Anyone else lost a bit of ambition now they’ve been taxed to the brink?

[Peasontoastt]

I used to be extremely ambitious and was really eager to reach some sort of financial security. As a consequence, I’m in what’s considered a highly paid career, I work hard and it took me many years to train.

Just as I paid off my student loan (which took many years), I then had a baby and returned to work to be stuck with the childcare dilemma. I struggled through that phase and have come out the other side but being taxed so much, no child benefit, still paying for nursery even though dd has ‘free’ hours now. It’s likely that savings are going to be bashed next, so what’s the point in even putting anything aside when there’s likely going to be a 4K cap on ISAs.

I used to feel so ambitious and of course I know money isn’t everything, not by a long shot. But having worked my way up the ladder and with huge responsibilities only to feel penalised financially for doing so…what is the point? Yes I have more financial security than someone claiming benefits but equally, I am not being flippant when I say a few years of resting and being at home and being frugal is starting to seem so much more attractive. Has anyone else started feeling this way? I feel taken the piss out of by every financial angle!

If the extra money is going into a pension, then it will most likely be taxed in the future - income tax works the same for pension income as earned income. So it’s more deferring the tax rather than avoiding it altogether. Plus the pension fund will be invested in stocks and shares, and thus contributing to the economy.

Lower earners pay a lot more tax in Scandinavian countries - there's no personal allowance so all income is taxed. Someone on 20k a year in Denmark would pay over £5000 in tax compared to about £2000 in the UK (income tax & national insurance).

Only on MN would someone say that a person earning over 100k a year therefore paying loads of tax, yet paying into a pension to avoid yet more tax, is the same as a benefits layabout who’s never worked a day in their life and literally thinks ‘benefits benefits benefits’ !

OP, I totally agree with you. The amount of tax taken once someone earns over 50k is a piss take. It’s a piss take that so many people are on benefits in this country. And it’s even more of a piss take that said benefits claimants don’t appreciate tax payers and think they should feel privileged to pay lots of tax!

The pension attack is an odd one I agree, how are those the same? You can see why we’re heading for increasing taxes.

As long as they don;t expected other taxpayers to subsidise their reduced working, now or in the future.

Whilst I mostly agree, the pension fund won't benefit the UK economy if invested in overseas assets/investments! Perhaps we do need to bring in rules/incentives to encourage pension funds to invest in the UK.

Re part timers, we could think of radical changes, such as making the thresholds pro-rata. I.e. if someone only works "half" a normal working week, their starting point for paying tax/nic is half the £12,570 threshold! Not advocating that as a solution, but it does seem the politicians/Treasury have very little imagination and have run out of ideas, so keep trotting out the same kind of changes.

Look at the press releases and statue when the removed interest relief from let properties - talking about the removal of MIRAS relief as if it were yesterday rather than nearly 30 years ago! Clearly just took the file off the shelf that had been drafted decades ago, and enacted it. It's probably been "offered" to successive Chancellors by the Treasury ministers for years but always rejected until a few years' ago.

It wouldn't suprise me if the WFA removal was the same - planned by someone in the Treasury years ago and just dusted off the shelf last year and enacted without any kind of proper thought nor due diligence, hence the U turn being needed!

Agreed

If your personal allowance were to be tapered based on the number of days you work, then surely that’s a further incentive to anyone earning over £100k to work PT? Because your marginal tax rate of 60% for losing your personal allowance would cover a smaller chunk of your income once your personal allowance had been reduced due to your PT hours.

Slavish acceptance of what HMRC tells you isn’t a great look either.

It’s sensible to keep an eye on your tax code.

Can I ask where you moved to please? Thanks

What’s an ordinary job? I suspect the way things are going, many jobs will be performed by robots and AI. It’s about educating kids to take on skilled and better paid professions. Not everyone can be a company director, but we shouldn’t be churning out kids to work in supermarkets. We should have higher educational expectations and this needs funding by all tax payers.

Well said.

It's not just about hard work now, it's about historical hard work, making choices for the long term rather than the short term. Many of my school mates were too busy getting pissed to put much effort in, I did 4 hours + school work every school night to get the grades needed to progress, I am only averagely smart but got all A's at gcse's and A levels through sheer slog. When others were buying fancy new build flats in trendies areas, I bought a do'er upper in a non trendy area and through working my way up the housing ladder DH and I now own a million pound home despite both only earning roughly national average salaries (nhs and council), despite both having a disability.

No one denies thats lots of people work hard for low salaries, but what choices did they make further back, did they study really hard, did they go without in their early days, make smart choices. Keep getting up and trying again when knocked back.

Being financially stable is part hard work, part smart choices/determination a bit of luck in terms of how academically able/talented someone is.

I know so many people who had really tough starts in life, loads of knock backs and through sheer slog and determination have become extremely sucessful, which maybe skews my views on what is luck and what is choice.

And I think (happy to be corrected if wrong) that if they work part time they are meant to be looking to increase their hours by getting other work. It is not the feather bed that some think it is, plus it all ends once dependants reach adult hood. We can't all be high flyers earning 6 figure salaries, that simply isn't economically possible or indeed achievable as we are not all equally gifted especially in the spheres that pay what I consider (but some MNs think is a substintence wage) high salaries.

I always told my kids if they didn't work hard at school they'd be stuck doing low paid jobs

how old are you @Bushmillsbabe?

I think it's pretty hard to get on the housing ladder these days & have financial security let alone a 1m house on average salaries these days. A lot of housing gains is due to luck & age as opposed to active decisions. My flat went up 200k in 2 yrs, I didn't do anything to make that happen.

But then there are people like me, no real talent or abilities, not especially intelligent, what should we do? I have worked hard but I was never any good at anything, hence always being on a relatively low wage. Passed all my exams, went to college, gained more qualifications while in work, but there is nothing special or outstanding about me, just an average person No matter how hard I worked, no matter what extra training I did I never rose above a certain salary. Divorce, single parenthood, illness and signifcant trauma (I have a diagnosis of CPTSD ) have also impacted on my working life too but does this mean I am a less worthwhile human.? I have had to fight and struggle too, sometimes just to survive and my home is only worth £150k but it is mine and I paid for it by juggling several jobs while bringing up my child alone with no support from their father. Just because someone is poor it does not mean it is their fault.

I overheard someone tell their kid the same, and they pointed at me like I was a warning of their future. I was a cleaner.
I tried my best at school but I have only even been able to do low paid jobs. We need people to do them.

To those of you saying that you can only do low paid jobs, you do realise don’t you that most jobs in the UK are low paid? Wages are deliberately kept low in the UK as a way to control the everyone.

The only way to earn more than 50k in the UK unless you work in investment banking is to start your own business or be self employed as a sole trader.

There are plenty of jobs earning over £50k without being an investment banker or being self-employed (!).

@MidnightPatrolnot in the area that I live in! I’ve actually heard some people in my area describe £20k as a good salary!

There are numerous careers that after progression you can earn more than £50k. Doctors after they progress and specialise. Careers in consulting etc. My DH is high up at Deloitte (after many years of hard work) and earns around £130k.

You just gotta work your way up.

My brother is a teacher and earns more than £50k. He doesn’t live in an affluent area.

@Boohoo76he must be a headteacher or very senior then as I don’t know any teachers earning 40k let alone over 50k