70k near home or 100k London?

[WakeMeFriday]

Me and DH are in a bit of discussion about this - I am on 70k where my office is 15 mins walk from my home. Bus stop is just next to the house and by bus it's only 5 mins. Commute time is so quick and cheap £2 each way. I have two little kids - 1 year old and 4 years old. Both at preschool and childminder who is 5 mins walk. There's good work life balance and can work flexibly over 4 days
However, the career progression is slow at my civil service job. I have been looking around to see what the opportunities are out there and seems like most of the jobs in London for my profile pay over 100k. We are in Midlands and my mortgage remaining is 150k. We bought the house just when COVID started so we got a good sized 4 bed house for 260k. Our outgoings are less due to a smaller mortgage and locking in for a good cheap mortgage rate. So, that helps with keeping our financial stress low, considering I have been on 2 sets of mat leaves in the last 4 years. Also, with the 70k, we can still claim 30 free hours for DCs , which we won't if any of us go over 100k.
DH says I should just stick it out and stay at my current workplace but I feel like I should explore what London has to offer.
Travelling to London from Midlands is expensive and return train tickets are £150 per day and at least 3 hours additional travel.
Moving to London would be hard as houses are expensive and we don't want a huge mortgage. I am mid 30s, DH early 40s. We want to live stress free life and ability to travel as well.
What would be better for us in the long term?

I'm very similar to you- civil servant not in London and with a small child. I ran all the numbers of commuting or living in London, childcare, trains, the cheap flat I own or the expensive one I could rent in London, etc etc. Don't forget a wage increase at that bracket is 40% tax.

All signs said stay put. But I really miss living in London and always will.

Another thing is I also keep thinking about having a third DC, which we haven't decided yet and I think it would all become too much of a juggle, so need to decide what would be best for our family.

Stay where you are.

The grass is not always greener and you describe a great set up already

If you want to live a stress free life I think you would be mad to take a job in London. With the commute, cost and travel time. Sounds like you have a great salary, flexibility and commute already.

What's the difference in pension contributions? How much of the £100k would you have to put into your pension to match the amount being paid in now? You need to discount that much of the pay rise.

I don't think the change of job makes sense financially or flexibility wise as your current job, once everything is taken into account.

Won't you end up worse off on the london job really? Financially AND your time (which is worth something too)

I would 100% stay where you are you will MUCH worse off.

I'm in London I make under 200k but our houses mortgage is 600k 🫠🫠🫠
And childcare costs me 4k per month.

I'd legit seriously consider swapping with you.

4 bed for 270k and a 70k (with decent pension) and access to childcare in the midlands gives you way more flex...also your commute is a dream 😍
I do 10 hours plus per week on the sweaty gross underground

Also If its an SCS role you'll lose flexitime

Stay put for now. Jobs in London will always be there. Having to be close to the school for picks ups if ill etc will be much easier...unless your oh does this?
The extra 30k will soon get swallowed up and you'll probably not see much difference in disposable income...and a lot less time

Is the 100k London job also in the CS? If so, presumably its SCS1? In which case you also need to factor into consideration that you lose flexitime in the SCS (or at least in our Dept you do). Im holding on at G6 until my DC are older as I value the flexibility over the extra pay.

Lots of departments are still moving jobs out of London so you might find more promotions opportunities if you keep looking in Birmingham.

Also, sounds mad but 30k really doesnt go that far in London and even with the funded hours, nursery will probably be much more than you pay now. I have a 4yo and a 1yo and our bill is £1800 per month including the funded hours.

Just to give you an idea of housing costs, we live in a not very nice part of z3 and our 3bed house is worth around 550k. We still have a 1hr commute.

So I think you'd be much worse off financially and have a higher stress life due to the commute.

Also, with the 70k, we can still claim 30 free hours for DCs , which we won't if any of us go over 100k

You can for a fair bit over £100k, as it’s £100k net adjusted, not gross.

Anyway, on balance, I’d probably stick where you are. But it’s a lot more money a month though, so would easily cover commuting costs. Is there a specific role you have seen? What are the hybrid work opportunities? I think there’s no harm in applying to some roles and going from there.

Your work location is a short walk from home. You'd be crazy to replace that with a long train journey. Is the station walking distance? Will you need a tube at the other end?

That commute will ruin your present comfortable family life. Don't do it.

I’d stay put. Houses are so much more expensive and you would have to have a huge mortgage Travel is expensive and you would spend much longer commuting. If you have a third child you would also be paying out for childcare for years to come. Even when the children start school you will have to

then sort out breakfast and after school clubs.
My adult children work in London and the commuting in adds about 2 hrs a day to their working day. Costly with child care.

Are you mad? Commuting to London while you have very young children is a horrible idea. Revisit it in 10 years time. You have a relatively cushy life which allows lots of family time, it’s worth its weight in gold.

I'd also really think about whether you want to commit to travelling if you took a job in London but stayed living in the Midlands from the time perspective. Departments are getting much stricter about enforcing the 60% office rule. I recently decided not to apply for a promotion in another Dept which would have meant a much longer commute because I just don't think now is the right time to be away from my youngest so much and i want to be there to support the eldest when they are going to have massive change in starting school. Maybe in a few years, I might change my mind.

£100k in London is £50k in the midlands - assuming you stay where you are, your train season ticket will eat up the post-tax difference, let alone the extra nursery costs.

My mortgage on a 3 bedroom ex-council house in London is £3800, if that gives you some idea of the house price difference. A four bedroom Victorian terrace (loft conversion, so not a huge house) would be £1.7m around here - totally unaffordable for me and DH, who both earn low 6 figures.

The sums won’t sum on this financially as an employment opportunity. You could (if you really wanted to) make it work, but if you prioritise work life balance, short commute, affordable childcare etc, you’re onto a pretty unbeatable set up, particularly for this chapter of your life.

If you want to get to know London from a lifestyle perspective, prioritise weekend trips to the museums, parks and much more (and find ways to do this easily and affordably as it can be done!).

Honestly the way you describe your current situation sounds as near perfect as possible. I get that progression isn’t great where you are, but a London job would likely mean a huge lifestyle change for you, is it worth it? I love London but in all honesty the older I get the more I realise is that life is for living, not many people wish they’d worked more in their lives. You’ve got a well paid ( compared to many) job where you are, next to no commute, low mortgage, big house. Be with your family and enjoy life I say.

And what does your DH do?

DH is a G6 in the south west and it’s hard making the step up to SCS living here but we’ve made a steadfast decision to stay where we are.

Cost of living here is cheaper.
I have a good job here too & couldn’t transfer.
Increase in salary wouldn’t be great in terms of child benefit, tax free childcare support etc.
commuting would be exhausting and expensive.

If something comes up that he can do from his current office then he’ll go for it but we’ve completely written off any thoughts of relocating as the cons outweigh the pros for us.

Stay were you are, you will be worst off with 100k in London overall.

@WakeMeFriday £1500pm increase in take home.

Would that be worth the upheaval?

If you are in the midlands then you have to factor in the onward travel from either Euston or King's Cross. I used to regularly commute into Euston from the Midlands and have to get across London to Westminster. It adds minimum 30 minutes and often over an hour to your journey. All protests end up in Westminster so you often have to contend with closed roads and stations as well as disruption and crowds. And that's before you throw in the rail strikes and rail disruptions for hot and cold temperatures.

It's a huge decision to take when you have a young family. I was recently offered a move from an £85k job based at home (albeit with some national travel) to a £110k job based 3 days a week in Westminster. I don't have young children but I concluded that the net gain (probably only about £10k after costs, which i would probablyend up puttinginto my pension anyway) just wasn't worth it.

Your setup sounds perfect. I have colleagues in London who commute from the Midlands. It’s draining and expensive and would cut massively into the pay rise you could get. You’d see much less of your children because of the commute. But if it’s an easy route, it is doable (and you could rake in the air miles if you pay on the right credit card, as my colleague does).
Moving to London? As a Londoner, my opinion is you’d be mad to even consider it at your life stage. 4-bed houses in zone 3 cost upwards of £750k, usually more; and the things that made London fabulous are either gone, or accessible on a weekend trip.
So I agree with your DH to stay put.

Some very good points, thanks everyone. I need to think about the commute time more seriously in the long term.

Commuter here!

• No Kids
• Outside M25 Home

Stay in your £70k job! London is fab when the trains work, but AWFUL when they don’t & you’re stuck. I’m lucky because the tubes go close enough to where i can get a lift in an emergency, but I often think how tough (and tiring) it would all be if I had a child.
£30k more sounds a lot but it’s not. Once the tax man has taken his share, and 5% pension is gone it’s about £16.5k extra.
£150 commuting costs x3 per day across a 48 week year is £21.5k. Season tickets are usually only cheaper if you go in 4+ days per week.
Once you get to £100k, you’ll lose childcare benefits & tax free savings allowances, and your personal allowance will be cut back. You need to get to about £150k to break even and start being better off again.

I’m not trying to discourage ambition, but I think you’ll make yourself financially poorer, and time poorer, unless you move closer to London,