My employer said I now have to go permanent

[user1471867483]

I have been working for a not-for-profit organisation for the last 10 years on their 'internal agency' for them to save money on high street agencies. They're making cuts now and I now have to become permanent or I go with 4 weeks notice. I love being temporary. I wasn't even looking for any other work as I'd assumed I could carry on working forever like this! I will also have to change my working hours working two hours later in the afternoon and starting two hours later. It will mean I'll have to come home in the dark now. They want my answer Monday. If I'd known a few months ago, I'd have applied for temp work elsewhere, but applying/looking takes time. What do I do? Temping suits me to a tee. We have a new director now who's decided to shake things up a little in our dept. TIA.

Your company have been breaking the law. New director is rectifying that.
Why would you think a temporary position would be forever? That is the opposite of temporary.
Anyway you have 2 options, take the offer or look for another job.

But she is not on a temporary contract just because her employer claims that she is.

She is 10 years in and is controled by a manager. Her employment (contract) and pay method ticks almost all the tests of being an employee not a supply of service on a self employed basis. So can the employer prove she is being paid a self-empolyed rate over and above other employees?

The only rebuttle they have is that she is allowed pick and choose her holidays and they dont pay for days off.

So are you basically on a zero hours contract?

Do you get paid holidays?

Is it an NHS bank role?

I think they probably have to make you permanent after all this time?

Also seems really odd that you are paying into a pension but aren’t a permanent employee.

Doesn’t sound fair on your colleagues that you have this set up where they have to fight for Christmas leave but you are exempt.

I think it’s the OP that’s claiming she’s in a temporary contract, her employer is trying to formalise her permanent status.

It will mean I'll have to come home in the dark now

Welcome to the real grown-up working world 🤷🏼‍♀️

ACAS says this about workers as opposed to employees. The op is possibly a worker. The organisation might well seek to regularise this arrangement because it is to the detriment of other employees who appear to be on worse terms.

You’ve had it your own way (illegally as it turns out) for way too long

The other employees must bloody hate working with you. Choosing your own hours, refuse to work over Christmas etc and just decide unilaterally to take holiday when you feel like it.

Yes this is what’s confused me!!! If live been there for ten years you’ve jsut not had the benefits of being permanent. What does employment status have to do with working hours?

Exactly what I'll do.

Yes!

OP It's worth looking into the legal situation and seeing if they have been breaking the law. If so, you can get all your holiday pay, and any other benefits they ought to have paid, backdated for the years they should have been paying it. That could well be enough to let you leave now and look for a job that suits you better (or just a tidy sum to put away form your pension etc.)

Sounds like a case of all good things must come to an end. You've had it very good for a very long time. Sadly that isn't beneficial to the business.

You are not temporary if you’ve been there 10 years.

Yes and no

Her employer is not just documenting the current contract but rather her employer is also trying to change the contract (existing unwritten elements) to be something different.

Sounds like the new manager is a better manager than the previous one and trying to make things more legal employment wise. You don't sound like a team player as you do the hours you choose and refuse to cover Christmas for ten years.

Contact ACAS and try all the Union's as the NHS relies on bank staff on zero hours staff and so many people will be forced into permanent jobs they don’t want.
I don’t think they can do this to you, but you need to check with the likes of Unison and the Nursing Unions

@redfishcat There s a category called a “worker”. As I posted below. ACAS lists the differences between employee and worker. The employer can change the contract of an employee by agreement but in this case, if termed a “worker” there’s a number of things they are not protected from - unfair dismissal being one. So the employer can ask the op to change to the same status as everyone else and doesn’t continue to get perks others don’t get. That’s fair to everyone.

in that case you are super lucky you have never been let go during times of cut backs.

and as to the pension question, i was on nhs bank and it is an automatic join to the pension

i was on nhs bank for many years and after 2 years in one position they twisted my arm to get a contract,
i did enjoy the flexibility prior to this
i am sure you will work something out
can you chose how many hours you do at least?

I would stay in the role permanently to ensure my bills are paid, but start applying for roles where the hours suit you better. If you leave you may end up unemployed for longer than you'd like or can afford.

@TizerorFizzthere will be a Bank Staff Team in each NHS trust who actively recruit and support people who work on a zero hours contract. They will be able to advise the OP
In my Trust there are people who worked like this for at least ten years and all ward teams have a few bank regulars who they call on when permanent staff are ill, on Mat Leave, on holidays and have done the same job for years. No one would ever expect them to work Christmas or New Year, but some do for the enhanced pay

OP, talk to your staff bank team, talk to the union reps as this has massive implications for a lot of staff in your Trust

I don't really understand what arrangement you have actually had here but it seems unusual and I can see why they want to do things properly. I agree about putting in a flexible working request to remain on your hours but it isn't going to solve the holidays issue. I empathise as I have a super flexible job and can pretty much take holiday whenever and work what hours I want but I don't think there are many jobs like that but why not take the job and see how it goes and start looking for something else if it doesn't work for you. Seems silly to complain about them only giving you 4 weeks notice as that is the temp terms

Thank you. Yes, I spoke to the team lead in my temp staffing office and he strongly advised me to take it (permanently) as he said he knows 20 people who didn't take their jobs permanently and now they're struggling, he said.