To refuse even to consider applying for a place in the local faith school for DS

[madamez]

Yes, some of his friends from playgroup and nursery are going to go there. Yes, it's within walking distance of where we live. Yes, apparently it's a nice school with an inclusive admissions policy and a good reputation.
But it's a faith school and I do not approve of faith schools and I don't want DS to be force-fed crap or to feel separate from other children on the grounds of other people's superstitious bullshit. There are plenty of other schools, so why are people saying I should send him to this one?

Warning - Warning - my children go to a 'community school'... you know, non-demoninational

the amount of religious crap they come home with astounds me .. it so much depends on the head and the other parents ... oh and I think there's a law regarding 1 religious assembly a year meaning that my atheistic (although kids are natural believers, so not really), zeus-believing children ended up being in a farkin' nativity

I don't think YABU ...some of the comments can be excruciating to atheistic ears ... and there is only so much "some people believe abc... it's up to you to make up your mind, mummy believes xyz " conversations one can have with a straight face

YANBU but we are atheists and will send dd to our nearby C of E school as long as they accepts our beliefs. How likely is it that they would turn her down because we are atheists? It's certainly not something I would attempt to conceal in any way. I went to a church school myself, however, so I'm not very bothered about it and my main interest is that it is in walking distance.

Any other atheists with kids at church schools? Any problems?

Thank you MadameZ for not taking the place from a child whose parents want all that.

Sincerely. I wish their were more like you, but I can't blame the parents who suddenly find God and suddenly start going to church when their child is about two, when they realise what's ahead of them.. They just want to get their child into a good school. NOt judging that at all, but I have extra admiration for you for standing up to that iyswim. Probably because I struggled to get my dc into a c of E school, despite being c of E.

Twiglett there is a law saying a daily act of worship. Non denominational means is that it is not affiliated to one religion.

Hmmmm Twiglet. I think this is something dh need to really think about more carefully. We haven't really thought it through as yet.

absolutely no way on earth is there a requirement for a daily act of worship ... no way!

don't understand what difference non-demoninational means .. a religious act of worship is an act of worship whether c of e, catholic, muslim or wicken

I think there is a legal requirement for a daily act of worship actually. It doesnt have to be christian. personally I hate it and think it's a farce.

farkin' ell you're right aren't you? .. daily act .. by the power of greyskull

When I do it with the kids I never bring religion in to it and call it a moment of reflection and base it on what's happening in teh world or respect to each other and that type of thing.

sorry Abbey .. ignore my first post .. patently am over-tired from weekend

have to say that RELIGION should be driven out of STATE SCHOOLS IMHO

I have printed this before, people fail to understand that all state schools have to provide collective worship every day. RE is the only subject that has to be taught by law.

'All maintained schools must provide daily collective worship for all registered pupils (apart from those who have been withdrawn from this by their parents). This is may be provided within daily assembly but the distinction should be made clear.

The head teacher is responsible for arranging the daily collective worship after consulting with the governing body. Daily collective worship must be wholly or mainly of a broadly Christian character. The precise nature will depend on the family background, ages and abilities of the pupils. It is acceptable for schools to split the collective worship sessions over the school year to be 51% Christian and 49% other faiths or interests.

Most schools should be able to include all pupils in their act of collective worship. There may be exceptional cases, however, where, in view of the family background of some or all pupils, the head teacher and governing body feel that a broadly Christian act of worship is not suitable. In these circumstances, the head teacher can apply to the local Standing Advisory Council on Religious Education (SACRE) to have the Christian content requirement lifted. Before doing so, the governing body should consult the parents of pupils at the school. Collective worship can take place at any time in the school day and the whole school does not need to get together at the same time. Collective worship can be organised into form groups or year groups or whatever is appropriate for the school. It cannot be organised in faith groups unless a determination has been sought and granted by the local SACRE.'

Non denominational means not one particular religion it doesn't mean no religion.

Yes 1944 education act & revised in 1988. There should be provision of a daily act of worship for all pupils (but not necessarily at the same time).

In County schools this must not be distinctive of a particular denomination, but should be "wholly or mainly of a broadly Christian character" for most of the time.

Schools may seek formal exemption from this requirement in favour of an alternative form of worship for the whole school or for a particular group of pupils.

have already apologised Abbey .. must admit I was under the mistaken impression when DS first started at school that a 'community' school meant no religion ... silly me eh!

Religion will only go from state schools when we have disestablishmentarianism (hope I have spelt it correctly!)While Cof E is the state religion and the Queen is Head of state and the church, state schools will have the state religion. If you don't like it you have to join the society for secular Britain and push for change. Schools do break the law or get around it but they can get into trouble.

Sorry Tiglett. I had posted before I saw your apology-it all moves quickly! It is worth saying because people don't understand that they don't escape religion by going to a non faith school.

Haven't had time to read the whole thread. But just wanted to say that most schools teach religion and will hold christian worship - many faith schools do little more than this. You might want to look into how much 'faith' is involved. Many faith primaries are only faith schools in name nowadays.

More important than the faith aspect, which your child will take or leave based mainly on your views anyway, is whether the school is the best place for your DS in terms of friendships, education and development, and whether the place feels 'right' for you as a family. If you opt for a school further away from home bear in mind that your DS's friends will also mainly be further away and he might not be as 'involved' in after school stuff as he gets older, plus you will need to travel further.

OTOH, I also don't approve of faith schools and am writing my Masters dissertation on them, which has made me dislike some of them even more than previous. BUT there are much worse evils in education than faith schools unfortunately.

IME kids end up holding pretty much the views of their parents on religion until about the age of 13, when they obviously hold the complete opposite view

My preferred option to avoid the problems of school was to move to a private island, but the costs involved were prohibitive, and I couldn't find a tropical island that didn't have bugs.

This parenting lark is no fun at all.

No of course you're not being unreasonable. It would be unreasonable (and hypocritical) to send your child to a faith school when you are clearly very strongly anti-organised religion. I don't know why so many people do.

I am very keen for DS to attend a school with a Christian ethos, but I am happy to pay for the privilege, rather than take my chances with the competition for places at a CofE school which most other people are trying to get their kids into because of the exam results.

Anyone who claims to be an atheist but buys their children Christmas presents is a hypocrite

ANotherfatty: depends if you call them Xmas presents, solstice presents or midwinter presents. really.

But I really must look into campaiging against a 'daily act of talking to someone else's imaginary friend' as it is complteley fucking ludicrous for this to be enforced.

ahhh you must be talking about Christmas the over-commercialised festivities involving tinsel and spending power then

or maybe you're thinking of Yule - you konw the Pagan winter festival when Yule logs were lit to honor Thor, the god of thunder, with the belief that each spark from the fire represented a new pig or calf that would be born during the coming year.

so we're talking about not giving presents on the date chosen to violently supplant all the indigineous midwinter festivities of countries

uh ok then

LOL Twig....

fatty you really have one on you today about this topic. It's just opinions you know....those like athiests should just accept from christians.....

Fatty - atheists are no more hypocritical to buy Christmas presents than Christians are to deck the halls with boughs of holly, because that is the pagan way to celebrate the winter solstice.