.

Patriarchy and marriage, how do you do it?

The answer is to marry a man who isn't an entitled dinosaur and to not tolerate any kind of assholery from the outset.

I think you feel he doesnt view what you do as work so you wouldnt need a rest or break from it and he cant value it. Probably because he didn't notice you did 80% of it before.

giving him the benefit of the doubt, he might assume you have a break during school hours?

if you want stay at home, you do need to make time for yourself in the school day and think of it as a split shift. You have a busy patch, a long break and a busy patch.

Also work expands to fit the time available. So if you used to get your cleaning done around a busy job, don't slip into your cleaning taking a whole day now.

I actually feel you should both get a lay in so one gets Saturday and one sunday.

I think he should do some bedtimes as its important chikdren get used to doing bedtime with both parents, and its good for him to bond with his children not delegate the relationship to you.

I really struggle with adults who expect others to pick up after them.

Honestly OP, it's not the patriarchy it's your husband.

From speaking to many, the vast majority of men don't see how much of the mental load falls on their women partners, especially once children arrive.

Also, his mum is very much of the mindset that women were put on earth to be caring and look after everyone, so there's definitely an element I recognise here (and hate).

This is where the problem started. The only way we're going to break this cycle is if we, as mothers, bring our sons up to understand that homemaking and child-rearing is the EQUAL responsibility of BOTH partners in a couple. And that can only happen if both partners act as role models for this, so fathers have to demonstrate this behaviour also.

He was BU to leave most of the housework and childcare to you when you were both working FT, but instead of pushing back on that, you quit your job and decided to become a SAHP. With two school-aged dc, I think it's only fair that you do the bulk of the childcare and housework now. You should have plenty of time to relax when the kids are in school, so it's fair enough for your DH to have some downtime at weekends.

Or go back to work and insist that you share the domestic load 50/50.

YANBU OP, you are not alone and this is a very common problem. The majority of men just don't seem to think they should have to work anything like as hard as their (female) partners do. I have no idea what you do about it, but when you figure it out please let the rest of us know!!!

Yep, this about sums it up.

DH works full time, I work 4 days. We do equal shares of school runs, household admin (he does all house bills, car tax insurance mot etc, I do child related admin - clubs, holiday planning, parties, hospital appts booking - we share actually taking), share holiday childcare, each get a lie in. I do a cleaning blitz on Friday as I'm off, but he does cooking, washing up etc. We both share night wakes, although at 6 and 9 ours dont wake unless unwell.

I wouod expect OP to do most of school runs, clubs, cleaning etc during week as not working. But weekends should be 50:50, both for their benefit but also so he can spend time with the children, set a good example of a shares partnership etc. Growing up my mum was a SAHM until I was about 9, and my Dad used to take us out swimming, park, ice cream etc most Saturday and Sunday mornings and then would help us with our homework etc so mu mum had some downtime, and to connect with us after working long hours during the week. I guess growing up with this example I knew not to accept anything less in my husband.

This and also show our daughters what an equal relationship looks like, and OP is doing the opposite by giving up work to look after the children and home. So if you want to end patriarchy you have to not normalise the housewife lifestyle and force their dad to take on half of the responsibilities at home and with the children whilst you both work. The kids are too young to remember their mother having a career and have never seen a balanced and equal relationship so they won't know to look for that themselves either.

THIS !!! Take some free time for you , whilst Children are at school and husband out at work. But also , he needs help out more. He isn’t exempt just because he works outside the home.

It’s a tricky one for me especially because both children are in school, so actually Monday-Friday you could have a 2 hour nap every day if you wanted to so at that point for me it does make sense that you would be the one doing night wake ups. You’re the one who does get a chance to go back to bed so that part does make sense to me, and because you do get essentially 5 days of free time each week then I’d expect his free time to be at the weekend.

Housework, again, you’re not working and both kids are in school so totally reasonable for that to be on you however as PP says- don’t let it expand to fill the available time. If you used to be able to clean in 1 hour don’t now let that become 5 hours just because you have the time.

But lie ins on a weekend, for me, you should get one each. You’re up early through the week getting kids sorted for school, he’s up early for work, you should both get one day of the weekend to just get up when you want to get up.

& bedtimes etc I think it’s actually quite sad to think he’s actively avoiding those. My husband & I do book, bath etc together usually with our daughter, it’s sometimes the one bit of proper full family time we get in a busy work day and it’s lovely to spend it together.

I guess his view is that your life has got considerably better since you've given up work so his should get better too. This in itself is not unreasonable IMO but it sounds like the benchmark level of contribution was massively skewed. I don't think it's reasonable to expect him to do housework if you have all week to do it when the kids are at school, however, I would be very upset if he wants to check out of being a Father; he needs to think about the impact that this will have on his relationship with the kids. Have you discussed that specific point with him?

I agree with all of this.

I'd want to see an effort from him at the weekend to engage in family life and roll his sleeves up at least one of the days.

During the week when they're at school I'd get stricter with your timings, although sometimes I know it can feel like you're just done the school run and it's time to do it again, and carve out some time for yourself during the week.

You deserve not to spend your weeks feeling like a domestic applicance. You need to make sure that in five, ten, fifteen years time you're not shafting yourself by packing in work.

You're not going to change the deep seated belief that he has inherited from his parents and society in general that women are for propping up men, but you can make sure you don't show your DC the same.