... to think that Nigel Farage will be our next PM?

[ohime]

Or, more accurately: AIBU to be afraid that truly nasty piece of work Nigel Farage who has, by all accounts, always been utterly useless at (or at least completely uninterested in) the actual business end of governing will be our next PM because everyone is so fed up with all the other parties being, variously or all at once, so corrupt, incompetent and useless that we've collectively abandoned all hope? I will never vote for Farage, who is a horrible man, or any of his party which keeps having to fire people for being just a teensy bit too overtly racist - but it seems from the polls that for many people the choice against the status quo outweighs what we may be choosing. (For an example, I can't believe that Farage's stated position that DOGE in the US didn't go far enough with its swinging cuts to the social safety net would be popular with UK voters who recently elected a government on the basis that it would reverse years of Tory austerity... not that that's worked out so well...)

Its not only the numbers of people coming to the shores of the UK by boats, though i agree that needs reducing for the good of all involved. Its also how those are processed when they get here. If (as per the Tories) they are just put in hotels and their asylum claim lost in a black hole for years then all those new arrivals.might as well be permanent. If Labour manage to sort out the mess and claims and appeals are processed adequately (say within a year) and the people with no right to asylum are then sent back that means the overall number staying is less. Think 100 people arrive and 100 stay versus 120 people arrive and 60 are sent back.
The problem is, inevitably, processing people's asylum requests means some will have the right to stay. So processing claims faster means those numbers "appear" in immigration stats rather than being hidden for years in hotels. Even if the majority of claims are rejected and turned down thats more grist to the mill (75% of asylum seekers are lying! Finally government admits the TRUTH). People arriving in July with no rights to remain may well only be deported next year. So even though that's much faster than before they are still here now creating a record year. And people being officially allowed to stay will also infuriate the right, even if overall the numbers of people staying goes down.

I just can't think of anything Labour can do on immigration that would make you happy.

Then you’ll have no problem, retaining your socialist Labour government in power.

The Reform surge and disillusionment with Labour must be a figment of everyone else’s imagination.

Another post quoting lots of figures without any sources.
I mean I could post on here that 92% of reform voters have two heads and purple spots. Doesn't make it true...

I am sure people had good reasons for voting Brexit
If they voted for Brexit because someone on the interwebs called them dim and they took offence.then I am sorry that is dim.

And the issues with people arriving by small boats.only happened after Brexit and was directly a result of Brexit. Some people warned this would happen because leaving the EUeant leaving previous agreements that we had on return of refugees etc. So really Farage has done more to boost illegal immigration than anyone
Is he secretly a lefty?

Around 75% of asylum claims are granted. Fast tracking is basically another name for an amnesty. Come and your claim will most likely be accepted. It gets the people in the waiting list down but doesn’t reduce the pull factor. That’s why the numbers are increasing even further. Net results is that more people come over, claims are accepted at faster rate and the Ponzi scheme becomes bigger and bigger. It’s basically an open door at this point.

It’s beyond a farce. And people can see it.

I really, really couldn't give a fuck what Reform voters think anymore, and I'm sick and tired of watching the country go down the pan because we have to keep pandering to their inane obsessions.

You 'won' in 2016, didn't you? And yet you're never fucking happy. You never will be. So yeah, I do think you're thick if you think Farage or Reform are the country's salvation. Carry on whining about the nasty rude people like me by all means. I genuinely couldn't care less.

Thing is, it can all change in a heartbeat. Five years before Labour won the election, people were stating that Labour were unelectable, that there was absolutely no chance of them getting into power for decades. Yet here we are. Also, Sultana going into partnership with Corbyn in forming their new party - people are already talking about her views being very much Islamist based. That is going to push many people, who were on the fence with Farage, to voting Reform, because the vast majority of the UK do not want an extreme leftist potentially Islamist lead party in number 10. So tactics will come into it, with a very real possibility of Reform getting in by default.

I think he will, and it makes me want to weep

They don't get sent back though.. there's always ECHR bullshit. Once they're here they're here for the duration and a massive drain on public finances.

Human rights 'bullshit'.

Out of interest, are your human rights bullshit? Or just other people's?

Are you ok?

I suspect not, seeing much of what is happening in this country.
Have you never come across someone expressing their views with a little feeling before?

And they're treated like kings when they get here. Far better than in France where they've come from.

Ah yep, because the country going down the pan is totally down to Reform and not due to this useless Labour Party taking us to the edge of the abyss. I feel your frustration seeping out of your very bitter angry posts that Labour aren’t performing as well as we were lead to believe they would before the GE. But that’s the reality - we voted these dumb arses in, thinking they would be our saviour, and now we all feel betrayed and angry. Just hope the next four years go quick, to avoid us completely becoming a third world country. We can only hope and pray……

It’s just more of the hysterical shrieking that usually comes from the left, laden with swearing and insults. Nothing new.

Did you mean me? I didn't give any figures - only hypotheticals. It is true that the home office for years failed to process asylum claims.quicly leading to a backlog that peaked in 2022/2023 (COVID didn't help) https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-66603767

https://researchbriefings.files.parliament.uk/documents/CBP-9737/CBP-9737.pdf

https://migrationobservatory.ox.ac.uk/resources/briefings/the-uks-asylum-backlog/

Whether Labour is better only time will tell. But even if they were better people could still find reasons to be cross

I dont have any sources for the idea that the total number of people allowed to stay in a country = the total number to arrive - the total number sent back. But its common sense surely. And its surely also common sense that where people have a right to asylum the sooner this is processed and the sooner they are legally allowed to work/integrate is better for everyone?

Or did you mean the other posters comment about this year being a record year? I choose to be generous and think that she meant of we extrapolated from figures for May/June/July we would see a record year (for one particular type of migration only).

I don’t disagree about the absence of any evidence of good done by Reform. I doubt they’ve done anything worthwhile at all. The opposite’s much more likely.

And I don’t disagree that Farage is a political charlatan. But so is Starmer: this…

NF (never were initials more appropriate) is a snake-oil-peddling grifter. He's not interested in anyone except himself. He couldn't give two of the tiniest shits about 'working people' - good ol' pint-quaffing Nige wouldn't piss on your average brickie, care worker or shelf-stacker if they were on fire. He doesn't give a fuck about 'ordinary people's concerns…

…could obviously apply to Starmer. He cares only about high office. He doesn’t care about the person in the street. His dishonesty and hypocrisy - and that of many other senior Labour figures - is fully on display. He’s a self-interested knob who’s unfit for office.

That said, virtually every senior politician is an untrustworthy shit. But that’s politics.

Starmer and his attorney general are literally the biggest proponents of open borders in this country.

They may now pretend to have changed their stripes. But for decades before entering politics and even until taking over Labour leadership Starmer was pro open borders and said that immigration controls are racist.

His legal eagle in chief essentially believes that immigration should have no controls and spent most of his career milking the legal aid system fighting the good fight for unsavoury characters.

The Tories said one thing and did another. Labour are doing exactly what they said and believe in - increasing illegal immigration. The numbers speak for themselves.

Ah, passive aggressive head tilt time, is it? Better than calling people thick, I suppose, huh?

No, I'm not ok, since you ask. I'm sad and angry about what has happened to the tolerant, patient, welcoming, creative, outward-looking country I grew up in. We've become insular, isolationist and frightened. Our public services have been decimated. Everyone's poorer and less optimistic. And the populists are on the rise, promising everything, delivering nothing, offering mindlessly simplistic solutions to complex problems. Critical thinking is non-existent, we're a country of three-word slogans and convenient scapegoats. I'm tired and frustrated and worried about the direction the country, not to mention the world, is taking.

But, you know, immigrants.

Did anyone really think Labour were going to be any good? The Tories were just done and they won by default. There was no enthusiasm for Starmer and his rabble.

In 4 years Reform will win by default because Labour won't deal with immigration and won't get the economy in better shape.

Yes, I have noticed this, the left shrieking and swearing, calling posters bad names, bots, only left wing voters seem to do that and the constant questioning about your vote if it's not Labour.

Bingo, every soundbite and guardian anecdote regurgitated in one post. Well done.

But yeah, the country is going down the pan.

I know.
The logic of basically saying 'I'm not very clever so I don't want clever people in power, because I don't understand what they're saying. I want thick people, like me, in power '.

I'm not stupid, but I have dedicated my working life to my own field, not politics, or economics, or international law.

Does that mean I feel patronised if people who know about those things talk about them? Of course not, I might read up on it if it's an issue I care about. I would certainly critique what is said and look it up and find out more if I was sceptical. Imagine saying 'I don't really understand this important issue so I will vote for people who ignore it, as those who address it are patronising me.'

I honestly can't get my head around the logic (or lack of it). I come from an utterly working class background, but now have a well paid professional job, so I understand that I am not currently dealing with the issues that affect people who are facing particular hardships. I very lucky, but have many family members and friends who are more impacted.

My manual labourer and factory worker grandparents, aunts and uncles, admin assistant mum, dad who worked in construction industry (not a business owner or anything like that, I know that's quite well paid these days) were all politically aware. They read about the issues, they tried to understand them, discuss them. They knew it was important to. I can't imagine any of them wanting to only vote for a party that didn't talk about important issues because they didn't understand them. They wanted to understand and ensure their vote made an impact on our lives.

When did working class people begin to identify as thick and feel patronised by anyone trying to engage with them about complex but important political issues?

And what is the fucking obsession with 'boat people'... I can honestly say neither my life, that of my very working class parents (who live by a bloody beach) or anyone I know has ever been negatively affected by an immigrant.

I think you are being gullible as fuck having your attention held on this and not the issues that will genuinely make a big difference to your own lives.

Are you able to respond to the points raised?
If you have different opinions why not engage in a discussion?
Or is that too left and guardian.

The penny has finally dropped with the Tories on immigration but Labour will always believe in open borders.

There's finally a consensus on sorting out immigration and we're lumbered with arch globalist Starmer for 5 years.