Trans toilets

[SharkBaitOooHaha]

I was under the impression that the supreme court ruling stating that to be considered a woman you had to have been born a biological woman, meaning…
Shop changing rooms had to be female/male same with toilets and all women only spaces.
I I live in a small village and trans people using my workplace’s toilets and changing rooms doesn’t really come up as an issue. Talking to my boss about this and he said he has had no instruction to change our current unisex toilet space or if it arises our changing rooms having to follow the new rule of.. If you’re a trans woman you need to go into the men’s changing rooms.
My question is, who is supposed to be making sure these rules are followed, how long have companies got to change their toilet facilities? Has anybody else who works in a job with fitting rooms noticed that there company doesn’t seem in a rush to change things? Until I brought this up at work my manager wasn’t even aware of the court ruling?

And where's all this handwringing been for women? With all this, 'well it's just too hard to keep entitled men out so we shouldn't bother!', what about the women who can't use mixed sex services including the women who self excluded from rape crisis services?

As long as the men don't get hurty feels, right?

I don't think that all men who want to 'become women' are predators - they just want to be accepted as women. Unfortunately for them, it causes problems in the loo department because we can't, as the pp said, allow the "nice" ones into women's spaces without also letting in the "nasty" ones. So I'm thankful that the law has been clarified and only biological women are allowed into women's spaces.

Some people seem to genuinely believe that women being recognised in law as a sex class seperate from men, is discrimination against men.

Wtf is wrong with people?
It’s so simple.
🧍‍♀️or 🧍‍♂️= biological sex only
👫 = anyone ( must be a lockable cubicle with a basin inside)
I imagine that trans people will continue to use the toilet of their imaginary sex so eventually all facilities will be👫
So no more validation but a much higher cleaning bill I would imagine. Yuk!

The vast majority of transwomen, like the vast majority of the general public are law abiding and although they might not start using the men’s they will look out for places with unisex toilets, there are lots around, anyone who does break the law is putting themselves in the dangerous position of being accused of doing something like voyerism or worse in the women’s toilets.

This is the point I'm making though - I'm not objecting to the need for single sex spaces. I'm saying that when we have debates about this, we shouldn't make sweeping statements about trans people. Such as saying 'all trans women want to use female spaces' when they don't. Legislation needs to be clear, yes of course. But the statements about all trans women wanting to access female only spaces are divisive and unnecessary.

"Why do you want to treat people with a trans identity as a sacred caste?"

I don't, any more so than I generally don't assume all black people, or all disabled people or all women think or feel the same way. The language around this matters and when people make these statements it makes an already emotive debate even more heated and I don't think that benefits anyone.

But we're not, we're only talking about the trans people (of whom there are many) who do breach those boundaries. We shouldn't have to "Not All Men" it every single time because, of course, it doesn't apply to the transpeople who don't use the wrong spaces for their sex. We have no issue with them.

While not all men who identify as women want to use female single sex spaces, the ones that do are very aggressive, threatening, loud and influential. These are exactly the kind of men that women do not want in their changing rooms, hospital wards, refuges and so on. When Stonewall began pretending that these men had a legal right to coerce women into sharing spaces and were enabled by employers and the state, they started a war on women that has ultimately ended in a Supreme Court judgement in order to clarify what the law has always been. Some people want to continue to want to defy and break the law. That is up to them, but women will now have the confidence to report those people, which is as it should be.

But businesses that do this are absolutely risking being sued in the interim if they turn a blind eye to trans identifying men using women’s single sex spaces. I find it WILD that they are willing to risk it when the law is so clear cut.

As I understand it, pending the full guidelines, the judgement means that only biological women can use spaces that are designated and signed as being for women only. Some settings might, therefore, find it easier to get rid of or suspend single sex toilets/changing rooms altogether if they don't yet have unisex alternatives. I've already seen this once recently - somewhere that used to have separate toilets now only has unisex and has signs on them saying 'cubicles' or 'urinals'. I imagine they will eventually provide male, female and gender-neutral.

Businesses that do this risk a claim for indirect sex discrimination against women because the men can use any toilet but women can't use urinals and therefore have less provision.

They also can't start ripping out the urinals and replacing with all mixed sex cubicles or fully enclosed unisex toilets because that would constitute building work and would not meet the requirements of Approved Document T:

The objective of this requirement is to require toilet accommodation in non-residential buildings to be separate single-sex toilets, with single-sex shared or individual hand-washing facilities. Universal toilets can be provided in addition to single-sex provision and where space allows. Where there is not sufficient space to provide single-sex toilets, fully enclosed universal toilets should be provided.

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/67167c02d100972c0f4c9b38/ADT_2024.pdf

As I understand it, pending the full guidelines, the judgement means that only biological women can use spaces that are designated and signed as being for women only.

When the statutory code comes into force it will say the same because what the judgment says is the law. If the code and the law conflict in any way you go with the law.

Businesses just need to get on with it now.