Cleaner who works 6 hours per week preferring cash in hand weekly - holiday pay? Is this a thing?

[Catwhispereroo]

Hi, we have a cleaning lady who is generally lovely. She comes for 6 hours per week, £20 per hour, so £120 per week. She always prefers cash in hand weekly.

Today she asked if we will pay her 4 weeks holiday pay as, according to her, 'everyone else does.'

I had a think about it, but have had to tell her this is not possible. I feel bad though. AIBU?

My reasoning is -

1. A cleaner is already quite a luxury, as I'm no longer working.

2. We have had lots of cleaners over the years and all preferred cash and none ever asked for holiday pay for cash in hand work.

3. I don't want the hassle of a contract setting out holiday pay or sickness pay (will that be next)? We are a just a private household, not a company.

4. I will give her a few weeks pay as a Xmas bonus anyway.

5. She seems to go abroad for a month each year. If we gave her 4 weeks pay, that would be almost £500. Then, if I got a replacement cleaner in for those weeks, that would be another £500!

6. When we go away I'm happy for her to come as usual (even though we don't really need this) so that she doesn't lose out financially. But I can't pay 4 weeks holiday as week.

Again, AIBU? Thanks!

It’s not but seriously, how many people actually declare it? I thought my cleaner was thoroughly trustworthy till I found it out.

I do give my cleaner holiday pay. I feel bad, it’s not his fault I’ve decided to go away. He needs a living and consistent income as much as the next person.

Can I ask why you gave her £240 for Christmas? Isn’t that excessive for a cleaner you’ve known 6 months? I’d love to know how much you spend on friends and family! Although maybe I’m tight.

She was a CF. Likely raking it in from not paying tax and claiming, I wonder why her other clients pay it? Are they just ridiculously wealthy?

I wonder who many other clients she is getting 4 weeks holiday pay from. She’s probably earnt half a years wages for going on holiday if they are all paying up!

I've declared payments in cash. Although I'm not a cleaner

I get my nails done every three weeks. Do I need to pay her holiday pay too?

2 weeks extra at Xmas seems to be the going rate. It's not compulsory, but I just did. Maybe it was too much. It's hard to know.

Yep. We used to have cleaners (and I was not working... but I can't clean to save my life, and I hate it). We left the cash on a table for them. They were not self employed, but were employed by a cleaning company.

I don’t think they are saying it’s illegal to pay cash in hand. They are saying if she’s getting cash in hand, most likely isn’t declaring all her income to HMRC.

I get my cleaner to come in and clean when I’m away but I don’t pay if she goes away.

You live in London. Rules for domestic cleaners are very different there as you don't seem to struggle to get people to clean in London. The rest of the country is quite different from that.

£20 ph when the customer supplies everything is a very good rate to earn when cleaning in London.

Self employed domestic cleaner here. Firstly NEVER pay cash hand. You are complicit in her avoiding paying tax and class 2 National insurance. Theoretically HMRC could come after you for her unpaid tax. Always have a paper trail. I have never been paid holiday pay. She is taking you for a sucker. 6 hours is a crazy amount of hours anyway. I would clean a large house with several bathrooms and bedrooms, change beds and do the ironing in that time. She isn't lovely. I appreciate you may like to keep her but gently reign this in.

Wow. You change the beds and ironing in 6 hours? I never asked this lady to do anything with laundry, or ironing or beds. She would vacuum and mop and light dusting basically.

It's all subjective. "The ironing" is not quantifiable amount of ironing, but even without it, I'd struggle to do that much cleaning in six hours at my age...I might be able to if and only if the house wasn't too bad to begin with.

Been weighing up this dilemma myself, although from the other way round. My cleaner is from a family run business and I’ve been told you only pay for the hours done. She’s booked for 3 hours a week and I pay her for those even if she finishes early because the house is not messy and/or one of the kids is ill so she can’t do their room. My feeling being we have that slot and she has pitched up, she gets full pay whether she does two hours or three.

So, this means she does not get paid when we are on holiday, which I didn’t appreciate when we ‘contracted’ with the cleaning co. It doesn’t sit right with us.[Also, I am funny about giving anyone outside the family and a trusted neighbour a key to access the house in our absence, so won’t have her come then.] DH and I had already decided we would give her a week’s pay for the two weeks when we are away. A summer bonus if you like, because she is losing 2 weeks pay. I have given plenty of notice so she can’t pick up other one-off jobs if they’re offered, but on the assumption that we have those hours and are asking her not to come in, we’ll pay her half pay.

I know it goes against the advice here, and maybe I’d feel differently if she’d asked. If I’d employed her direct, I am anal enough to have clarified holiday/sick pay at the point of contracting. If she is on holiday, the family send an alternate cleaner, so we pay the ‘company’ anyway and they pay the person who comes in her place so actual holiday is dealt with by them.

I’ve never had a cleaner but, no, there is no way I’d pay that.

It sounds like she knows her worth which is great but she seems to know that not everyone will think she’s worth an extra £500 for no work.

If you are hiring a company, one of the reasons for doing so is because they "manage" the staff for you. Unless you are paying the cleaner directly (which would be unusual when hiring a company, as that's what you'd do if you booked a cleaner through an agency), when you pay for the cleaning slot you don't need due to your holiday, you are actually paying the company not the cleaner, and there's no knowing that the cleaner benefits from it.

A "proper" cleaning company should be one step ahead of the curve anyway, and managing the number of clients booked in vs. staff available, bearing in mind that staff "sickness" can be rife in this industry, so a cancellation can often be welcome.

It's not illegal to be asked to be paid in cash. However she should declare her income however it is paid to HMRC.

Other way around OP paid her cleaner to come in whilst she was away. Cleaner wanted to be paid when she wasn't cleaning as cleaner was away on holiday and OP at home

Self employed cleaner here.

I charge £20ph, that's fine. I supply all my own products with that and work effing hard.
Requesting holiday pay? CF. I personally would find a new cleaner, she has seen you as an easy target. If she is a good reliable cleaner she will have no problem with finding a new gig 😉

what a cheek! That's a good rate, and I can't imagine she pays tax on it. You're well rid.

It’s completely up to the cleaner to be honest and declare her earnings.

She’s trying it on. Mine asked too and I told her I don’t pay my hairdresser when I’m away and miss a cut so why would I pay her?

If "everyone" is paying her holiday pay, then she must be raking it in.

Completely agree! I do the same, charge between £15-£20 and hour ( depending on the job) bring our own products etc. Work bloody hard but certainly don't expect holiday or sickness pay! That includes if the clients are away or unwell. It's called being self employed.